19" Motorcycle Wheels vs 26" Bicycle Wheels (rim and tires)

[Ugrd]

Beautiful rims, cant wait to see mounted. ETA?

Probably Saturday. They are going to go on my backup bike for the moment then il move them over to my main bike, since my main bike needs new hal sensors. Its going to be laced into a 5403.

 

[gogo]

Just in case this site hasn't been posted yet:
http://www.myronsmopeds.com/category/parts/tires/

Lots of good tire information and some weights.

 

[2007blueprius]

well my rim is just in honestly I don't doubt going for a 21" it is just a tab smaller that a 26 bicycle rim in OD



this first picture standing side by side with a generic 26" ebike rim, oh about 1" shorter OD



top view, yeah me likey









wonder if this is common of MC rims but see below it has 2 valve holes almost across from each other



now this is the hub I am working with , it is my second one, who makes these things? what are they? besides no name ebay



View attachment 3

now I remember from tinkering with the last one these things get spoked dead on, no dishing and they fit an average frame, first bike I tried it on an izip, crooked frame wouldn't work, fit like a glove on a cheap Next bike



one rough measurement I am looking at about 512mm ERD, I'll get back on that

 

[Kent]

Just in case this site hasn't been posted yet:
http://www.myronsmopeds.com/category/parts/tires/

Lots of good tire information and some weights.

Thanks for posting this. Its a wonderful site with a history of the moped and moped tires.

 

[Rix]

Beautiful rims, cant wait to see mounted. ETA?

Probably Saturday. They are going to go on my backup bike for the moment then il move them over to my main bike, since my main bike needs new hal sensors. Its going to be laced into a 5403.

Very nice, please share a pic.

 

[2007blueprius]

Effective Rim Diameter 514 mm
Hub Flange Diameter 230 mm
Flange Spacing 30 mm
Diameter of a spoke hole 3 mm ( standard on ebikes.ca )

Cross pattern 1 cross
Number of spokes 36



Calculated Spoke Length: 153.3 mm.

now I wonder if I did this right, I basically measured the rim nipple seat diameter, not counting for washers or nipples I would assume adding couple mm would be in order? unless the ebikes.ca site figures some of that in

now I measured a different way also



looking at it this should account for a washer and nipple, don't you think? this calculated to 523.62 diameter yeaks I am off by 10 mm thou, I believe this is the proper ERD, am I wrong?

this calculates to 158mm spokes I think this is right?

rim diameter measured 1645mm as pictured above
the hub, I measured across 3 spoke holes, 115mm that should be R, 18 holes/3 = 6 sides
looks like flanges are 30mm on center apart

I think this is it 158mm, I best sleep on it make sure I got this right, how long does it take to get the spokes once ordered?, I best not screw this up, wonder if I can get the original spokes cut down locally and get some washers to test fit

well if you all know better let me know

 

[efMX Trials Electric Freeride]

the extra "valve hole" is for a tire bead lock..
example :

well my rim is just in honestly I don't doubt going for a 21" it is just a tab smaller that a 26 bicycle rim in OD

wonder if this is common of MC rims but see below it has 2 valve holes almost across from each other

 

[Rix]

Effective Rim Diameter 514 mm
Hub Flange Diameter 230 mm
Flange Spacing 30 mm
Diameter of a spoke hole 3 mm ( standard on ebikes.ca )

Cross pattern 1 cross
Number of spokes 36



Calculated Spoke Length: 153.3 mm.

now I wonder if I did this right, I basically measured the rim nipple seat diameter, not counting for washers or nipples I would assume adding couple mm would be in order? unless the ebikes.ca site figures some of that in

now I measured a different way also



looking at it this should account for a washer and nipple, don't you think? this calculated to 523.62 diameter yeaks I am off by 10 mm thou, I believe this is the proper ERD, am I wrong?

this calculates to 158mm spokes I think this is right?

rim diameter measured 1645mm as pictured above
the hub, I measured across 3 spoke holes, 115mm that should be R, 18 holes/3 = 6 sides
looks like flanges are 30mm on center apart

