V3 Astro drive unit and CNC machined case....

[recumpence]

Hey Guys,

I started a new thread about this new drive and housing rather than continue the original drive unit thread because that thread is HUGE and I wanted to prevent the data regarding this new drive from being confused with the V1 drives.

Anyway, this new drive has been updated in a number of ways;

#1 The new bearing tube allows bearing replacement because the bearings are a slip fit, rather than a press fit.
#2 The mounting "Foot" now allows the frame clamps to rotate in the foot. This allows the drive to mount in different configurations, such as one clamp could mount to the seat post tube with the other clamp on the down tube (for instance). This allows a bit more mounting options.
#3 The motor face plate now is recessed to allow an outboard bearing support. This outboard support is helpful for high power systems to eliminate shaft flex.
#4 In an effort to standardize things, the V3 drive is built for Astro motors only. I still can make V1 drives for other motors. However, 95% of all drives I have sold run Astro 32 series motors. So, this drive reflects that.
#5 All drives are now shimmed for smooth rotation.

The drive price has remained the same $225 as the V1 drive. However, if the outboard bearing support is desired, there is a $15 extra charge for that part (the drive can be used with or without that bearing support). I would say any 3210 setup does not need the bearing. 3215s or 3220s should use it.

I will post a separate description and pics of the CNC case in my next post. :wink:

Matt

 

[recumpence]

Here is my new CNC machined primary case for my drive units. I am really excited about this part! I have been trying to come up with a decent design for this housing for some time now. Here are the reasons for this product;

First, I have had quite a few requests for a guard for the primary belt on my drives.

For anything about 4kw, a chain is required. Exposed chains can have a few issues of their own. The throw oil on your leg (if over lubricated). They make more noise than a belt, and they can really do a number on your pant leg. So, to that end this case;

#1 quiets down the chain (and even belt) noise.
#2 It contains any lubrication splatter from a chain drive.
#3 It protects your leg from getting caught in or messed up by the chain or belt.

The case will hold either my belt drive, or chain drive. This housing is a bit wider than the production housing will be. The production housing will be about 1/4 inch narrower. The entire V3 drive with housing is 4.5 inches wide from the FW adaptor to the housing cover.

The case has a lip around the seam of the cover and bottom case. This allows a snug fit and will allow RTV ofr other sealant to prevent slung lube from dripping out the lower seam.

This case will bolt directly to the new V3 drive face plate. It can be fitted to previous drives if 3 holes are drill and tapped to mount it. :wink:

The price is $135. If purchased with a V3 drive, I will take $15 off. I know, I know, what a salesman! :wink:

Anyway, I think that is it.

For those who have a drive on order, I will be assembling and shipping them this coming week. We are nearly finished with all parts. Cases will take another week to get done (longer if anodizing is required).

Lastly, for anyone who is really looking to blow some cash on something special, Dave (my CNC guy) is willing to CNC engrave your name or whatever lettering you want, into the cover for $75. I make nothing on that. I just wanted to let you know that is an option if you so desire.

Matt

 

[AussieJester]

Matt...will this fit a 130kv Turnigy ie. the Turnigy i sent you to check compatibility with your drive? If so
how much for this and the bearing support ...

cheers

KiM

EDIT: and would your CNC Guy be able to put this on a drive cover-->

 

[recumpence]

The inside detail opening for the mount screws would need to be massaged open to fit. The bearing support would not. But, your motor does not need the bearing support.

Matt

 

[michaelplogue]

Matt -

Was wondering if you've ever looked at the "silent chain" stuff for your systems...

http://www.ramseychain.com/prod_pt.asp

 

[mud2005]

round of applause! very nice work Matt!

 

[Byte]

Wow, that's very nice

 

[rodgah]

holy crap, looks even better than I imagined. For Dual setups like twin 3220, will the bearing support be needed? I am assuming you are still planning to link the motors 1:1 with a belt and then use a chain reduction the way you always have?

rodger

 

[recumpence]

Yes, the twin drives will still be linked at the rear with a belt. So, this single housing will work fine.

Also, yes, the added bearing support would be a good idea for the twin motor drive because of the huge torque of that setup on the chain.

I am at ths shop next week cutting and building drives for customers. Hopefully a few of these can be installed for existing drive orders that are pending. :wink:

Matt

 

[MitchJi]

Hi Matt,

Nice work! 8)

How much width does the cover add (what's the total width with a 3120 and a 3220)?

When you know how noisy #25 chain is with the cover as compared to a belt uncovered would you let us know?

If there is room for improvement on the chain noise a thin layer of sound deadening material lining the cover might make a big difference.

What is the max reduction with the cover for belt and #25 chain?

 

[recumpence]

Max reduction with a chain drive and the case is 14 tooth motor sprocket (I may be able to find a 13 tooth), and a 54 tooth main sprocket. So, roughly 5 to 1. As for chain noise, I have a similar one-off case on my big yellow trike. I will run that with and without the case for comparison. I am sure it will be noticeable. Honestly, the #25 chain is not too noisey with a 14 tooth motor sprocket. But, you definately can hear it. Also, you are correct, some added sound deadening would help as well. However, the wall thickness is on the case is 1/8 inch all around with additional 1/8 inch for the reinforcing ribs. That is thick enough that I do not think any added material is needed. But, you never know untill you try.

