Scorpion FS build

[wojtek]

hi,

finally i got my scorpion and now working to install battery boxes. The idea was to put them as much in front of the trike as possible. However it is quite not that simple. I am thinking to put one set of batteries beneath the front boom - i will prob get those turnigy long packs [30cms long] as i have around 44cm available there. the other box will go under the frame in central part of the frame.


The controller will probably go underneath the front seat. i am however tempted to use falco wireless kit - it would make this build super clean!

Re the mounts i found this nice little thing:
http://www.fish4parts.co.uk/Plumbing.81/Pipe-Clamps-%25252F-Clips.10930243/Fast-Fix-Pipe-Clip-Rubber-Lined-54-x-M8.101335.html
Rubber lined pipe clamp. They are great as fully covered with rubber protecting the frame against scratches and also with welded heavy duty nuts...

So im hoping 3 of those are enough to hold a box with 5 x 22v5000ah batteries. Those clamps look quite massive. Later on i will drill 3 holes in the box and screw the into the clamps. It will give me 9cm clearance off the ground... hmm not much.
The bottom side of handlebars are 13cm off the ground.

I had to put one clamp further back as there was no space to quick release in order to fold the trike.





actually i could probably fit all batteries to the front boom!!! it will look silly yes, but great for handling and cornering!!!


alternatively i could also put few long and thin turnigy packs under the seat.
Unfortunately i touch the box with my legs when put under the seat in front...

 

[chroot]

Your trike looks sweet, I like the case and is it able run 4p of the LiPo inside the case?

Please give me a pointer where can I get these case and I always wanted have case relocation from rear to bike's frame act like balance.

 

[wojtek]

thanks

I got the boxes from Mouser Electronics. The manufacturer is Hammond and this particular box's specification is right here:
http://www.hammondmfg.com/pdf/1550WJ.pdf

These are Diecast Aluminum, Light Duty Watertight.

The pics are here: http://www.hammondmfg.com/1550Wptbl.htm [at the very bottom]

Let me know if you have any further questions

 

[wojtek]

actually there should be a space for 5 x 22.2v5ah packs!!!

 

[docnjoj]

That is a gorgeous trike, Wojtek. I kept my 36 volt 20 ah Split Ping under my seat and made a Lexan case for it. Not pretty but you want your center of mass as central as possible so as not to affect handling as much. Also my Steini needs the ground clearance as it uses most of its suspension travel on drainage ditches. I keep 5-6" under the seat just below the batteries. What are U using for power. Astroflight IIRC?
otherDoc

Edit: My battery case also fits my 54 volt 6 Fatpack battery but I really don't need that kind of speed anymore. I will probably re-convert to 12 AH @36 volts like it was originally.

 

[wojtek]

That is a gorgeous trike, Wojtek. I kept my 36 volt 20 ah Split Ping under my seat and made a Lexan case for it. Not pretty but you want your center of mass as central as possible so as not to affect handling as much. Also my Steini needs the ground clearance as it uses most of its suspension travel on drainage ditches. I keep 5-6" under the seat just below the batteries. What are U using for power. Astroflight IIRC?
otherDoc

Edit: My battery case also fits my 54 volt 6 Fatpack battery but I really don't need that kind of speed anymore. I will probably re-convert to 12 AH @36 volts like it was originally.

hi
how does one make a battery box out of lexan? can you just buy lexan and somehow cut to size and glue / put it together?

This is just unplanned project - i will use a hub motor - not sure which one yet, BMC [too "delicate" for off-road use?] or Falco [russian rulette as nobody tested it yet] or new Crystalyte HT [too heavy?] . As said, Kamil from velokraft will make one for me with Matt's heavy duty astro 3220 drive one day this year. but he seems to be extremely overloaded with other projects as i have not heard from him for a while. This scorpion fs just came unexpected - found a good price for a second hand one so just got it. I might as well sell it as soon as VK is ready.. or keep it as an foldable off road option.

I also got a second hand Velomobile Allewender FAW [looks not great but in perfect working order for CHEAP!] - this one will definitely get Crystalyte HT or HS. I will open a new thread on this soon.

 

[chroot]

Thanks for the links, perfect for me build a 99.6v 25Ah 8)

 

[ebent]

Nice find Wojtek! That will be a fun ride. I ride a catrike pocket trike and I put the boxes on the chain stay. I mounted them to be a 1/4" above the lowet point on the deraulier. My CG is better than new as I've added weight to a lower point. I built the boxes using starboard. It is a poly something. Very strong. Black and white available in various thicknesses. Won't glue, paint or sand but tools, cuts, and with the proper bores will hold a screw. It will not break. Used a lot in the marine industry. The boxes that you showed might be better. Overall the boxes you showed will probably be lighter and smaller due to the thickness of the material. If they fit on the boom it may be the best spot. I think your chain stays are moving due to the suspension. If so I guess that means a no go for batteries.

A potential for the controler is under the rear rack with zip ties.

Good luck

 

[docnjoj]

hi
how does one make a battery box out of lexan? can you just buy lexan and somehow cut to size and glue / put it together?

Kinda like this. I will eventually spray it orange, or not!
otherDoc

I have been coveting the tilting FS trike but at 7000 USD I guess I'll wait a while.