I think this is it 158mm, I best sleep on it make sure I got this right, how long does it take to get the spokes once ordered?, I best not screw this up, wonder if I can get the original spokes cut down locally and get some washers to test fit

well if you all know better let me know

Not quite clear how you got your ERD, but this is how I do it, which has proven to be accurate with my last 3 wheel builds. Measuring ERD is done with 2 nipples inserted into the rim at 6 Oclock and 12 Oclock. Measure from nipple to nipple like in the pics with the arrows. That measurments needs to be in milimeters. Then measure the length of your nipple. Multiply that by 2 and add to your you diameter measurement and that is your ERD. For example, this rim measured 15.25" from nipple to nipple. So multiply 15.25x25.4 and you get 387.35mm. My nipples were 18mm long each so multiply that by 2 and you get 36mm. Add 36 to 387.35 =423.35mm. Always round up to the neares mm on this measurement. Using Justins ebikes.ca spoke calculator input this number with the hub data into his calculator. It will give the spoke lenght in mm. On that length round down to the nearest whole mm. So if you get 119.8mm spoke lenght on the calculator, round down to 119mm.

 

[2007blueprius]

the extra "valve hole" is for a tire bead lock..
example :

well my rim is just in honestly I don't doubt going for a 21" it is just a tab smaller that a 26 bicycle rim in OD

wonder if this is common of MC rims but see below it has 2 valve holes almost across from each other

oh yeah, I read about those, had me wondering how they go in, guess these keep the tire from spinning? I remember on the dirt bike I had when younger that was always an issue, forgot how I got it to stop spinning but it wasn't a bead lock

 

[2007blueprius]

Not quite clear how you got your ERD, but this is how I do it, which has proven to be accurate with my last 3 wheel builds. Measuring ERD is done with 2 nipples inserted into the rim at 6 Oclock and 12 Oclock. Measure from nipple to nipple like in the pics with the arrows. That measurments needs to be in milimeters. Then measure the length of your nipple. Multiply that by 2 and add to your you diameter measurement and that is your ERD. For example, this rim measured 15.25" from nipple to nipple. So multiply 15.25x25.4 and you get 387.35mm. My nipples were 18mm long each so multiply that by 2 and you get 36mm. Add 36 to 387.35 =423.35mm. Always round up to the neares mm on this measurement. Using Justins ebikes.ca spoke calculator input this number with the hub data into his calculator. It will give the spoke lenght in mm. On that length round down to the nearest whole mm. So if you get 119.8mm spoke lenght on the calculator, round down to 119mm.

you managed to get me even more confused, the one pic with the green wire and a sharpie mark, I figured that wire describes the circumference at the top of the nipples which measured 1645mm I believe/ 3.14 got the diameter


should be similar if I did it our way I just don't have the nipples on hand, have yet to order the stuff, 15.25x25.4? you got me there, is that some function from diameter to spoke? oh nevermind inches to mm, yeah I basically did the same thing use that wire to approximate where the top of the nipple would fall/

now why would one round down? guess it would be a bad thing if spokes were sticking out of the nipple I rounded up, might help with the way I measured.

now what kind of hub are those ebay ones, you all don't care much for them around here, I know its not a clite, or crow or 9c or pie, prettymuch not any commonly used by es members

 

[Rix]

Not quite clear how you got your ERD, but this is how I do it, which has proven to be accurate with my last 3 wheel builds. Measuring ERD is done with 2 nipples inserted into the rim at 6 Oclock and 12 Oclock. Measure from nipple to nipple like in the pics with the arrows. That measurments needs to be in milimeters. Then measure the length of your nipple. Multiply that by 2 and add to your you diameter measurement and that is your ERD. For example, this rim measured 15.25" from nipple to nipple. So multiply 15.25x25.4 and you get 387.35mm. My nipples were 18mm long each so multiply that by 2 and you get 36mm. Add 36 to 387.35 =423.35mm. Always round up to the neares mm on this measurement. Using Justins ebikes.ca spoke calculator input this number with the hub data into his calculator. It will give the spoke lenght in mm. On that length round down to the nearest whole mm. So if you get 119.8mm spoke lenght on the calculator, round down to 119mm.

