Steve Jobs

[neptronix]

I don't agree about best in category at all.

I prefer my dell and sony stuff... after having tried the apple thing a few times just for kicks.
Let's not get into MAC VS PC please.

Just a personal preference and i don't agree with you here.

 

[ptd]

You know... Apple didn't invent the personal computer.. right? :lol:

no, they didn't invent it, they were just the ones that got it into the hands of the masses.

 

[neptronix]

You've obviously not heard of IBM, radio shack, tandy, atari, amiga, commodore, Amstrad, Altair, TI, Sinclair, Acorn etc..

Apple did not revolutionize computing. They had a pretty good platform in the 1970's, but were, and have been small players this entire time.

They are just starting to really catch up with the PC platform these days. It took a long time, a switch to intel/x86 chips around the mid 2000's and many shitty versions of Windows for that to happen.

 

[GCinDC]

[youtube]_5Z7eal4uXI[/youtube]
[youtube]lK_HThS8DZo[/youtube]

 

[ambroseliao]

Apple did not revolutionize computing. They had a pretty good platform in the 1970's, but were, and have been small players this entire time.

They are just starting to really catch up with the PC platform these days. It took a long time, a switch to intel/x86 chips around the mid 2000's and many shitty versions of Windows for that to happen.

So Apple had nothing to do with their success. It was shitty Windows?!?!?!

Apple has been either the most or second most valuable company in terms of market cap in the world recently of over $300 billion dollars. Much more than Microsoft's at around $200 billion.

 

[heathyoung]

Steve summed it up best with the phrase - "Sell the sizzle, not the steak"

Immature product, questionable hardware, strong aesthetics, marketed well at gullible idiots with money.

 

[neptronix]

Yes actually, it was the compatibility With windows, the price drop resulting from the intel switch, and the better ( faster, more efficient ) processors overall that kicked Apple into high drive in mid 2000.

People could switch to the Mac platform because they knew they could run boot camp, vmware, parallels etc to run their windows software. That opened up a HUGE door for Apple. When i was working at an Apple store around that time, people started switching like crazy. A good part of the sales process was explaining how the Windows compatibility worked for at least a year or two. It had been written into our sales manuals and was a primary focus.

Like i mentioned the other factor... a lot of people were frustrated with security on windows XP. Viruses for XP were a dime a dozen because the operating system had been around for so damn long. Then Vista came out which was a pile of turd. That's almost 10 years of consecutive frustration from windows users all bottled up and then when Apple gave them an easy way out, they started kicking Microsoft's ass year by year.

You forget where Apple makes a lot of their money: iPhone, iPod, and the iPad have been gold mines for them. For a long time there was no competition for the iPhone and the iPod dominated the MP3 player market for a long time.

Apple has never dominated the desktop, has been a small player for a long time ( outside the educational sector, which they have periodically been hot in ), and will continue to do so as long as they run the company the way they do.

 

[ambroseliao]

People could switch to the Mac platform because they knew they could run boot camp, vmware, parallels etc to run their windows software. That opened up a HUGE door for Apple. When i was working at an Apple store around that time, people started switching like crazy. A good part of the sales process was explaining how the Windows compatibility worked for at least a year or two. It had been written into our sales manuals and was a primary focus.

Like i mentioned the other factor... a lot of people were frustrated with security on windows XP. Viruses for XP were a dime a dozen because the operating system had been around for so damn long. Then Vista came out which was a pile of turd. That's almost 10 years of consecutive frustration from windows users all bottled up and then when Apple gave them an easy way out, they started kicking Microsoft's ass year by year.

You forget where Apple makes a lot of their money: iPhone, iPod, and the iPad have been gold mines for them. For a long time there was no competition for the iPhone and the iPod dominated the MP3 player market for a long time.

I'm sorry. You don't build the second largest company in the world by getting people to spend roughly twice as much money to buy a Mac to run shitty Windows software.

