They are pretty stable and I haven't have a single report against this cell. Only positive feedback.
Also Yes they already have CCC certification approved and will start selling them on March after the Chinese holydays.
Tabless design cylindrical cells tests
- Thread starter Pajda
- Start date
Also Yes they already have CCC certification approved and will start selling them on March after the Chinese holydays.
BlueSwordM
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Ok, some other news came out.
Full production of Reliance RH60 will start as Chinese New Year ends.
I might be getting sample(s).
Its performance is mainly restricted by cycle life, as it actually has very low IR, lower than the Lishen 5000mAh LR2170LE.
No information about production of RS60, except for the fact that its capabilities will get slightly upgraded.
Tenpower 60XG will enter full production in June/July, and Tenpower 70XG might enter production quite a bit earlier than anticipated.
Full production of Reliance RH60 will start as Chinese New Year ends.
I might be getting sample(s).
Its performance is mainly restricted by cycle life, as it actually has very low IR, lower than the Lishen 5000mAh LR2170LE.
No information about production of RS60, except for the fact that its capabilities will get slightly upgraded.
Tenpower 60XG will enter full production in June/July, and Tenpower 70XG might enter production quite a bit earlier than anticipated.
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Bengy22
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Sounds like Tenpower will be the first to have a tabless 6ah cell out something I've been eagerly waiting for. If that's the expected full production date pre-production samples shouldn't be too far off. Maybe we will see it before the P60C which I really thought we would have seen by now. 70XG would be huge can't wait to eventually see it as well
nice. Hopefully they keep 30XG's 14.5A charging spec in the new datasheet release unlike EVE and Ampace.
Pajda
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Good point. I would be quite positive about this, because Tenpower already includes a cycle life graph for +5C (14.5A) charging in its 30XG test report, and the cell performs very well.
Btw. samples of EVE30PL and Tenpower 30XG arrived yesterday
The Reliance RH60 is also tabless, but probably more focused on cycle-life and lower production cost compared to the other tabless 6ah cells.
BlueSwordM
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I did some super deep digging, and I finally found something really nice.
So, remember how I was looking for Molicel P50B IR graphs based on temperature? Well, I dug so deep that I found a diamond mine.
I know it's not in the same testing conditions as the analysis Ampace did on the JP40, but it gives you a good field of comparison.
We just know need to find how the JP50 does in these same conditions.
So, remember how I was looking for Molicel P50B IR graphs based on temperature? Well, I dug so deep that I found a diamond mine.
I know it's not in the same testing conditions as the analysis Ampace did on the JP40, but it gives you a good field of comparison.
We just know need to find how the JP50 does in these same conditions.
BlueSwordM
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I did some more intense digging, and I found these cells:
JP25
JP40 Pro.
Here's the document documenting everything.
Seems like the JP40 Pro is a massively juiced up JP40, likely with better tech from JP50 development to increase power density, cycle life and calendar life at high SOC storage.
Also semi-explicit/implicit finding that Ampace/CATL is using graphite nanoplatelets (or how many people like to call them, graphene nanoplatelets).
The temperature rise delta between the JP40 Pro and JP50 is actually huge: 8 degrees celcius difference in favor of the JP40 Pro.
Interestingly enough, at the same current, the JP40 seems to have the same temps as the JP50.
JP25
JP40 Pro.
Here's the document documenting everything.
Seems like the JP40 Pro is a massively juiced up JP40, likely with better tech from JP50 development to increase power density, cycle life and calendar life at high SOC storage.
Also semi-explicit/implicit finding that Ampace/CATL is using graphite nanoplatelets (or how many people like to call them, graphene nanoplatelets).
The temperature rise delta between the JP40 Pro and JP50 is actually huge: 8 degrees celcius difference in favor of the JP40 Pro.
Interestingly enough, at the same current, the JP40 seems to have the same temps as the JP50.
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BlueSwordM
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BAK 65E incoming.
I see one spec that says 2C discharge rate max, and more than one which claim 4C.
Can't seem to find a datasheet
Souvlucky
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Exciting!
Tenpower INR21700-60XG:
- Draft specifications (attached below)
- Sample pictures
Overview:
Early performance results:
Source: Tenpower post on LinkedIn.
I have not noticed this 'activation' in other datasheets:
"Please activate the battery once every three months according to the following method:
Charge at a constant current and constant voltage of 0.2C to 4.2V, and cut-off 0.01C, rest
ten minutes, then discharge at a constant current of 0.2C to 2.5V, and rest ten minutes, then
charge at a constant current of 0.2C for three hours. If the battery has been assembled or
used, use the suitable matched charger and machines to activate"
Seems like a 'use it or lose it' type of instruction.