you managed to get me even more confused, the one pic with the green wire and a sharpie mark, I figured that wire describes the circumference at the top of the nipples which measured 1645mm I believe/ 3.14 got the diameter


should be similar if I did it our way I just don't have the nipples on hand, have yet to order the stuff, 15.25x25.4? you got me there, is that some function from diameter to spoke? oh nevermind inches to mm, yeah I basically did the same thing use that wire to approximate where the top of the nipple would fall/

now why would one round down? guess it would be a bad thing if spokes were sticking out of the nipple I rounded up, might help with the way I measured.

now what kind of hub are those ebay ones, you all don't care much for them around here, I know its not a clite, or crow or 9c or pie, prettymuch not any commonly used by es members

15.25 inches on the 17x1.4 rim in the pic is what I got for my initial measurement. I had to convert inches into mm and I know that 25.4mm (2.54cm) = 1 inch. Thats where that value came from. The way you measured your ERD may be close, but you cant get the actual ERD to the mm without using your intended spoke nipples for the measurement. Being that I have seen nipples vary in length from 14mm to 18mm long for MC applications, you would get an ERD variance measuring with two different sized nipples. A good example of how this can vary is taking a look at Holmes Hobbies 18x1.4 aluminum rim they are currently out of stock on. JR lists that ERD as 439mm, with his spoke nipples. I used a different nipple for the measurement and came up 444mm. Its only 5mm, but still, its an example of how things can be different. This would translate into a spoke length variance of up to 2.5mm, which wouldn't be a big deal for long nipple if it was a little short, but could be a problem with shorter nipples.

Rick

 

[2007blueprius]

yeah I am certainly missing something here I would have thought the spokes aught to be the same length regardless of nipple they ideally should reach about the top of the nipple when trued, and that is what I was trying to approximate with that green cable, I'll have another look at it make sure I get it right before I order them, I got a set of 12ga from my previous hub wheel, i'm curious if a bike shop around here has a spoke cutting machine and weather they can cut them down a bit, that would be a cheap experiment

 

[efMX Trials Electric Freeride]

for those heavy gauge spokes you will need to go to a motorcycle / moped shop..
(not the pedal bike shop) bike shop will mostly only deal with..
bicycle spokes!

if the spokes are much too long they will need to be threaded as well as cut..

yeah I am certainly missing something here I would have thought the spokes aught to be the same length regardless of nipple they ideally should reach about the top of the nipple when trued, and that is what I was trying to approximate with that green cable, I'll have another look at it make sure I get it right before I order them, I got a set of 12ga from my previous hub wheel, i'm curious if a bike shop around here has a spoke cutting machine and weather they can cut them down a bit, that would be a cheap experiment

 

[Rix]

yeah I am certainly missing something here I would have thought the spokes aught to be the same length regardless of nipple they ideally should reach about the top of the nipple when trued, and that is what I was trying to approximate with that green cable, I'll have another look at it make sure I get it right before I order them, I got a set of 12ga from my previous hub wheel, i'm curious if a bike shop around here has a spoke cutting machine and weather they can cut them down a bit, that would be a cheap experiment

You are right, if the spokes are on the long side, they will reach the top of the nipple inside of the rim regardless of what nipple was used to configure ERD, so it doesn't matter, as long as you are willing to do a little grinding if the spokes poke past the top of the nipple in the rim. But its nice when you don't have to grind spokes and risk the chance of gouging the rim from overly long spokes. But if ERD is configured with short nipples, and you come even a couple of mm short on spoke length, you may have a problem. One of the main reasons I like long spoke nipples is it gives me some margin for error. My next wheel lacing will be lacing JRH aluminum 18x1.4 rim to a Clyte 4080. My spokes are big 8g units with 18mm long nipples. Spoke calculator calls for a 120mm long spoke. Prowheel racing has precut 119mm long spokes (8G) which is why I am not using smaller 10g spokes, and its not even a concern for me that this wont work out, because I know it will. Now if I was using slightly shorter spokes with 14mm long nipples, much less thread overlap. Point I want to make is, the shorter the nipple, the more critical and precise your ERD measurement needs to be.

[quotefor those heavy gauge spokes you will need to go to a motorcycle / moped shop..][/quote]

Thanks for clarifying the efMX, when I said bike shop, I meant MC shop. That could be interpreted both ways.