Apple's success comes from their making products that people WANT to buy. Even if it costs more because they are superior. You can call Apple customers stupid, but you can't call them dissatisfied. You also can't grow a business as much as Apple has by making crappy overpriced products.

 

[hillzofvalp]

I dressed up as steve jobs for halloween once... 992 new balance.. jeans. black turtleneck.. ipod.. not many people got it (as you could imagine) but I bet if I go as steve jobs this year with some blood.. they'll know exactly who I am. lol

 

[Dee Jay]

damn, my heart just sank... what a downer...

got a happy story??

Now I feel like I gotta have a Pirates of Silicon Valley film marathon, watch it a few times... and a bunch Pixar animations. Anthony Michael Hall's Bill Gates was equally cool to watch..

Steve wasn't just a computer geek, he was a true rebel and a futurist RIP :|

 

[neptronix]

I'm sorry. You don't build the second largest company in the world by getting people to spend roughly twice as much money to buy a Mac to run shitty Windows software.

Apple's success comes from their making products that people WANT to buy. Even if it costs more because they are superior. You can call Apple customers stupid, but you can't call them dissatisfied. You also can't grow a business as much as Apple has by making crappy overpriced products.

I don't think you read my statements entirely or we are on different pages. Let me restate:

Apple wasn't on the map for desktop computing other than for their cult following and certain creative folks until the Intel switch, which happened roughly around the same time that security was becoming an epic problem on Windows XP.
People ran from Windows to the next best alternative ( Apple ) after being told that they could still do everything they did on the PC before due to the compatibility, which was an issue preventing many from switching over before.
( that and the G5/G4 processors just flat out sucked balls. )

Businesses get rich selling crappy overpriced products all day long in America.
Those companies that are getting rich have one thing: a nice shine. Like the other poster said... it's the sizzle, not the steak.

Apple made their money charging high profit margins for a 'think different' product. They kept afloat for quite some time and weren't rich until they struck oil with the ipod and then the iphone.

Anyway where were we? oh yeah..... Apple did not revolutionize or invent the PC, they just made a cool niche product for a long time and just barely started to go mainstream as of late. They still lag behind Windows as the dominant platform.

 

[Spacey]

Saw a speech he gave to university students a while ago, was one of the most inspiring talks I have seen.

Whilst I run a water cooled super fast overclocked PC I am typing this on an iPad which is perfect because it just works.

It's easy to speak ill of the dead, we should have a bit more respect. It's one thing having a product, it's another to bring it to Market so successfully.

 

[ambroseliao]

These are indeed inspiring words. This is the best 15 minutes you'll spend Today.

[youtube]UF8uR6Z6KLc[/youtube]

 

[dingoEsride]

Saddened by his passing mainly because I've seen him as a healthy rich guy presenting new products then a few weeks ago in a very skinny weak feable state, my father went down in a similar way at around 75yo and would previously outdo many youngers in many ways, cancer shows no prejudice,

as for microsoft v mac, I prefer old macs, cheap, robust, reliable without 20 zrillion folders and no virus protection or scans that slow them down, mind you windows 7 is ok

 

[Philistine]

This is the best 15 minutes you'll spend Today.

No, what I did in the shower this morning was the best 15 minutes today so far, if my wife carries out her end of the deal then I will get an even better 15 minutes of my day just before I go to sleep, but Steve is up against some stiff competition for best 15 minutes, and I don't like his chances....

 

[ptd]

You've obviously not heard of IBM, radio shack, tandy, atari, amiga, commodore, Amstrad, Altair, TI, Sinclair, Acorn etc..

as for revolutionary change, most of the above systems started off offered to consumers as gaming platforms. funny you mention texas instruments. i was playing lunar lander and star trek, on a TELETYPE, via BofA mainframe, in the early 70's. before monitors. ps, jobs worked for atari, too. imo, apple's focus was on personal productivity, and that this was the reason for their initial success. most, if not all of the above, had corporate funding, and just realized that the apple train was leaving the station. kind of the equivalent of today's china, seeing a good idea, having the means of production, and making clones. unlike jobs and wozniak, starting out of their garage. problem is, by the time apple realized they were falling off the pace, a shift towards software had happened. i like the end of part 2 with jobs and gates, where he mentions that apple was this ship with a giant hole in the bottom of it, and his job is to point it in the right direction.