 

[wojtek]

i might use this acrylic sheets to create a custom box for the underneath the seat space so that my legs wont touch it...
http://www.plexiglas.com/

Actually this is quite cool website! http://www.plexiglas-shop.com/DE/en/category.htm

You can order cut to size! and plenty of choice! Worldwide shipping
I might try it out. If i love doing it, i will start offering custom boxes to ES members

 

[wojtek]

OK just got back from holidays

i am now looking for tyres. As i am planning to use this trike off-road, im thinking to get maxxis snyper tyres:
http://www.maxxis.com/Bicycle/BMX/Snyper.aspx

 

[wojtek]

fixing HS on the rear dropouts - i have some doubts if they are up for the job though... what do you guys think?

 

[docnjoj]

That trike is alloy so torque arms are really necessary, wojtek! That is a powerful motor and probably will spin in the drops if not secured to some steel! JMHO but I use a torque arm on my Steini and it has steel dropouts. Better safe than spun out!
otherDoc

 

[wojtek]

That trike is alloy so torque arms are really necessary, wojtek! That is a powerful motor and probably will spin in the drops if not secured to some steel! JMHO but I use a torque arm on my Steini and it has steel dropouts. Better safe than spun out!
otherDoc

thanks, how about 2 torque arms?

 

[docnjoj]

Definitely twice as good as 1! My wife has 2 on her front wheel even though it is steel. All that gorgeous alloy on the Scorpion, you may have to custom make them to fit right and not damage anything. There are a few folks using John in CR's method. Very strong! Check it out!
otherDoc

 

[docnjoj]

Those fork ends look bolted on (at least the derailleur side does). Have U checked them with a magnet? Could they be steel? If not it may be easier to duplicate them in 4-5 mm steel but make them full circle with a clamp bolt. It still looks like U would have enough thread on the axle to put a bolt and thin lockwasher.
otherDoc

 

[wojtek]

Those fork ends look bolted on (at least the derailleur side does). Have U checked them with a magnet? Could they be steel? If not it may be easier to duplicate them in 4-5 mm steel but make them full circle with a clamp bolt. It still looks like U would have enough thread on the axle to put a bolt and thin lockwasher.
otherDoc

just checked - all aluminum.
I have 4 different types of torque arms - must see which will be best.
Thanks for the tip- i will do some more reading - found also this: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26444&hilit=torque+arm

Getting little scared that people with steel dropouts are even trying to improve the torque arms!

 

[corkscrew]

A note on mounting the batteries on the forward boom. I've seen booms crack at the cruciform before, from regular use. It's a high stress area. I'd be worried that the weight of the batteries would increase the AL fatigue over time.

 

[wojtek]

A note on mounting the batteries on the forward boom. I've seen booms crack at the cruciform before, from regular use. It's a high stress area. I'd be worried that the weight of the batteries would increase the AL fatigue over time.

thanks actually i have decided to put them below the seat today. i would wish the weight go more in front of the trike but this is not easy to do. putting them under the seat will shift the weight of batteries to central/ back of the trike...

 

[ebent]

Based om my many trials and tribulations I'd bet your batteries under the seat will not only be acceptable but I think the CG will improve to better than your trike was pre motorized. In the wrong place it gets dangerous. I was an accident waiting to happen early on. The batteries are now in boxes mounted on the chain stays with the bottom about 3.25 inches clearance. Just a hair better than the derailer at the low point. Much further back than your set-up will be onder the seat. Based on that I think it will feel like a gocart. I believe the trick is to have the weight forward and below the rear axle. Naturely the geometry of each trike comes into play. Even the weight of the rider as an offset can make a difference. But under the seat should bring a grin with eccellent results.

 

[docnjoj]

I agree wholeheartedly with ebent. Center and low for battery weight made a huge difference in the handling of my trike. I have a very strong rear rack (welded steel from those same Serbian craftsmen) and it is built to handle 50 kilos of pack weight. Naturally it was the easiest place to mount batteries at first, but I had the sense (and ability back then) to test ride the trike without the motor and batts first. WhenI put them on the handling really got bad! I finally made the Lexan rack under the seat and like ebent said, Go-cart like response! really the only way to go for a tadpole trike, suspension or not!
otherDoc

 

[wojtek]

ok with burned fingers, the 2 battery boxes are soldered and wired!
the weight of this box with 5x zippy 20c excludes wiring [picture taken yesterday]

so i will have 2x 4.6kg on both sides of the trike. that is close to 10kg incl wires, cushioning ect... quite a bit for an alu frame. I am planning to use some screws and bolts available on the trike. More pics later this week

 

[docnjoj]

Nice looking boxes! I can't wait to see them mounted. My split Ping weighs close to 10 kilos with the lexan holder. If it is low and centered you simply dont notice the weight.
otherDoc

 

[wojtek]

Nice looking boxes! I can't wait to see them mounted. My split Ping weighs close to 10 kilos with the lexan holder. If it is low and centered you simply dont notice the weight.
otherDoc

uff a lot of work.. almost done, but i have high demands about my battery boxes mount and wiring to make it as flexible as possible. I hope you guys will be impressed with some of my ideas

 

[docnjoj]

Ready and waiting for pics!
otherDoc