Rick

 

[2007blueprius]

I see what you are doing, with the longer nipples, something to consider before ordering, irs friday anyhow, might as well wait for the weekend tinker a bit than decide

couldn't help it http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-Honda-Spoke-Set-B-10-X-158MM-1980-1986-CT110-Trail-110-97660-42156-/350977772820?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item51b7e7cd14&vxp=mtr

158mm motorcycle, tempting, i am kindof at war with myself between the washer moped setup, or just drill the rotor a bit and use full size motorcycle spokes, particularily since I can get them

ke100, ct110

http://detroit.craigslist.org/okl/mpo/4383858708.html than againlook at this stock spokes with washers, I have a feeling washers help lining up the spoke with hte hole

these http://www.ebay.com/itm/E-bike10G-12G-13G-spokes-and-nippies-freeshipping-/261447158898?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cdf770c72 are really tempting the 10 ga, I believe it was mentioned most motorcycle spokes are 9 ga, these nipples should be about as thinck, still requiring washers of course,

 

[Rix]

I see what you are doing, with the longer nipples, something to consider before ordering, irs friday anyhow, might as well wait for the weekend tinker a bit than decide

couldn't help it http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-Honda-Spoke-Set-B-10-X-158MM-1980-1986-CT110-Trail-110-97660-42156-/350977772820?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item51b7e7cd14&vxp=mtr

158mm motorcycle, tempting, i am kindof at war with myself between the washer moped setup, or just drill the rotor a bit and use full size motorcycle spokes, particularily since I can get them

ke100, ct110

http://detroit.craigslist.org/okl/mpo/4383858708.html than againlook at this stock spokes with washers, I have a feeling washers help lining up the spoke with hte hole

these http://www.ebay.com/itm/E-bike10G-12G-13G-spokes-and-nippies-freeshipping-/261447158898?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3cdf770c72 are really tempting the 10 ga, I believe it was mentioned most motorcycle spokes are 9 ga, these nipples should be about as thinck, still requiring washers of course,

Just checked out your link on eBay for the 10g spokes, they offer a lot of sizes. Damn. I wonder what kind of quality the spokes are? Stainless steel or chrome plated? For less than 20 bucks, cant be it either way.

 

[2007blueprius]

likely plain steel crap, I would not expect any extra, if so well its a bonus, I was just thinking the ebikes come with 12 ga motorcycle with 9 ga , hmm, 10 ga sounds about right, I read on previously that too thick and they are too rigid? I don't know, they are out of china and it will take forever to get here, still thinking maybe I should order a set just for gigs, or try to find enough motorcycle spokes, thing with that I have to drill the hub larger and onece its cut it is cut than I have holes too big on it too.

ahh dilemas, I got a few other things to acomplish, either way I need to make up my mind and put an order in so they will be her by the time I am ready.

 

[GiantEV]

Ok guys, I'm officially on my way to joining the 19" wheel club.

Bought the following:
- HS4080 hub motor
- Pro-Wheel 19x1.4 36-hole rim in silver (model 19-TTRSIR)
- CST 19x2.0 tire
- 19x2.0 tube
- 18/19" rim tape
- 18” rim strip (plan on using the rim tape but bought this just in case and for checking fit before lacing)

Now all I need is spokes and nipples. Is everyone going through JRH, or is there another source I should be looking into as well?

Also, has anyone here laced up a 4080(or 4065) to a Prowheel 19x1.4? If so, can you kindly give me the spoke length you used and if you recommend that size (or if yours were too long how short you would go)?

I'm thinking with all these wheel builds we should create a chart that we can share showing what motor, rim, spokes (including length), nipples, etc. were used in the build.

For example:
=======================================
MOTOR__________= Crystalyte HS4080
RIM______________= Pro-Wheel 19x1.4 36-hole
NIPPLES__________= ?
WASHERS_________= ?
SPOKES___________= ?
SPOKE LENGTH____= ?
PATTERN__________= 2-cross
=======================================

 

[Rix]

Ok guys, I'm officially on my way to joining the 19" wheel club.

Bought the following:
- HS4080 hub motor
- Pro-Wheel 19x1.4 36-hole rim in silver (model 19-TTRSIR)
- CST 19x2.0 tire
- 19x2.0 tube
- 18/19" rim tape
- 18” rim strip (plan on using the rim tape but bought this just in case and for checking fit before lacing)

Now all I need is spokes and nipples. Is everyone going through JRH, or is there another source I should be looking into as well?

Also, has anyone here laced up a 4080(or 4065) to a Prowheel 19x1.4? If so, can you kindly give me the spoke length you used and if you recommend that size (or if yours were too long how short you would go)?

I'm thinking with all these wheel builds we should create a chart that we can share showing what motor, rim, spokes (including length), nipples, etc. were used in the build.

For example:
=======================================
MOTOR__________= Crystalyte HS4080
RIM______________= Pro-Wheel 19x1.4 36-hole
NIPPLES__________= ?
WASHERS_________= ?
SPOKES___________= ?
SPOKE LENGTH____= ?
PATTERN__________= 2-cross
=======================================

I will work up the formula. Stick to 1X lacing pattern though, the angles are already extreme enough with out going to 2X or 3X, which I don't think is possible because of the large diameter of the flange. I have seen a two cross before with a cromotor, cant remember where from though. If you use 3mm spokes with 90 L bends, 6.4mm x 18mm nipples for the 3mm spokes, your ERD with the 19x1.4 is 477mm if I remember correctly. I still have a 19x1.4 PW rim and I will confirm ERD tonight, but if memory serves me well, seemed like the spoke length needed was 133mm or so. I will check and make sure. BTW, if you are not familiar with lacing and truing MC wheels, you may want to consider having Holmes Hobbies/Volt Riders build your wheel. As I commented before, I had a wheel built by them for the front and it was perfect. Other have had front and rears built by them and rave about it. Food for thought, either way, I will get you the numbers.

Rick

 

[2007blueprius]

I've looked around, the only thing besides JRH I could think of is either motorcycle spokes if you can find them in the size you need, I found a few, but max 10 pack, and pricy and I am afraid with 1 cross, as it is the nipples bend a bit, forget about 2 cross, 9 ga motorcycle spokes may be too much, the other option was 10 ga from china, not that patient, I think JRH is it, it worked for so many, I had some restrain as how it would seat with the washers, but I come to think the washers may help with the angle,

still debating what size to order, I double checked everything, my 21" circumference is 1645 mm,

erd figured 523.6

with a cheap ebay 1 kw motor I figured 157.9 mm using the ebikes calculator, I'm thinking to go for the 157, figured they stretch some therefore Rix recommended to round down, should I push my luck and get 156mm? how tall were the Jrh nipples? some input please, I won't hold you responsible , think I'll have mine cut on Monday so I got some time to scratch my nogen a bit.

 

[Ch00paKabrA]

Got some things in today. Shinko 244 19" with a Pro Wheel 19" Blue, I wanted red but they were out.

Im just waiting for the 12g spokes from Holmes and il get started lacing it up Il post some pictures of it completely laced up and finished.

I was amazed at how big it was hahaha, it is just going to barely fit onto my frame.

Cheers,
Ugrd

Very Nice!!!!

I am going with blue rims for my DH Comp Build as well. I was a Yamaha guy when I rode dirt-bikes. I went for the wider rims though; 1.6 up front and 2.15 in the rear. I am not worried about the width though since I am extending the swing arm 2 inches. I ordered an IRC GP1 to see if it really weighs 5 lbs. If it does, then I will get another one; if not then I will probably go with the shinkos.

I also ordered some aluminum tapered washers. I just ordered a few since they are pricey to see if they fit. If they do, I will share the link. Otherwise there is no need.

Now I just have to decide on the motor.

 

[2007blueprius]

I remember you pointing out that tire, DK had it listed at 6 and a little bit for a 21'' I haven't ordered a tire yet I'll be looking forward to your feedback, its that or the Pirelli forgot what its called 6.5 lbs according to DH

 

[Ugrd]

Spokes came today. Very nicely packaged from Holmes A+

I got 124mm 12 gauge for my 5403.

And here she is laced up. Not everything on there is tightened but it fits! Going to try it out tomorrow hopefully.

-Ugrd

(Sorry for the large pictures)

 

[Rix]

Ok guys, I'm officially on my way to joining the 19" wheel club.

Bought the following:
- HS4080 hub motor
-
Now all I need is spokes and nipples. Is everyone going through JRH, or is there another source I should be looking into as well?

Also, has anyone here laced up a 4080(or 4065) to a Prowheel 19x1.4? If so, can you kindly give me the spoke length you used and if you recommend that size (or if yours were too long how short you would go)?

I'm thinking with all these wheel builds we should create a chart that we can share showing what motor, rim, spokes (including length), nipples, etc. were used in the build.

For example:
=======================================
MOTOR__________= Crystalyte HS4080
RIM______________= Pro-Wheel 19x1.4 36-hole
NIPPLES__________= ?
WASHERS_________= ?
SPOKES___________= ?
SPOKE LENGTH____= ?
PATTERN__________= 2-cross
=======================================

Giant EV, here you go

Effective Rim Diameter 471mm
Hub Flange Diameter 232mm
Flange Spacing 46mm
Diameter of a spoke hole 4mm
Cross pattern cross 1X
Number of spokes 36

Calculated Spoke Length: 132mm

Break down. I measured my 19x1.4 PW with 18mm spokes 17.125 inches. Converted to mm and multiplied by 25.4 gave me 435mm rounded up, then added the length of the nipple X 2 for 36 and ERD came out to 471mm. Glad I measured it, for some reason, I had 477 stuck in my head. The 4080 and 4065 Hub flange spoke hole diameter from the Crystalyte's website states 231.2mm. I has spoken with a couple of 4065/4080 owners, they have reported 233mm based on their measurements, I spilt the difference and rounded to 232mm. Flange spacing is listed at 46mm. I find this strange because the much bigger 54xx series is 45mm. Lace patern is 1X, spokes 36. Your spoke length is 132mm as computed by the Justin's Ebikes.ca spoke length calculator. I have used Justin's online calculator on all of my MC hubbie wheel builds, its accurate and I have built 3 successful wheels using it. If there is a concern that your hub motor diameter is off my a mm, don't worry, that translates into only .5mm difference in spoke length. Not a big deal at all. Hopefully with in the next 2 weeks, I will have my 4080 and get it laced up to my 18x1.4 rim.


Ugrd, coming along nicely, please post some pics when finished.

Rick

 

[Rix]

Effective Rim Diameter 514 mm
Hub Flange Diameter 230 mm
Flange Spacing 30 mm
Diameter of a spoke hole 3 mm ( standard on ebikes.ca )

Cross pattern 1 cross
Number of spokes 36



Calculated Spoke Length: 153.3 mm.

now I wonder if I did this right, I basically measured the rim nipple seat diameter, not counting for washers or nipples I would assume adding couple mm would be in order? unless the ebikes.ca site figures some of that in

now I measured a different way also

[looking at it this should account for a washer and nipple, don't you think? this calculated to 523.62 diameter yeaks I am off by 10 mm thou, I believe this is the proper ERD, am I wrong?

this calculates to 158mm spokes I think this is right?

rim diameter measured 1645mm as pictured above
the hub, I measured across 3 spoke holes, 115mm that should be R, 18 holes/3 = 6 sides
looks like flanges are 30mm on center apart

I think this is it 158mm, I best sleep on it make sure I got this right, how long does it take to get the spokes once ordered?, I best not screw this up, wonder if I can get the original spokes cut down locally and get some washers to test fit

well if you all know better let me know

07blueprius, I think you are going to be really close with your spoke length. Would you entertain something for me? Measure the inside diameter of your 21x1.6 rim from spoke hole #1 to spoke hole #19 in inches. Tell me what that number is in mm. If you measure in inches, round to the nearest 16th inch rounding down. Since I don't have this rim, on a hunch, If the well depth is similar or the same as the depth on the 19x1.4,I am guessing your inside diameter will be really close between 20 1/16th inch (20.0625) and 20 1/8th (20.125) inches for inner diameter. If your well depth is deeper, it could be 20" even or even 19 7/8th (19.875) or so. What I want to do is guestimate your ERD with 18mm long nipples and put into the spoke calculator and see how close we are on numbers. With your measurement, I can guestimate your ERD because I know my 18mm nipples inserted into the spoke hole poke out with about 12mm or so on my 19x1.4. Provided your rim is the same thickness, this will allow me to determine ERD.