nerve
1 W
I mean there are power lines everywhere...The infrastructure is already in place! Forget charging stations. Put a public access outlet on the damn poles!
Why not use telephone poles as charging stations?
- Thread starter nerve
- Start date
The fingers
10 TW
Unfortunately, I'm on the national do not call list. :lol:
LSBW
100 W
Eh, another victim of american education. Have you ever seen rj 11 cable? Damn thing will melt after you try to feed it 10 watts, never mind 1000 or 10000 needed for charging station.
nerve
1 W
yes, the Reagan years...'someone on the internet made...a mistake! '
Seriously, no not rj11 as suggested...the utility poles can carry both phone and electricity...
Seriously, no not rj11 as suggested...the utility poles can carry both phone and electricity...
Drunkskunk
100 GW
Well, there is power on some Utility poles, and often at consumer voltages. But the poles them selves are on Private property that's not owned by the Power or Telephone companies. They can string the poles there under right of way laws and ordanances, but they can't use someone else's property to sell power at a charging station. And you can't use their pole to attach a charging station for a host of legal and safety reasons.
The amperage that these poles can tolerate is awfully low. Yeah - they run at something like 48 volts, but not a lot of amps.
The idea of having a 48 volt DC supply running through common lines is cool, but i doubt that you could get these companies to beef them up enough. We'd need a hell of a lot of people riding on ebikes.
The idea of having a 48 volt DC supply running through common lines is cool, but i doubt that you could get these companies to beef them up enough. We'd need a hell of a lot of people riding on ebikes.
liveforphysics
100 TW
This could be done under each high voltage step down transformer. I think the smallest common to find is ~200A at 240vac. Run some enclosed conduit down with 2 awg wire and a low mounted 100a breaker and a couple dryer outlets with water proof covers.
20kw is pretty decent charge rate, even for pretty large EVs.
In Amsterdam I took pics of some of the public ebike charge stations. China has them at the nicer bike and scooter racks/parking areas too. The US is more into oil.
20kw is pretty decent charge rate, even for pretty large EVs.
In Amsterdam I took pics of some of the public ebike charge stations. China has them at the nicer bike and scooter racks/parking areas too. The US is more into oil.
nerve
1 W
yeah, that's what i was thinking...public outdoor outlets right on the pole...
grindz145
1 MW
nerve said:
Just add Meter and transformer and you have it, but that's what we already have today Not sure if you're suggesting that we just put them on every single pole instead?
nerve
1 W
It would'nt necessarily need to be on every pole...but designated locations thoughout towns or cities. It could be subsidized by the township or provided as a public service from the utility company for the rights of public way privilege...
hillzofvalp
100 kW
the other day I saw a powerline on fire in my city. it was like 10 inches long right in the middle of the cable teathered across a street.
I think that there's much more involved than you would think in adding a charging station to a telephone pole, aside from communication (that seems easy to me). The infrastructure simply was not designed for this kind of load for these durations in what I assume you are suggesting to be higher than normal adoption.
I think at times it may be easier to pull lines from the ground.. cleaner install.. separate base, etc.
There has to be stations on poles that are at points of interest. Also, no one wants to have a public charging station in front of their house, either.
HOWEVER it would make sense in modern day if someone parking on the street with no garage PAID for a personal installation for their own vehicle.
I think that there's much more involved than you would think in adding a charging station to a telephone pole, aside from communication (that seems easy to me). The infrastructure simply was not designed for this kind of load for these durations in what I assume you are suggesting to be higher than normal adoption.
I think at times it may be easier to pull lines from the ground.. cleaner install.. separate base, etc.
There has to be stations on poles that are at points of interest. Also, no one wants to have a public charging station in front of their house, either.
HOWEVER it would make sense in modern day if someone parking on the street with no garage PAID for a personal installation for their own vehicle.
Ch00paKabrA
10 kW
nerve said:
Why should the Township or utility company subsidize anything? If the township subsidizes it, then the taxpayers of that community will be paying the bill. Contrary to what many liberal leaning folks believe, the utility company's purpose is to make a profit. Giving away power runs counter to that end.
