Adding sensors to a Astro 3210 motor

[drewjet]

Ah, that makes sense now thanks for the explanation.

Interesting that the hall I pulled out of my dishwasher motor did not need the resistor. It simply either turned power on or off.

Is the resistor is only needed when testing? When hooked to a speed control it is not needed, is that correct? Thanks for helping the electronically challenged.

Drew

 

[gwhy!]

Hi DJ,
Most controllers have these pull up's built into the controller so you do not have to worry about them.

 

[Scorefield]

Looking forward to see it running and hope everything will go well.
Anyone got a video soon please.
coughInfineon.

 

[Burtie]

The sensored astro seems to work ok on the bench

I still have a few small tweaks to do to the sensor plate design, but it seems good so-far:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbCYDYIFW80
[youtube]AbCYDYIFW80[/youtube]

 

[liveforphysics]

Burtie! You're awesome! Great work!

 

[AussieJester]

Burtie! You're awesome! Great work!

+1 you da man Burtie!

KiM

 

[Scorefield]

Holy smoke, I just fell down off my chair
You are awesome..
Thanks a lot for the vid.*jumping up and down*

 

[Burtie]

Thanks for the encouragement guys!

I tried the same trick with the motor wired delta and made the following observations:

1) The hall sensor group needed to be moved by about 12 (mechanical) degrees to minimise the no-load current in delta.
See angle between pen mark and securing tab. Without this adjustment, the motor ran slowly, was very noisy and took 6 amps unloaded.

2) There seemed to be no acceptable compromise between the delta and wye hall group positioning that would work well for both configurations.
In a position mid way between the two, the no load Y current was almost double at 1 amp.
( I guess sensorless controllers do have some good points :wink: )


3) I saw the same expected efficiency loss due to recirculating currents in delta as discussed here:

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=13760&start=45#p244398

The no-load current was 3.5 amps in delta, as opposed to 0.6 amp in wye, even after the timing had been adjusted.

 

[kevo]

Very awesome Burtie! Are kits for other Astro owners in the future?

Thanks for all,
Kevo

 

[12p3phPMDC]

Great Reporting Burtie!


Sensorless controllers automatically discover the timing due to back emf.
Sensored controllers start better....
So, If we could only run sensorless in Delta and sensored in Y. :lol:
You can start with a lower Kv in Y, and switch to Delta when you want to switch.

It would be cool to have a controller with adjustable timing tables with a digital input
that will switch between tables or static advance or retard settings.

Ah....no free rides ever, especially when you are trying to get the most out of something.

It reminds me of the timing tables in an ICE engine controller. The two controllers
that I've setup both have timing tables that allow one to advance or retard the timing based
on speed. It would be very flexible even if all you needed was static advance/retard but
could optimize with a table vs speed. (edit: Tables are two-d with load/vacuum/or throttle position too).

 

[Burtie]

Hmmm, -ebike controller with adjustable timing tables, sounds like a nice idea!

Anyone out there fancy a PIC / Infineon firmware project?? could integrate the D-Y switch in the FET output stage as well

Hell, I might even have a crack at it one day, but it wont be quick!

As an interim solution I wondered about more slots in the plate for a second hall group to run delta. Could parallel the outputs of the two hall groups and just turn on power the group that was required

Burtie.

 

[Burtie]

Very awesome Burtie! Are kits for other Astro owners in the future?

Thanks for all,
Kevo

Hi kevo,
Yes I will look into the cost of getting a number of these discs and plates made up soon, as a sort of kit

Burtie

 

[Ypedal]

Put me down for one ! :wink:

 

[johnrobholmes]

Same here, I want!

 

[Scorefield]

Put me down for one ! :wink:

Same here, I want!

Sign me up for one, please.

 

[matt_in_mtl]

Hmmm, -ebike controller with adjustable timing tables, sounds like a nice idea!

Anyone out there fancy a PIC / Infineon firmware project??