The case adds roughly 1/2 inch to the width of the drive. There is a 1/8 inch back plate, 1/4 inch front plate, and a bit of clearance inside. We can (and most likely will) make a narrower cover for the chain drives. They can be 1/2 inch narrower. It is not hard to change the programming for that.

If width becomes an issue, but the cases sell well, I can make new drive unit mounts that provide more clearance for a narrower overall drive.

Matt

 

[MitchJi]

Hi Matt,

Also, you are correct, some added sound deadening would help as well. However, the wall thickness is on the case is 1/8 inch all around with additional 1/8 inch for the reinforcing ribs. That is thick enough that I do not think any added material is needed. But, you never know until you try.

Matt

I was thinking of something like this:
http://www.soundproofing.org/sales/prices.html

Super Soundproofing Foam Mat for noise control: A closed cell vinyl-nitrile noise control FOAM suitable as a sound barrier as well as a sound absorber. For application to cars, boats, planes, home and office, anywhere a noise control mat is needed. Won't absorb moisture or odor, long lasting and durable. An excellent sound-proofer and thermal insulator! (FAA Approved for aircraft, too! Ask for the lab burn tests we have that others can't supply!). Just apply with our PSA (Pressure Sensitive Adhesive- peel-off backing) or contact cement to reduce and absorb sound. Beware of imitations! (Note: this is NOT the cheap crappy rubber/neoprene as sold by some of our competitors they claim is to defeat ambient noise!)

I have not used this specific product but sound absorption can be very effective. Putting a piece of carpet under my Mac Tower, on top of the hardwood floor, made a substantial difference in the noise level.

Matt -

Was wondering if you've ever looked at the "silent chain" stuff for your systems...

It comes in 3/16" pitch so it could be quieter and give more reduction and be stronger (less prone to stretching).

 

[Kepler]

The stuff you come out with just blows me away. I always feel like such a hack after seeing your work. Very reasonable pricing too. This has gone straight to the top of my wish list

 

[etard]

Oh man, this is gorgeous!! Covering up the chain/belt was the next logical step. And the reasons you give for the cover will be excellent argument points with the wifey! I might have to sell some things on ebay to get this new drive.

You say outboard bearing not necessary with AJ 130kv HK motor, but it would be better to have for $15 more, correct?

 

[recumpence]

Oh man, this is gorgeous!! Covering up the chain/belt was the next logical step. And the reasons you give for the cover will be excellent argument points with the wifey! I might have to sell some things on ebay to get this new drive.

You say outboard bearing not necessary with AJ 130kv HK motor, but it would be better to have for $15 more, correct?

It won't work with his motor anyway. The bearing support is only for use with the 3/8 ID bearing. Besides, AJ's motor has a 12mm shaft. That is HUGE.

Matt

 

[mwkeefer]

Simply beautiful!

-Mike

 

[kevo]

Matt,

Awesome quality as usual! Very tempting... Can you please post all dimensions of the V3 with and w/o the cover?

-Kevo

 

[recumpence]

I do not have one here to measure for you (I am at home, not the shop right now). But, if I remember correctly, the overall measurement of the single stage drive is 9 inches long, 4 inches wide, and 4 inches tall.

Matt

 

[recumpence]

We have cases in stock now. All those who have ordered are finished (other than anodizing and engraving).

I have two case styles in stock; The case shown for belt drives, and a 1/2 inch narrower case for chain primary drives.

Matt

 

[rodgah]

hey Matt,

what is the total width of the drive inc chain case (chain type not belt), any pictures as of yet? You mentioned engraving on my build thread but I think you may have been mistaken (i asked for nothing special) or are you doing a simple pattern on them standard?

Rodger

 

[recumpence]

Overall width should be about 4.25 to 4.5 inches.

It will have a simple "MS" engraved through the anodizing on the case cover.

Matt

 

[GaryB]

I posted in the V1 thread and then found this one.looks good!

 

[MitchJi]

Hi Matt,

Why not combine the case and drive unit? If the motor mounting slots were on the case you could dispense with the drive unit?

Wouldn't it be better to locate the outboard bearing support on the inside of the outer side of the case so it would be outboard of the sprocket/pulley?

No extra charge for a case monogramed with my initials (MS) ?

 

[recumpence]

That was my first opinion on it as well. However, a few things came up;

#1 What if someone wants to upgrade their V1 to a case? This case is easy to add on.

#2 The cost is FAR higher that way. There a numerous reasons for this related to being able to machine the required shape and profile.

#3 That would become a truely new drive entirely. At that point, I may as well completely redesign the drive.

#4 Not everyone wants the case mainly due to cost.

I can tell you that I am looking at a second drive unit design right now. I would still offer the V3 drive, while offering a second style drive that would be more compact, narrower Q factor, lighter, more rigid, fewer parts, better looking, and allow for MUCH better heat dissipation. It would look completely different than V3 drive. In fact, it would not share a single part of the V3 drive or resemble it in any way what-so-ever. This design does have its drawbacks, though. I am trying to eliminate those drawbacks before taking it to the prototype stage.

Matt

 

[jmygann]

Is there any attempt to make it quiet/stealth ??

for a 1000 watt .. street legal "bicycle"