If an idea cannot stand on its own merits, then it is doomed to fail. Until it is figured out to get more range out of electric vehicles, it is a pipe dream to think of a vast array of charging stations. Let's leave governments out it please - A123 is proof that subsidies don't work.
nerve
1 W
Ch00paKabrA said:
Well, I'd agree however, technology and the internet is changing all that...and everything in socioeconomics...turning it upsidedown and inside out...I would not be so quick to throw out the idea that communities can and will get things correct in the future, regardless of what our conservative friends tell us about the nature of what 'works' and does not...p-lease...
dnmun
1 PW
i actually think it should not be done through the guvment because they will require all kinds of regulations for setting up the charging spot. i think it will be easy to allow homeowners and property owners to set up whatever kind of charging spot they want at the curb or in the driveway at their house or business.
currently the city regulates the property between the edge of your lot and the street so the city has to be able to allow people to install charging spots on the public right of way adjacent the street so people can charge using juice from the house at the location but pay for it through the google app that covers the charging payments accounts and authentications.
i put 4 spots around my driveway apron when i poured the concrete where i can get 240V and up to 50A or so for a charging station. this will allow other people in the neighborhood without a charge spot at their apartment or house, or people who stop to shop close by, to plug in at my neighborhood EV charging hot spot.
then they can log on to free wifi and even have a shared EV for use by a number of people in the neighborhood who don't wanna have a car but would buy into a shared EV or plug in hybrid car, or shared cars and trucks.
currently the city regulates the property between the edge of your lot and the street so the city has to be able to allow people to install charging spots on the public right of way adjacent the street so people can charge using juice from the house at the location but pay for it through the google app that covers the charging payments accounts and authentications.
i put 4 spots around my driveway apron when i poured the concrete where i can get 240V and up to 50A or so for a charging station. this will allow other people in the neighborhood without a charge spot at their apartment or house, or people who stop to shop close by, to plug in at my neighborhood EV charging hot spot.
then they can log on to free wifi and even have a shared EV for use by a number of people in the neighborhood who don't wanna have a car but would buy into a shared EV or plug in hybrid car, or shared cars and trucks.
friendly1uk
1 MW
Charge points should be fitted where people park. The power is under the pavement feeding shops and homes and street lighting. It will be a lot more pavement furniture though.
I guess they could dish out 50v at bike stands. You can give people 50v out in the rain, and if mr & mrs want to share an extension lead they can. Nobody should be getting killed. It could be quite a simple installation. In the UK our 230v mains would never get approved for use in this way. It might work on a caravan park, but not in the city.
I guess they could dish out 50v at bike stands. You can give people 50v out in the rain, and if mr & mrs want to share an extension lead they can. Nobody should be getting killed. It could be quite a simple installation. In the UK our 230v mains would never get approved for use in this way. It might work on a caravan park, but not in the city.
dogman dan
1 PW
I have a pole in my backyard that is carrying 110v wire, and drops to my house, and 3 others. The transformer is a few poles away on another street.
They could put a meterless plug on that pole in my backyard any time.
Just 15 amps would run one room
AC or heater.
They should pay me rent for having to have that damn pole in my yard. I have to shut the dogs up in the house from time to time so cable guys, phone guys, etc can get at the boxes in my backyard too. I should be getting free phone and cable dang it.
Ahh, a guy can dream eh?
It would be nice if they put small device charging stations in various public places. Maybe not where you could get a Nissan leaf to it, but in a public space like the park near the library, or the public swimming pool, a place you can put some power into your cell phone or electric bike would be a good thing.
The city just needs to take the idea to the electric company when they negotiate a contract. Tell them if you want to serve this city, here's what you will do. I don't mean having free power everywhere in town. But half a dozen sites would be very useful. PR value to the E company would be priceless.
They could put a meterless plug on that pole in my backyard any time.
Just 15 amps would run one room AC or heater.
They should pay me rent for having to have that damn pole in my yard. I have to shut the dogs up in the house from time to time so cable guys, phone guys, etc can get at the boxes in my backyard too. I should be getting free phone and cable dang it. Ahh, a guy can dream eh?
It would be nice if they put small device charging stations in various public places. Maybe not where you could get a Nissan leaf to it, but in a public space like the park near the library, or the public swimming pool, a place you can put some power into your cell phone or electric bike would be a good thing.
The city just needs to take the idea to the electric company when they negotiate a contract. Tell them if you want to serve this city, here's what you will do. I don't mean having free power everywhere in town. But half a dozen sites would be very useful. PR value to the E company would be priceless.
Sancho's Horse
1 kW
How about all this wasted energy from ICE's? A typical drive provides way more than enough energy to top off the cars batteries. Why not figure out a way to use it?
Maybe a ride sharing program for the future involves one worker with an electric vehicle partnering up with an ICE driver with a modified alternator system, so that the ICE drives their longer ride to work and simultaneously charges the batteries for the electric...quick swap...energy not wasted...small reduction in gas costs...freshly charged batteries. Everyone happy
Or in a delusion storm...I mean brain storm...buses which do this service, where you can pick up your battery from a locked box at the bus stop of your choice at a time of your choice. Telephone poles maybe not...plus all the extra massive cost.
Maybe a ride sharing program for the future involves one worker with an electric vehicle partnering up with an ICE driver with a modified alternator system, so that the ICE drives their longer ride to work and simultaneously charges the batteries for the electric...quick swap...energy not wasted...small reduction in gas costs...freshly charged batteries. Everyone happy
Or in a delusion storm...I mean brain storm...buses which do this service, where you can pick up your battery from a locked box at the bus stop of your choice at a time of your choice. Telephone poles maybe not...plus all the extra massive cost.
nerve
1 W
It just struck me as kinda odd the other day...powerlines everywhere but no access... :-( and money did not seem to change the situation...
I'd be all for it but it wouldn't work unless there was a payment system setup. Otherwise what stops you from using it to charge anything and getting an assload of free power? Even if it were only a dollar or two it would be worth it. The problem is creating enough demand to justify the upfront cost and R/D of creating something like this. Electric still has not gained all that much traction in the US yet beyond hybrids and even then it's limited.
nerve
1 W
I post and then there was light....lol
http://gizmodo.com/bmw-is-developing-street-lights-that-also-charge-your-e-1656404266?utm_campaign=socialflow_gizmodo_facebook&utm_source=gizmodo_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow
http://gizmodo.com/bmw-is-developing-street-lights-that-also-charge-your-e-1656404266?utm_campaign=socialflow_gizmodo_facebook&utm_source=gizmodo_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow
friendly1uk
1 MW
Lamp posts here are 230v and often have an outlet at high level. It is for plugging in Christmas lights and such. The service cut-out fuse is typically in the bottom and the cover an isle of man key. We also string 3~ overhead which you can catch with a coat hanger and take to ground. Getting a bit of free power is not hard if your determined.
I'm often called abroad and find metering is done at the edge of peoples properties. Maybe in a wall, or a small brick cupboard. Always above ground though. Having meters along peoples frontage makes it quite easy to add robust charge points. Local distribution won't support many though. It's OK pulling a lot of power occasionally. That is expected. If everyone thinks they are getting home at 6pm and plugging in their charger they will get a surprise though.
We need smart chargers that can use power line data transmission, allowing the local transformer to ramp them up&down. This actually helps generation problems we already have.
I'm often called abroad and find metering is done at the edge of peoples properties. Maybe in a wall, or a small brick cupboard. Always above ground though. Having meters along peoples frontage makes it quite easy to add robust charge points. Local distribution won't support many though. It's OK pulling a lot of power occasionally. That is expected. If everyone thinks they are getting home at 6pm and plugging in their charger they will get a surprise though.
We need smart chargers that can use power line data transmission, allowing the local transformer to ramp them up&down. This actually helps generation problems we already have.
Nehmo
10 kW
OP is suggesting poles because they usually already have line power on them and they are everywhere. But charging stations aren't the answer.
The big advantage of electricity over liquid gas is that electricity is EASY to transport in contrast. Charging "stations" don't need to be tethered to a tank as pumps are.The charging points could be flat "rails" on the street that turn on only when a vehicle covers them. Some mechanical contact would need to be made, but it would be lifted when there was no rail. Modern positioning systems make this easy. You don't need the old fashion 3rd rail or overhead wires.
Inductive power transfer is also feasible, but because of certain complexities, implementation of that will need to be the next phase.
The big advantage of electricity over liquid gas is that electricity is EASY to transport in contrast. Charging "stations" don't need to be tethered to a tank as pumps are.The charging points could be flat "rails" on the street that turn on only when a vehicle covers them. Some mechanical contact would need to be made, but it would be lifted when there was no rail. Modern positioning systems make this easy. You don't need the old fashion 3rd rail or overhead wires.
Inductive power transfer is also feasible, but because of certain complexities, implementation of that will need to be the next phase.
eHomer
1 µW
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2014
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An interesting subject and always worth exploring any possibility of extending range.
It shows up the big difference between the US and UK regarding phone service supply. Here in the UK, 95% of service provision is underground, all the way into the houses and businesses, especially in built up areas. Even in rural areas, it's now rare to see aerial cable runs, just the final distribution box fanning out to individual houses from a single pole. Overhead electric supply is even rarer, apart from 11kv and up
The discussion here seems to be centred on technical practicality, with no mention of potential safety issues. Here in the UK we're knobbled by health and safety laws that often go way too far, so there might be legal hurdles to get by too.
It shows up the big difference between the US and UK regarding phone service supply. Here in the UK, 95% of service provision is underground, all the way into the houses and businesses, especially in built up areas. Even in rural areas, it's now rare to see aerial cable runs, just the final distribution box fanning out to individual houses from a single pole. Overhead electric supply is even rarer, apart from 11kv and up
The discussion here seems to be centred on technical practicality, with no mention of potential safety issues. Here in the UK we're knobbled by health and safety laws that often go way too far, so there might be legal hurdles to get by too.
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