You mean something like this?
http://scolton.blogspot.com/2010/01/3ph-duo-wrap-up-part-1-field-oriented.html
A very interesting read, he is going a couple steps further too though.

Very cool results Burtie, very cool!

-Matt

 

[Burtie]

Good find Matt,

We need that guy here with us on the sphere! :wink:



On the subject of cooling, -If you can't fix the cause, then just treat the symptoms:

How about these fins to dissipate the heat generated by those recirculating currents

They are the ones that Cyclone sell to keep their heat problems in check. Almost perfect fit on the astro.

 

[kevo]

Burtie,
You are another hero in the Endless-Sphere among us lesser mortals!
Definitely sign me up for your Hall Sensor holder when they become available.

Regarding using Cyclone heat sinks for Astros, doesn't Cyclone only sell these with their Cyclone kits?
Is there an alternative way to just buy the heat sinks for us Astro folks?

-Kevo

 

[dbaker]

Burtie,

Great work! I am waiting for a 3220 to arrive and am interested in a kit. I already got the Hall sensors.

Dave

 

[Grinhill]

Is there an alternative way to just buy the heat sinks for us Astro folks?

-Kevo

Hey Kevo, Recumpence made some heatsinks for Astros a while back, send him a pm, he may still have some. 8)

 

[etard]

Burtie, you are the man!! You didn't pop your head in on this video, we missed your smiley face. This is great work, will you be designing a HXT sensor plate? Put me down for one if so.

Shane Colton is one smart dude, I followed his progress from two year ago, I invited him on here, cause his work parrallels everything that goes on here, but I think he is more tuned in on the robot front.

I think if Burtie, Fechter, Gary, Nicobie, MWKeefer, and Doctorbass got together (I know I'm missing a board genius or 20, our talent pool is DEEP, oh Bigmoose, see :lol: ) together on this delta\wye switchboard you guys could crush it out in no time. Sorry if I volunteered anybody that might be up to thier ears in other projects ...cough BMS...cough.

Another thought I had was, what if we could contact an EE Professor of some renowned school to get his students to solve our problems, we could get these things done much quicker, maybe we could just setup a preorder system to pay for components? I am quite ignorant on what these students actually do at the higher levels, so forgive me.

 

[AussieJester]

I am quite ignorant on what these students actually do at the higher levels, so forgive me.

I'm not I seen a heap of American teen College based movies, they have kick ass parties etard, they call them "keggers" and all the chicks are drop dead gorgeous with fake breastassess... You probably will be surprised to learn also, they aren't actually in class much at all, leaving all study to the night before exams... while of course consuming copious amounts of beer and pizza resulting in waking up late for the exam start time

KiM

 

[Jeremy Harris]

If you want these finned can-type heatsinks, then take a look at those sold as oil filter coolers, like these: http://www.carbuildersolutions.co.uk/oil_filter_cooler.htm

There are almost certainly cheaper places to buy them than that link, it was just the first that popped up when I googled. I've used these on aircraft oil filters and found that they made an appreciable difference to oil temperature. I can't see why they wouldn't work just the same on a motor, it would be just a matter of finding one the right size.

On the topic of delta/wye wiring and losses, then what Burtie has found mirrors the stuff I found out a year or so ago when converting outrunners from delta to wye. The thread is around here somewhere, but I didn't make much of the higher Io in delta, as I run my motors exclusively in wye.

Jeremy

 

[Dee Jay]

I seen a heap of American teen College based movies, they have kick ass parties etard, they call them "keggers" and all the chicks are drop dead gorgeous with fake breastassess...

Keggers aren't really my kind of movies..

..more of a frock wearing Judy Garland movies fan *rim shot* but I gave the "The Hangover" a chance and I gotta admit

I

Laughed

My

Ass

Off

 

[damcard]

If you want these finned can-type heatsinks, then take a look at those sold as oil filter coolers, like these: http://www.carbuildersolutions.co.uk/oil_filter_cooler.htm

Nice find. This should be added to a resource page. -David