"Please activate the battery once every three months according to the following method:
Charge at a constant current and constant voltage of 0.2C to 4.2V, and cut-off 0.01C, rest
ten minutes, then discharge at a constant current of 0.2C to 2.5V, and rest ten minutes, then
charge at a constant current of 0.2C for three hours. If the battery has been assembled or
used, use the suitable matched charger and machines to activate"
Seems like a 'use it or lose it' type of instruction.
JRP3
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Yeah that's weird, sounds more like a BMS calibrating routine than anything needed at the cell level.
BlueSwordM
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Nah. There might be an interesting reason for this that they may have found on the 50XG.
In essence, there are some specific additives that can be used to repair SEI/CEI/electrode coatings, but are usually most effective when there aren't competing reactions happening, so around 3.4-3.7V.
Again, all educated speculation of course, but one that would be interesting to test on current 50XGs.
I saw a similar guideline in the datasheet for the semi solid state pouches (300Wh/kg effective) I tested recently. At first I thought it was to avoid self discharge below the optimal storage voltage since it was worded as if the goal was to keep the cells between 3.7 - 3.95V, but after many months with no use it was clear this wasn’t the reason, because the cells barely budged. Would love to know the chemical reasons behind this, or if it’s just an old guideline inherited by these new cells that might not be as relevant.
Edit: lol, just realised it looks like Tenpower ran their cell to >90C @ 60A
perhaps they started at a lower temperature than usual. Good stress test though.
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PTKKreator
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Spotted that RH60 has been added to Batemo, it's been there over a week actually.
www.batemo.com
Seems to perform in the ballpark of middling non-tabless 4000mAh power cells like EVE 40P or Sunpower's 4Ah power cell (40T?), but thermals are worse than all of them, rising over 60 degrees at 50W power draw.
INR21700-RH60(B)
Get measurement data, a high-precision model and a detailed report of the lithium-ion battery cell Reliance INR21700-RH60(B).
www.batemo.com
Seems to perform in the ballpark of middling non-tabless 4000mAh power cells like EVE 40P or Sunpower's 4Ah power cell (40T?), but thermals are worse than all of them, rising over 60 degrees at 50W power draw.
Batemo's ratings usually are pretty conservative, but I think there is some errors on that page, perhaps some RS60 vs RH 60 implications as I see a pulse rating of 90 amps, but a continuous of upto 20 amps
I really dislike Batemo's line charts too.
Not sure what they are going for other than being different and confusing and difficult to interpret and compare.
I will value only their 'continuous' estimation, as it seems reasonable for a battery within a pack, with No ventilation, and to stay ~10'C under its max rating.
I really dislike Batemo's line charts too.
Not sure what they are going for other than being different and confusing and difficult to interpret and compare.
I will value only their 'continuous' estimation, as it seems reasonable for a battery within a pack, with No ventilation, and to stay ~10'C under its max rating.
BlueSwordM
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No actually. It is a tabless cell, just with different components, likely a different ingredient composition and most importantly, different cost targets.
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Awesome to hear that someone is actually able to get their hands on BAK 6.5's.
In the same space i fit 4x 5ah cells and get ~19.5ah
I could have 25-26ah instead
Sizeable leap!
2C cont on 25AH battery is 50A, so this would work great on a low to mid power ebike.
In the same space i fit 4x 5ah cells and get ~19.5ah
I could have 25-26ah instead
Sizeable leap!
2C cont on 25AH battery is 50A, so this would work great on a low to mid power ebike.
ah ok so it is tabless, still usable an decent but not as good yeah.
The continuous current rating is essentially the same as the Samsung 50S on batemo, so it can't be all that bad like we're thinking. Could be a significant upgrade for some devices with the right price point I guess.Spotted that RH60 has been added to Batemo, it's been there over a week actually.
INR21700-RH60(B)
Get measurement data, a high-precision model and a detailed report of the lithium-ion battery cell Reliance INR21700-RH60(B).
Seems to perform in the ballpark of middling non-tabless 4000mAh power cells like EVE 40P or Sunpower's 4Ah power cell (40T?), but thermals are worse than all of them, rising over 60 degrees at 50W power draw.
I've heard many bad things about Arosen Power but I believe they were one of the first to stock 50PLs and 30PLs. I wonder what this 60P cell is a rewrap of: https://www.alibaba.com/product-det...l?spm=a2700.shop_plgr.41413.11.51917121OAgsXw
PTKKreator
🧲 New user
My understanding is that those 90 amps is not what they rate the cells at, but what they tested and provide data for. See the paragraph right above where it states "-90A"
I guess I presented it somewhat negatively but it's for sure not a bad performance, it's roughly in the same class as traditional power cells, only beaten by tabless and cream of the crop tabbed cells like P50B. Interestingly it's also slightly lighter than all the 5.8Ah energy cells, 3-5g/cell are not going to make a huge difference but could be a small advantage for some applications.
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