TSDZ2 Thread organization

[nesdon]

I have been reading and searching for information on the Tong Sheng TSDZ mid drive kits. I am a bit surprised that there are so few separate general threads, with most of the info buried in individual build topics and a single, 4-year-old 300+ page subthread started when the system was introduced. The Sticky for this Non-hub topic does not include the system.

There is a very interesting, extensive, and productive discussion about the development by members here of Open Source Firmware for the system, which deserves its own subthread, but instead it's scattered and so not very comprehensible as a cohesive narrative, in that one thread. Being a newbie, it's not my role to try and help make this info better organized, but hope it may become that moving forward.

Full disclosure, I have just installed a TSDZ2, on which I just installed the v1.0.0 OSF, on an old Electra Townie. I will share this conversion and my experience and observations in a separate new subtopic.

 

[E-HP]

Being a newbie, it's not my role to try and help make this info better organized, but hope it may become that moving forward.

I'm pretty sure that if you organized the material that nobody would object, even if you are a newbie. The forum rules don't prohibit it or even discuss roles. Where did you read that?

 

[amberwolf]

The simplest way to organize the information is to create an index thread; it could be in this thread if you like.

For instance, a post containing an "index to the index" first, which you can just keep editing as you add things. Then a post about each type of thing you want to keep track of, which again you can edit to add things in as necessary.

Once you've started the process, we can put a link to the index thread in the Sticky Index.

 

[spinningmagnets]

Also, you can edit your first post to become the index, if you like. Look in the stickied indexes for a useful suggestion about the form.

"Name of thread" (a brief note of description)
[Link to thread]

As Fechter and Ghandi might say "be the change you wish to see"

 

[casainho]

I am a bit surprised that there are so few separate general threads, with most of the info buried in individual build topics and a single, 4-year-old 300+ page subthread started when the system was introduced.

Full disclosure, I have just installed a TSDZ2, on which I just installed the v1.0.0 OSF, on an old Electra Townie.

I am pretty sure you did follow the wiki to be able to install the our OpenSource firmware v1.0.0. That wiki has a structure and did a lot of work to prepare but had collaboration of users, so, in the end it pays off.

If you want to do something better, you need to structure the information. For instance, try to improve the TSDZ2 FAQ, add images and links to the forum messages.

 

[nesdon]

The wiki is excellent! Thank you for all the work on this. I'm loving this firmware upgrade. The one thing I had a bit of trouble with in the wiki was finding where the Throttle enable setting was. I kept reading past the Motor temperature heading in the configuration section because I knew I had no sensor. It's easy to see in the first sentence now that I know, but if you added a "/throttle" in the Motor temperature heading it would be easier to find.

The one thing I'm having a hard time getting configured right is that when I downshift shift my IGH while climbing a hill, the assist takes a while to come back after I have reapplied torque to the pedals. The few revs it takes to gobbles up my inertia. I've tried the Current ramp and ADC Step settings, but still feels like too much pause. I don't understand the Torque s fil or Pedal ground settings, but was going to experiment with them when I calibrate the sensor more accurately with the help of my family members.

 

[nesdon]

The forum rules don't prohibit it or even discuss roles. Where did you read that?

It's more a point of courtesy in many forums to lurk and learn the culture before mucking around.

I haven't grokked the indexing feature @amberwolf and @spinningmagnets described, but will keep trying. @spinningmagnets sticky https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=69709#p1051667 is great but should have some links into the big TSDZ2 thread.

As I'm learning I'll try to contribute.
Thanks for the helpful replies!

 

[famichiki]

The mega-thread has a lot of good info in there, but I agree it's all a bit disjointed. There are similar long threads on other non-English forums too. But the wiki is very helpful, and if you know what you are looking for the search here works well too. I agree with Casainho about the wiki, and if you want to make a contribution then that would be the best place to do it.

Questions in the mega-thread can be quickly buried by other posts and go unanswered. Creating a separate thread doesn't seem to be much better, but at least you can keep track of your own build in the one place. Perhaps, like me, people tend to only keep up with the threads they are subscribed to. Then again, the motor has been around for a few years now and some of the earlier knowledgeable people could have lost interest and moved on to other projects.