Apple did not revolutionize computing. They had a pretty good platform in the 1970's, but were, and have been small players this entire time.

Apple DID revolutionize computing, in the form of user interfaces. which was primarily steve jobs. ie, WYSIWYG. again, globally adopted as the standard, and copied. ie, windows. as for being small players, anyone investing in apple early on, made a fortune, and jobs himself, was worth 8.3 BILLION, at his death. as for closing values, as of 9-29-11, Apple, $362.1 billion, IBM, $214.0 billion, Microsoft, $213.2 billion.

They are just starting to really catch up with the PC platform these days. It took a long time, a switch to intel/x86 chips around the mid 2000's and many shitty versions of Windows for that to happen.

man, if you wanna talk about several shitty versions of windows, and playing catch up, go back to 1984 and DOS. i think that they are only playing catch up now cuz they frocked up and ousted steve in 1985. and perhaps the only reason they're still IN the game, is cuz they bought NeXT, in 1996, which got him back on board. however, by that time, microsoft windows had established it's stranglehold (and i do agree with you there luke, about open sourcing, but i don't think jobs 'missed' the opportunity, i just think it was taken away from him).

personally, i think jobs was an innovator, extraordinaire, and the world is a much better place, for him having had a part in it.

 

[ambroseliao]

I think Steve said something in the Stanford commencement speech that many of us on ES would agree with. "Don't settle."

"You've got to find what you love. And that is as true for your work as it is for your lovers. Your work is going to fill a large part of your life, and the only way to be truly satisfied is to do what you believe is great work. And the only way to do great work is to love what you do. If you haven't found it yet, keep looking. Don't settle. As with all matters of the heart, you'll know when you find it. And, like any great relationship, it just gets better and better as the years roll on. So keep looking until you find it. Don't settle."

 

[Dee Jay]

BTW who's decision was it for Mac's to go Intel, was it Steve's?

 

[ambroseliao]

Yes. It was Steve's decision and he was roundly booed by the Mac fanatics.

 

[Ykick]

hmmm... a bunch of guys sitting around, dissing Jobs, while typing on their personal computers (which, imho, happens to be the greatest open development tool ever created). a bit hypocritical, methinks. i'd say he did just fine.

You know... Apple didn't invent the personal computer.. right? :lol:

Henry Ford didn't invent the automobile either.

Can you maybe contain and control the vitriol and name-calling in this thread a bit? Apple users are stupid? Why, because they likely make more money than you? In your own words this isn't Mac vs PC - if you want that argument start your own damn thread and they will come, or not...

Regardless if you agree or disagree about how the guy ran his business he was unique and will be missed by millions of people.

RIP Steve Jobs, 1955-2011

 

[Dee Jay]

Yes. It was Steve's decision and he was roundly booed by the Mac fanatics.

I had to know because I am thoroughly enjoying my hackintosh. TEE HEE HEE! Thanks, Steve! 8) 8) 8) 8) 8)

I've always suspected that Steve went with Intel to sabotage Apple for kicking him out of his own company..

..then the Tron film sequel came out with the same scenario

co-inky-dink?

 

[Philistine]

Despite my repeated attempts at cheap shot jokes, noone has seemed able to see the lighter side of Steve's passing (I don't mean that disrespectively, he was clearly a really talented guy who gave the world a lot, I want that clear), but when people die there needs to be a bit of levity as well. My profession is directly involved with death, and we all celebrate humour in our rituals, there is no day I go to work that is not directly related to death.

