Bikeon, "cassette drive" torque sensing motor

I vaguely remember someone saying (Grusome?) that the bike couldn't be ridden with the motor in the off position.
Is that true?
I find the resistance quite high, maybe on other bikes (or in a low gear) it works better. But in any case, it takes literally 30 seconds to unclip and remove the motor, and since it's relatively light it's easy to attach it to a bag or rack. On my rack mounted bag I can clip the rotor through the bag handles, and that holds it securely on top.
 
We do offer the device without battery as well.

All electronic components are rated above that voltage and should work, but I never tested any other batteries except 36V and 48V. And that is the only reason we do not recommend any other battery voltage at the moment. Later we may expand the battery voltage range.


We will offer more options later, we do have some ideas, but it will take some time to get there.
What's the capacitor in it rated at?
 
I find the resistance quite high, maybe on other bikes (or in a low gear) it works better. But in any case, it takes literally 30 seconds to unclip and remove the motor, and since it's relatively light it's easy to attach it to a bag or rack. On my rack mounted bag I can clip the rotor through the bag handles, and that holds it securely on top.
I'd love to see a video of unclipping the BikeOn and attaching it to the rack. Do you wear gloves when you do that?
 
Could you please send me a picture of your bike?

We’ll extend your trial period by an additional week to give you time to address the fitting issues. Feel free to reach out if you have any questions or concerns.

Aram
 

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Up close test fitting of BikeOn to new 11-36T cassette:
 

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I find the resistance quite high, maybe on other bikes (or in a low gear) it works better. But in any case, it takes literally 30 seconds to unclip and remove the motor, and since it's relatively light it's easy to attach it to a bag or rack. On my rack mounted bag I can clip the rotor through the bag handles, and that holds it securely on top.
I was looking at riding my road bike without power for half of my ride, which is usually in the 30-40 mile range.
Spaceman says the motor can be turned on, but in the 'no assistance' mode, which gives enough power to cancel out the drag.
I'm wondering if the bottle battery would give enough range to allow me to do half my ride in the 'no assistance' mode and the other half with one of the lower power levels.
Weight is a concern for me.
 
Weight is a concern for me.
Don't psych yourself out. Bike weight really only matters when you're lifting the bike. The rest of the time, you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference.

Adding mass of batteries is like a pedal cyclist adding mass of thigh muscles. It's not a problem even if you want to see it that way.
 
I'd love to see a video of unclipping the BikeOn and attaching it to the rack. Do you wear gloves when you do that?
Nope, don't have to, because I switched to waxing the chain about 1000 miles ago!
I can only highly recommend that, because it really cuts down on the messiness (no more chain ring calf tattoos) and chain maintenance (I rewax two chains every 700 miles, and switch chains every 350 to 400 miles), even if you are not swapping the latest BikeOn motor iteration in and out ;)
While riding I had to remove the BikeOn only once, on the return from the Turnbull Canyon ascent, when I kicked out the (180 degree bent) cable at the motor at 20 mph and apparently fried the controller. No video, because I didn't have my tripod with me ;)

Maybe Aram wants to make a video? Or maybe there is already one? I'm currently in the phase where I just want to leave the motor installed and enjoy it...
 
In reply to spambait's post 254 (reply with quote does not work, I guess because that post has no actual text): I haven't seen that many cassettes. Yep, that derailleur (why don't we call it 'derailer' in English, and save ourselves a few letters and mispronunciations?) lever arm looks like it would interfere. On my Shimano 105 the cable attachment point is in line with the derailer body that gently leans against the BikeOn rotor protection profile when in the slowest accessible gear, so no danger of rotor collision there.
 
I was looking at riding my road bike without power for half of my ride, which is usually in the 30-40 mile range.
Spaceman says the motor can be turned on, but in the 'no assistance' mode, which gives enough power to cancel out the drag.
I'm wondering if the bottle battery would give enough range to allow me to do half my ride in the 'no assistance' mode and the other half with one of the lower power levels.
Weight is a concern for me.
As I said (but failed to produce a video...), unclipping takes less time than typing this sentence.
But zero assistance mode also works well; it might be just the tiniest bit of assistance above zero, but I'd guess that maybe just like with mechanical watches most people prefer the smallest bit of gain (+1 s/day) over the smallest bit of loss (-1s/day).

Regarding range: it totally depends on what speed you choose. I get 8 Wh/mile (30 miles with a 250 Wh battery) at 25% assistance level and going 17 mph average speed, and 15 Wh/mile (16 miles with a 250 Wh battery) at 45% assistance level and going 21 mph. There's probably some headwind/tailwind and slight grade offsets in these numbers as well, but the power vs speed calculators at Motor Simulator - Tools and An interactive model-based calculator of cycling power vs. speed work very well for this kind of estimate.
 
Don't psych yourself out. Bike weight really only matters when you're lifting the bike. The rest of the time, you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference.

Adding mass of batteries is like a pedal cyclist adding mass of thigh muscles. It's not a problem even if you want to see it that way.
Bike weight does matter if you ride hills or into headwinds. Don’t psych yourself out.
 
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In reply to spambait's post 254 (reply with quote does not work, I guess because that post has no actual text): I haven't seen that many cassettes. Yep, that derailleur (why don't we call it 'derailer' in English, and save ourselves a few letters and mispronunciations?) lever arm looks like it would interfere. On my Shimano 105 the cable attachment point is in line with the derailer body that gently leans against the BikeOn rotor protection profile when in the slowest accessible gear, so no danger of rotor collision there.
I’m finding all modern shimano mountain derailleurs have this curved arm, but many of their road derailleurs are still in line. Had to dig up an old early 2000s Deore derailleur I’m going to try. I know it can pull to 8 cogs; I’ll see if it can pull to 10.
 
I'd love to see a video of unclipping the BikeOn and attaching it to the rack. Do you wear gloves when you do that?
Here is a video showing how to install the device (it's an older version, but most steps are the same). To uninstall, simply reverse the process. Let me know if you have any further questions.
We also have other videos about the device on our YouTube channel.
 
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As Gruesome said, it depends on your riding style and terrain. One option is to have a spare battery, and swapping it takes just seconds.
If the whole ride is 30 to 40 miles, then it's very unlikely that you would need a spare battery for the return half, especially since you could keep an eye on the charge (I use a simple voltmeter strapped to the top tube) and lower your speed (or assist level) a bit if it looks like you are getting close to the lower cutoff.
 
Why does this cost 1250 USD? You do realize that there are much cheaper alternatives like Toseven DM02 or TSDZ8. Even overpriced CYC Photon is cheaper. Middrive motors will always give you much better riding experience (more torque due to higher gear reduction). Weight distribution is also better with middrives motors.(Center and lower)
 
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Middrive motors will always give you much better riding experience (more torque due to higher gear reduction).

Through-the-gears mid drives severely tear up your bike. That's a big enough problem that I left them behind years ago, because I want my bike to work every time I need it.

Yes, there are some advantages to mid drives. To me, none of them are good enough to tolerate unnecessarily breaking my bike.

This weird new alternative to a hub motor similarly seems to have more downside than upside versus using a hub, but at least it's less likely to leave you pushing your bike than a mid drive is.
 
Of course some 10lbs Chinese mid drives are gonna be less expensive than an American made, low quantity, bleeding edge product.

I personally don't find those Chinese mid drives interesting at all. Different strokes for different folks, man.

This would be a great motor for a flat area. The 4lbs weight is awesome.
 
Why does this cost 1250 USD? You do realize that there are much cheaper alternatives like Toseven DM02 or TSDZ8. Even overpriced CYC Photon is cheaper. Middrive motors will always give you much better riding experience (more torque due to higher gear reduction). Weight distribution is also better with middrives motors.(Center and lower)
It is expensive, no doubt.(*) Regarding the alternatives, no, I do absolutely not realize that, because it is not true. I couldn't and still can't find a retrofit mid drive with acceptable pedal stance ('Q factor'). All of them are inches, not mm's, inches too wide, compared to the 135 mm or thereabouts Q factor of my Roadlite 6. Maybe borderline acceptable for mountain biking. My alternatives were a front or rear hub motor, but there didn't seem to be good torque sensor options for my PF-86 bottom bracket, and ignoring that (I still don't know whether I absolutely need a torque sensor) I also didn't want to replace a wheel. So the apples to apples alternative would then be to buy the factory e-bike version of my bike. Well, I didn't want a second (third, rather) bike either. So that's that. Your situation might be completely different.

(*): I got a really good deal by ordering via Xnito, and saved almost 300 bucks. Still expensive though, essentially doubling the cost of my bike. Other people of course are a lot more spendy with their biking hobby/affliction... ;)
 
It is expensive, no doubt.(*) Regarding the alternatives, no, I do absolutely not realize that, because it is not true. I couldn't and still can't find a retrofit mid drive with acceptable pedal stance ('Q factor'). All of them are inches, not mm's, inches too wide, compared to the 135 mm or thereabouts Q factor of my Roadlite 6. Maybe borderline acceptable for mountain biking. My alternatives were a front or rear hub motor, but there didn't seem to be good torque sensor options for my PF-86 bottom bracket, and ignoring that (I still don't know whether I absolutely need a torque sensor) I also didn't want to replace a wheel. So the apples to apples alternative would then be to buy the factory e-bike version of my bike. Well, I didn't want a second (third, rather) bike either. So that's that. Your situation might be completely different.

(*): I got a really good deal by ordering via Xnito, and saved almost 300 bucks. Still expensive though, essentially doubling the cost of my bike. Other people of course are a lot more spendy with their biking hobby/affliction... ;)
I only see a 10% coupon for xnito, how did you get almost $300 discount?
 
I only see a 10% coupon for xnito, how did you get almost $300 discount?
I think it was a one-time deal, and disappeared pretty much the next day. They offered essentially 20% off ('KEYSTONE PRICING 50.03% MARGIN FOR ORDERS OF 10 OR MORE ($74.70 PER HELMET)'), plus no tax. Maybe the discount was only intended for helmets? Anyways, if you told me the motor was $800, I'd still call that expensive. $600, still not cheap, compared to the price of my bike. It's hard to say what is the right price for such a device. Aram and his wife must have of order 10,000 hours put into this thing in the last 10 years. How many units do you want to recuperate that over? 100? 1000? Probably not 10,000. So, by that measure the unit is horribly underpriced. He's putting a lot more of his own effort and labor into each unit than goes say into a Rolex. And it also goes a lot faster! :cool:
 
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