 

[nesdon]

I'm not sure the protocol here, although the wiki undoubtedly saves a revision history, but I just want to memorialize that I made, and will probably continue to make, changes to the wiki. I edited the features and configuration page to help make the throttle setting easier to find after I read a couple of other posts in the OSF thread from folks who had the same issue.

Can I assume that the double structure of the heading in the configuration tables, e.g. "Torque sensor / Torque sen" is to also show what the name of a code setting is? I ask because I changed the name of the Motor temp heading to "Motor temperature/Throttle / Motor temp" but don't want that to mess up a formatting scheme.

I also want to work on the Torque settings section, as I read some posts which, as I do, not fully understanding the Torque sensor settings. It reads:
"How to use: everytime you startup the system, the pedals need to be vertical pointing to ground. You can select on Configurations to be left or right pedal to point to ground at startup, based on your preferences. This is needed done so the system can know in which pedal are you doing the force with your legs, since the weight is measured differently on each pedal due to the torque sensor."

Here's what I understand:

• There is some sort of automatic recalibration run at start up (is this applying the ADC values entered during initial manual calibration or...?)

• It needs the pedals oriented as set in the configuration, i.e the selected one close to the ground. (Why is this important and what happens if one forgets?)

• You then need to start pedaling with pressure to the selected pedal. (Do you? This is somewhat implied by the last sentence, but not explicitly. What happens if you start with the wrong pedal?)

Let me know if I've understood this correctly/

 

[casainho]

Can I assume that the double structure of the heading in the configuration tables, e.g. "Torque sensor / Torque sen" is to also show what the name of a code setting is?

860C / SW102 displays strings

I also want to work on the Torque settings section, as I read some posts which, as I do, not fully understanding the Torque sensor settings. It reads:
"How to use: everytime you startup the system, the pedals need to be vertical pointing to ground. You can select on Configurations to be left or right pedal to point to ground at startup, based on your preferences. This is needed done so the system can know in which pedal are you doing the force with your legs, since the weight is measured differently on each pedal due to the torque sensor."

Here's what I understand:

• There is some sort of automatic recalibration run at start up (is this applying the ADC values entered during initial manual calibration or...?)

• It needs the pedals oriented as set in the configuration, i.e the selected one close to the ground. (Why is this important and what happens if one forgets?)

• You then need to start pedaling with pressure to the selected pedal. (Do you? This is somewhat implied by the last sentence, but not explicitly. What happens if you start with the wrong pedal?)

Let me know if I've understood this correctly/

Torque sensor, for the same weight on left and right pedals, the measured ADC value is different. A different curve is then needed for each pedal to linearize calculate the weight for each pedal. As the TSDZ2 was not developed for this, there is no way to know current pedal position - a way to deal with this is to ask user to start pedal always in the same position and then count the pedal PAS signal impulses, that are 20 for one full rotation and is possible to know when pedals are rotating forward or backwards, then, to know the position of the pedals, the firmware just need to assume that they always start at the same position.
If user fails on start at the same position, then, the measured values will be incorrect.

 

[nesdon]

I'd assumed the calibration is about loading the torque setting table we prepared with our initial calibration. The controller then needs to know whether to use the right table or left table, and so needs to know the start position so that it can keep track of which side the torque is coming from.

So, I set the selected pedal vertical, then power on the system, being careful not to turn the wheels or pedals as it boots. After the display comes on, I assume the calibration is complete as I board the bike, because I always move the pedals to get one parallel to the ground to get maximum leverage as I start off. But as I board I may also bump them randomly, rotating forward or backward to this horizontal position depending on how and where I am boarding.

I think some confusion may come from the ambiguity of the word "start". We both start the motor control system, and start pedaling the bike. I assume that I don't need to start pedaling with forward rotation and pressure on the selected pedal, as the calibration is complete once the boot is complete, and does not use that initial torque sensor ADC output as part of the calibration. Correct?