Trouble setting up a CA

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wehey

10 mW
Joined
Mar 24, 2014
Messages
34
Hi folks.
I was hoping someone could help me troubleshoot the setting up of my Cycle Analyst?
I was previously running an Ezee 250rpm geared hub motor with a Baserunner controller headless (throttle wired directly to the Baserunner) and all was well with the world.
I recently added a Cycle Analyst and it’s been a bit of a puzzle to me.
The CA is plugged into the Baserunner and the throttle is plugged into the CA now. I don’t have a PAS as of yet.
The manual says that in the Speedometer setting the “Poles” should be set to 6 for my Ezee motor and my wheel circumference should be 2115mm (26 inch wheel with 2.25 tyre)
When I use this setting the wheel pulses when I apply throttle and the speedo reads something crazy like 140mph.
I have tried rotating the wheel by hand to count the amount of poles during 1 rotation of the wheel but the indicator does nothing, it doesn’t switch at all.
To get the motor to run smoothly I have increased the poles to 30 and it runs fine.
When out on the road the speedo only displays a reading when power is applied to the motor and I get 0 when just freewheeling or pedalling without assistance.
I have had to calibrate the wheel circumference to 725mm to get anywhere near the correct speedo reading when applying power.
Any ideas what I’m doing wrong?
 
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The EZ motor is geared so the motor core where the poles are being counted spins probably 5-6 times for every one revolution of the actual wheel.

You could lie to the CA about the number of poles by a factor of the gear ratio like (6 poles x 5 to 1 gearing= 30 poles)
Or I think the CA has a place where you tell it the gear ratio to correct the speed reading. Although I am not sure if I am thinking of a different system. It should be in the manual or I can check when I get home.

As for coasting, the geared motor freewheels in the forward direction. When you coast the motor is not spinning at all despite the hub and wheel turning. So if you are reading speed from the motor it will always show zero when you are off the throttle.

If you measured the hall sensor switching with a volt meter you would have to spin the motor backwards by hand to count the pole switching per revolution.

You can convert the CA to a magnetic pickup on the spokes and get correct speed that way or just adjust the settings for the gear ratios and live with the lack of speed reading while coasting.

My info above is general for most motors. I would not be surprised if Grin put a separate speed sensor on the motor to avoid this problem. Seems to me it would become an issue when using pedal assist and torque sensing.
 
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DanGT86 said:
The EZ motor is geared so the motor core where the poles are being counted spins probably 5-6 times for every one revolution of the actual wheel.

You could lie to the CA about the number of poles by a factor of the gear ratio like (6 poles x 5 to 1 gearing= 30 poles)
Or I think the CA has a place where you tell it the gear ratio to correct the speed reading. Although I am not sure if I am thinking of a different system. It should be in the manual or I can check when I get home.

As for coasting, the geared motor freewheels in the forward direction. When you coast the motor is not spinning at all despite the hub and wheel turning. So if you are reading speed from the motor it will always show zero when you are off the throttle.

If you measured the hall sensor switching with a volt meter you would have to spin the motor backwards by hand to count the pole switching per revolution.

You can convert the CA to a magnetic pickup on the spokes and get correct speed that way or just adjust the settings for the gear ratios and live with the lack of speed reading while coasting.

My info above is general for most motors. I would not be surprised if Grin put a separate speed sensor on the motor to avoid this problem. Seems to me it would become an issue when using pedal assist and torque sensing.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply.
when I got the motor I had to connect an L10 connector to it to make it compatible with the Baserunner,
Along with the usual hall and phase wires there was an additional white wire. I contacted the seller but he didn’t know what it was for. I wonder if it was a speed sensor wire, or if not a temp sensor?
 
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wehey said:
when I got the motor I had to connect an L10 connector to it to make it compatible with the Baserunner,
Click to expand...
What connector did the motor have originally? The ezees have a speed sensor, and the baserunner is supposed to automatically identify if a speed sensor is present when connecting it to the motor. Are you saying you have an extension or adapter between the motor connector and the baserunner?
 
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E-HP said:
What connector did the motor have originally? The ezees have a speed sensor, and the baserunner is supposed to automatically identify if a speed sensor is present when connecting it to the motor. Are you saying you have an extension or adapter between the motor connector and the baserunner?
Click to expand...
The motor didnt come with an L10 (it wasn’t bought from Grin)
i cant remember what the connector was exactly but I stripped it back to bare wires and soldered in an L10 to match the Baserunner
 
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E-HP said:
On the motor sold by Grin, the white wire is speed. If that wasn't connected to the L10, then the controller will default to using the hall sensors, that only provide speed under power.
Click to expand...
Excellent, that’s exactly what’s happening…. That helps a ton.!
so maybe my next job is to wire the white wire back into the loom and see if that helps things?
 
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Also, the BR and PR controllers can automatically switch to using the hall sensor from the motor under various conditions *even if the wheel speed sensor is attached and working*.

When they do this, they may still be using the speed sensor settings for the wheel sensor, and misbehavior can occur.

If you want the CA to always and only use the wheel speed sensor, wire that direclty to the CA.

I don't know if there is a way to force the BR or PR to only and always use the wheel speed sensor...but there is a thread around here from a year or two ago that ended up being this particular problem causing their issues, and they might have more info about that. I dont' recall whose thread it was, so I don't have a link. :(
 
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E-HP said:
On the motor sold by Grin, the white wire is speed. If that wasn't connected to the L10, then the controller will default to using the hall sensors, that only provide speed under power.
Click to expand...
Bingo……
I connected the white wire back into the loom and now it works perfectly..
thanks for all the help 👍
 
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