I must say though, I have been stunned re this threads lack of ragging out Jobs for the fact that 95% of his success was due to Jonathan Ives. I presume (without knowing or caring two shits about apple products), this is a well flogged horse?

As an outsider with no interest or use of Apple products (other than my begrudging hate filled use of my ipad, everytime a flash video comes up I pray Jobs rots in hell), but it seems to me (correct me if I am wrong), but if you minused the products that Ives designed (Ipod/Ipad/Iphone) - and let's face it - it is the industrial design of those products that made them what they are, other than their design they suck ass, Apple would have gone insolvent?

 

[oatnet]

I don't agree about best in category at all. I prefer my dell and sony stuff...

Ah yes, good old Sony. Remember Sony's Minidisc? Which was essentially an MP3 player a decade before its time?

In the early 90's, I wanted one of these bad, but they wanted $600 for one - equivalent to $1800 today. I waited 2 years for the price to come down, but it stayed at $600 until CD Burners came out and I no longer cared.

Instead of making and OWNING the MP3 market, Sony made the mistake of flogging early adopters for the research costs, and got zippo out of the deal. They made the same mistake with BetaMax. It took the vision of Apple to make, and own, the market in MP3 players.

In your opinion, crApple phones suck ass IMO Android phones kick their butt... crApple phones are a nice stepping stone to a real smart phone i guess...

AJ, why does it always have to be "what I like is good, what you like sucks" with you? I miss the days when E:S when folks were supportive and trying to help each other, not bagging on other folks choices and competing for bragging rights.

AJ, how long did you own the iPhone you are bagging on? I own an android tablet and an iPhone. I made a career as a PC guy, and I was already frustrated by Mac's lack of granularity of control, that it was an appliance built for the least common denominator. I was quite suprised to find that I preferred the iPhone over android - I WANT my phone to be an appliance, I want it to just work, I don't want to spend time farting around with it, and the least common denominator suits me. I can see how the Android might be a better choice for your needs, how is that you lack the facility to appreciate that the iPhone might be a better fit for someone else's needs, without inserting all that negativity into E:S?

Finally, if you like your Android, you can thank Steve Jobs for making the niche market that android came into. Until the iPhone came out, no carrier was making a handset that did Anything like what Android/Iphone does today - Steve Jobs PUSHED the cellular industry into progress. If he hadn't we'd all still be text-messaging into cheesy phones with text-based displays. I remember when I bought the First Iphone, and realized my dream of surfing the net from the beach, after years of searching for a good way to do it. I remember when I bought my first iPod, 60gb was just enough to hold my music library - and threw out the 6 crappy MP3 players I had bought before it that had like 2gb of storage.

RIP Steve Jobs, thanks for all the cool stuff. After what you did in your first 34 years of business, the world really lost out on what you could have done with another 34 years.

-JD

 

[neptronix]

The reason i have a Sony MP3 player is because all i do is plug it in an drag files on to it.

No itunes.
No software upgrades to worry about.
No drivers or operating system compatibility to work out.

It's just a USB drive that plays MP3's and it does it perfectly!!

And NO, i am not a Sony fanboy. They are kind of a nasty company these days IMHO, but compared to the competition they are often one step ahead of their days.

And for my Dell.. well.. I spent $900 on it ( including a 3 year warranty ).. it had the best processor at the time.. a 15 inch screen, and more ports than the macbook pro. If i wanted the same thing in the MAC world, i would be spending a hair over $2000.. for an aluminum screen, a gig more of ram, and a hopped up graphics card that i don't need..

 

[StudEbiker]

hmmm... a bunch of guys sitting around, dissing Jobs, while typing on their personal computers (which, imho, happens to be the greatest open development tool ever created). a bit hypocritical, methinks. i'd say he did just fine.

You know... Apple didn't invent the personal computer.. right? :lol:

Henry Ford didn't invent the automobile either.

Likewise, Henry Ford didn't build the best automobile either, he built for the masses. So the analogy is actually pretty good. :wink: