Wind and Solar vs Coal, Gasoline, Nuclear

[Hillhater]

The problem with Natural gas is it seems limited. Start using a lot of it and the companies quickly raise up the price…..

It is only limited by green political policies !
There is plenty of NGas to fuel the planet for the forseeable future (hundreds of years ) but poorly thought out environmental policies have seriously restricted gas exploration and production in the “Western” countries, such that supply is restricted and hence prices are artificially forced up in times of high demand, generating huge profits for gas suppliers.
It is a self inflicted problem created by all those who voted in politicians with green policies.
PS.. US gas prices are about ten times cheaper than in Europe currently !

 

[ZeroEm]

by Hillhater » Sep 07 2022 8:27pm

ZeroEm wrote: ↑Sep 07 2022 6:58am
The problem with Natural gas is it seems limited. Start using a lot of it and the companies quickly raise up the price…..

It is only limited by green political policies !
There is plenty of NGas to fuel the planet for the forseeable future (hundreds of years ) but poorly thought out environmental policies have seriously restricted gas exploration and production in the “Western” countries, such that supply is restricted and hence prices are artificially forced up in times of high demand, generating huge profits for gas suppliers.
It is a self inflicted problem created by all those who voted in politicians with green policies.
PS.. US gas prices are about ten times cheaper than in Europe currently !

Never said there was not plenty of it. Don't think it's green political policies or we switching to politics?

Spent 17yrs in oil/Gas well repair and drilling. If a well does not produce enough gas to run or connect a pipeline they vent it to the atmosphere. They have gas leaks everywhere. If there was not very much of it they tend to the issues.

The tundra is starting to make tons of gas, waste disposal can make gas. It's everywhere, we only pay attention when something blows up.

Gas is still hydrocarbons and need to move more to renewable methane, should have done this 40yrs ago. Used to run the work trucks on propane. This was back when spark plugs needed cleaned or replaced every 20k miles. If it ran on propane the oil would be clean at oil changes and spark plugs would look like new at 80k mile. I laugh when they push a motor oil that keeps the engine clean, it's not the oil it's the Gasoline full of trash, water and additives.

You know Coal mines produce some of the cleanest Methane! Don't mine coal, drill into it and produce the gas. Had a chance in the early 90's to go down under and train people to drill and get methane well's producing. You don't need oil wells to get gas.

With that said, still pro gas. Just know the more popular it gets the price is going to shoot up. So i'm now going depend on gas.

People that lived close to a well with gas was allowed to get all they wanted for free, for there home, not to sell. You can run all types of cooling devices as well as heating and generators. Not much you can't do with gas.

 

[Hillhater]

Gas,..being a fossil fuel,…is deliberately restricted in its production, development of new wells, fracking fields, and exploration. Authorities around the world have initiated direct policies aimed at reducing the use of gas as part of the GND/Net Zero targets.

Gas is still hydrocarbons and need to move more to renewable methane,….

?.?.. but Natural Gas IS mostly Methane ,..??

 

[Voltron]

One thing you can't do with gas is use it to bring back the melted glaciers.

 

[Hillhater]

One thing you can't do with gas is use it to bring back the melted glaciers.

Sunlight wont help much with that either !

 

[Voltron]

Sure.. Sunlight is the problem, not the massive amounts of fossil fuel pollution that humans have been pumping out in the last 100 years.

 

[Voltron]

And now that both poles are getting covered with soot particles that have swirled around the planet from humans burning things, including all that coal that Australia wants to keep exporting until they wring every last dollar out of it before it's banned, the sunlight is actually a problem.
The reduced albedo and direct heating of the soot particles is radically increasing the melting rates.

 

[Ianhill]

One thing you can't do with gas is use it to bring back the melted glaciers.

Sunlight wont help much with that either !

Who you trying to fool with that.

Government acts like its going net zero carbon but in reality burn baby burn, oldest trick in the scroll.

Fool a world into putting a shotgun in its mouth with explosive ammo saying its a lollipop shame on you.

America has gone full retard with lots of advertising for oil and gas its unbelievable the deception a country go to for power it more important than the human race by the looks and hillhaters and alike are all happy enough to turn a buck while rolling some dice

 

[Hillhater]

Who you trying to fool with that...

You have an over active imagination !
Its a simple fact that sunlight wont help to bring back melted glaciers….
….neither in direct form, or indirectly via PV panels !
The glaciers will stop melting when Nature creates the circumstances for that to happen.
But you had better hope that is no time soon !

 

[Voltron]

Sunlight won't bring the ice back. But stopping dumping black soot on it for the sunlight to heat, and finding some way to stop dumping insulating gasses into the atmosphere wily nilly will be better than doing nothing and waiting for Mother Nature to fix our mess somehow.
Then the sun can go back to shining on the ice without a problem.

Your denialism about how human activity is affecting our shared planet is pretty shocking in a human that can apparently read and write.

 

[Hillhater]

Your denialism about how human activity is affecting our shared planet is pretty shocking in a human that can apparently read and write.

Whilst I admire your faith in an unproven theory, gulibility for crystal ball like predictions, and belief that humans have a Godly ability to significantly influence nature and the atmosphere….
..i prefer to go with the scientific facts !

 

[Voltron]

What would be a Godly is being able to create a world. But to be able to destroy one is sadly well within our grasp.

 

[ZeroEm]

We are supposed to be moving in to a ICE AGE, some reason we are not!

Earth is likely to take millions of years to recover from the destruction currently being inflicted by humanity, scientists have warned. A “speed limit” on the rate of evolution means it will take at least 10 million years for the world’s diversity to return to pre-human levels, according to a new study.

https://www.independent.co.uk/clima...nge-biodiversity-loss-evolution-a8860326.html

 

[Ianhill]

Your denialism about how human activity is affecting our shared planet is pretty shocking in a human that can apparently read and write.

Whilst I admire your faith in an unproven theory, gulibility for crystal ball like predictions, and belief that humans have a Godly ability to significantly influence nature and the atmosphere….
..i prefer to go with the scientific facts !

Spamming troll nothing more really, its clear cut facts no tin foil hat needed to see shit getting a little warmer the scientific facts show the type of carbon present in atmosphere has a signature that can not be denied and we have a good understanding of the process so you can spout off as much as you like im not budging on my conclusion same as you.

The ice age predictions were long before i was even born and funded by big oil for an opposing distraction thats still working to this day wake up most will and just ignore your foolish comments if they keep persisting.

 

[CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING]

Why do ya'll even respond to HH? Like not putting more CO2 in the atmosphere seems to be a logical way of combating climate change, but he doesn't even think it exists. I don't know why he's even here, or why he does this every other week :lol:

 

[Voltron]

I know facts will never change his mind. It's strictly for those who might be reading his opinions, so it isn't a denialist echo chamber.

 

[CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING]

I know facts will never change his mind. It's strictly for those who might be reading his opinions, so it isn't a denialist echo chamber.

Ah, so no safe space for him then, actually makes perfect sense 8)

It is only limited by green political policies !

I wish they were that powerful. Or I can do the smart thing with no CO2 generation at all, and convert most my grid to nuclear.

 

[nicobie]

Wind and solar are great but we really cheaper batteries to make full use of them.

Hydro is also good, but It looks like it's maxed out already.

Nuclear is OK but good luck getting the public to spring for the $ needed for more plants. The extremely bad reports put out by most environmentally conscience organisations have ruined nuclear's public relations.

I think we ought to try to tap geothermal to fill the gap wind and solar leaves. All it will take is a really, really, really deep hole topped with a on/off valve that can withstand the hell's furies that would be released. Russia has already tried but stopped drilling at 40k feet.



According to some, this is the entrance to hell.

 

[Hillhater]

Wind and solar are great but we really cheaper batteries to make full use of them.

It also needs another planets worth of copper , silver, and other rare earths to make an indent on the total energy supply !
W & S will never do the job,…
..before you even get 20% od the capacity installed, you have to turn around and start replacing the initial installs, as well as all the new ones.

I think we ought to try to tap geothermal to fill the gap wind and solar leaves. All it will take is a really, really, really deep hole topped with a on/off valve that can withstand the hell's furies that would be released. Russia has already tried but stopped drilling at 40k feet.

2022-09-10 13_02_55-The deepest hole we have ever dug - BBC Future.png

According to some, this is the entrance to hell.

There is new drilling technology and plans to do that deep drilling for Geothermal, but i doubt it will get the backing required to achieve its potential

https://scienceinfo.net/plan-to-drill-20km-deep-to-produce-geothermal-energy.html

 

[Hillhater]

….its clear cut facts no tin foil hat needed to see shit getting a little warmer ….

… sure , but the cause and magnitude of the increase is highly debateable.

…the scientific facts show the type of carbon present in atmosphere has a signature that can not be denied …...

Indeed it has,…
… and it shows that Anthropogenic CO2 is still at the same level it was 50 yrs ago, whilst the total CO2 ppm just keeps on increasing ?

 

[CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING]

Nuclear is OK but good luck getting the public to spring for the $ needed for more plants. The extremely bad reports put out by most environmentally conscience organisations have ruined nuclear's public relations.

I think we ought to try to tap geothermal to fill the gap wind and solar leaves. All it will take is a really, really, really deep hole topped with a on/off valve that can withstand the hell's furies that would be released. Russia has already tried but stopped drilling at 40k feet.

They had for awhile, but the number of nuclear plants that have been started or returned to function suggests the winds are changing. For new plants in the US you've got Vogtle now running, NuScale is putting in 5 or 7 up in Idaho, Terrapower making several test cases, and the TVA is shopping around. For the older ones, Germany is now under intense pressure to restart it's remaining 3 instead of it's coal plants, and I already posted about France restarting all of theirs to power Germany. You've also got Cali keeping theirs open down south too. Like obviously implicit bias stands, but this is the only social platform I'm on that has anyone against nuclear now, I can't help but feel like the opposition is a frankly trumped-up boogeyman of easily swatted NIMBYs and not an organized "force".

I think I've heard of Quaise energy; it's a neat idea, my only wonder is how they keep the steam from the geothermal hot enough making it's trip back to the turbine. The distance back itself is a limitation when the earth acts like a giant heat sink.

It also needs another planets worth of copper , silver, and other rare earths to make an indent on the total energy supply !
W & S will never do the job,…

… and it shows that Anthropogenic CO2 is still at the same level it was 50 yrs ago, whilst the total CO2 ppm just keeps on increasing ?

Prove it.

 

[CONSIDERABLE SHOUTING]

Speaking of Terra Power, they're starting to build their first Molten Salt reactor in Idaho.

 

[JackFlorey]

They had for awhile, but the number of nuclear plants that have been started or returned to function suggests the winds are changing. For new plants in the US you've got Vogtle now running

Vogtle isn't running yet. They just got approval to load fuel and right now they are hoping to start up Vogtle 3 in 1Q 2023. If they stick to that it will be almost exactly 20 years from first internal proposal to first power.

That and the cost are the two main problems with nuclear. It's the most expensive form of power we have, by far. I am all for nuclear for base load; it's ideal for that purpose, and the reactor runs most efficiently/most safely when it is pumping out 100% power 24/7.

But beyond that - I don't think we can afford it. I'd hate to see poor people unable to afford power. And the time frame means that any decision we make now won't be providing power until 2042.

NuScale is putting in 5 or 7 up in Idaho, Terrapower making several test cases, and the TVA is shopping around.

I hope the SMR's are successful, but they are a new technology, and like any new technology, there will be hiccups in implementation even if the idea is sound.

For the older ones, Germany is now under intense pressure to restart it's remaining 3 instead of it's coal plants, and I already posted about France restarting all of theirs to power Germany.

Agreed there. Nuclear plants that are up and running have already amortized their construction costs and now provide fairly cheap zero carbon power. (Provided they are brought up to current safety standards, which isn't hard in most cases.)

 

[JackFlorey]

I know facts will never change his mind. It's strictly for those who might be reading his opinions, so it isn't a denialist echo chamber.

For people like HH, climate change denial is a religion. And it's pointless to argue with people about their religion.

 

[nicobie]

And it's pointless to argue with people about their religion.

Ain't that the truth.

Politics has devolved into a type of religion too, with some of the players even achieving cult status. Just look at trump's flock.