Are E-Bikes a technological step up or down from horses?

[LockH]

"... and they need an hour or more attention and care every day just to be maintained."
Yes. Reminds me of some "fillies" I have known.

 

[cal3thousand]

Don't forget:
1 horse + 1 horse can produce many horses
1 ebike + 1 ebike = 2 broken ebikes

Uh... not if you have 2 mares or 2 stallions

And yes, that last equation hits home way too hard


To the OP, an ebike would easily surpass a horse in terms of travel if all roads were paved. But the ebike would have to be equipped properly.

And finally, horses only provide 1 horse power. While an ebike can clearly have more.

That pretty much settles it in my mind. Thank you.

To me this means e-bikes are, in a way, capable of a sort of "time travel", technologically speaking. E-bikes are right in between horses and gas vehicles and have really never had their true day in the sun. By choosing to ride an e-bike we are, in effect, going back and forward in time at the same time and living it. When e-bikes were first invented (and bicycles, in general), they were so quickly superseded by gas powered vehicles, people didn't really have a chance to live in the world of e-bikes as a dominant transportation device.

YES!! the ebike was trampled due to cheap fuel. And now that the costs for fuel and its use have gone up, our electro horses are getting a chance

 

[LockH]

Ummm... Make that a flying chance maybe. (My first sailing dinghy/boat I named "Pegasus". No bearing on horses there of course.)

 

[Goathead]

I think history has answered this already. Horses are a lot of work.

This from the Henry Ford Organization:
As a farm boy, Henry Ford disliked horses and the drudgery of farm labor. As an industrialist, he sought to improve the farmer's life through the mechanization of farm work. Beginning about 1906, Henry Ford directed his engineers to devise an agricultural tractor to replace the horse on the farm. At the time, most tractors weighed more than two tons and cost around $1,000. Henry Ford hoped to create a small, inexpensive tractor that most farmers could afford. Literally, a Model T for the soil.
http://www.thehenryford.org/exhibits/pic/2003/03_aug.asp#more

Also, there was a huge bicycle fad at about this same time, as noted in popular song:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daisy_Bell

I'm just not seeing any way in which a horse would be a step up . . . except in some very narrow circumstances and even then you can still get a DUI on a horse.

 

[LockH]

Oh, I dunno. The Husky dog team are warmer than my rusty steed (ebike.) You know, if I can't cuddle with those "Eskimo" ladies.

 

[amberwolf]

This is kind of an odd question I've been pondering for some time. Strictly in an ease of travel context, are modern electric bicycles a technological step ahead or behind horses? Meaning, taking a moderately high quality e-bike motor and assuming all associated technologies like a place to recharge we're available, would a traveler say, in colonial times, be better off traveling by e-bike or horse? Or are both horse and e-bike about the same in travel output? Distance is more important than speed to me since, compared to a car, both horse and e-bike are pretty slow.

One pertinent question not asked in your OP is: Where are you riding?

If it's in a city, on streets, etc., or even relatively flat terrain, I'd say ebikes have horses beat hands down, simply because you can pack more power and range into a bike than a horse, if you have either grid power or a solar charging setup available to fast charge the bike..

If it's in rough terrain, especially where there are no real paths, then there you have a potential for the horse to win out. Might also win out in mud, shallow water, river fording, etc., although you could build an EV to do any or all of those things, it wouldn't necessarily be a regular ebike.

 

[Cephalotus]

Imho you have to compare solar powered e-bikes with horses.

Here is an excample: http://www.bentrideronline.com/?p=8702 200km/day (and day after day) seems to be possible.

You need much less area of solar panels to keep the ebike running (not counting kcals for the human) compared to the area you need to feed a horse. On the other hand horses do not need mined minerals to be made.

 

[.nomad]

Imho you have to compare solar powered e-bikes with horses.

Here is an excample: http://www.bentrideronline.com/?p=8702 200km/day (and day after day) seems to be possible.

You need much less area of solar panels to keep the ebike running (not counting kcals for the human) compared to the area you need to feed a horse. On the other hand horses do not need mined minerals to be made.

That's a lot of panel but it's good to know it can work. Eventually, I plan to purchase one of the flexible fold out solar panel systems so I can charge my bicycle battery mostly when stopped. Though I will keep at least one panel out on my trailer while moving.


Including less area needed to charge an e-bike, horses also do not have regenerative braking or multiple ways to refuel. Almost any energy source can be converted into electricity, including fire. Right now we have camping gear that can recharge your phone with a small fire. It's not the best for the environment and it wouldn't be my first go-to energy source but perhaps there will be ways to recharge an e-bike with a large camp fire in the future. It would be useful in a pinch.

Not to get off topic but, in an emergency, it may be possible to charge batteries with direct fire to solar panel energy transfer. At least these guys are experimenting with the idea:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qthjiXgzRDA&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DqthjiXgzRDA

 

[.nomad]

This is kind of an odd question I've been pondering for some time. Strictly in an ease of travel context, are modern electric bicycles a technological step ahead or behind horses? Meaning, taking a moderately high quality e-bike motor and assuming all associated technologies like a place to recharge we're available, would a traveler say, in colonial times, be better off traveling by e-bike or horse? Or are both horse and e-bike about the same in travel output? Distance is more important than speed to me since, compared to a car, both horse and e-bike are pretty slow.

One pertinent question not asked in your OP is: Where are you riding?


If it's in rough terrain, especially where there are no real paths, then there you have a potential for the horse to win out. Might also win out in mud, shallow water, river fording, etc., although you could build an EV to do any or all of those things, it wouldn't necessarily be a regular ebike.

For the purpose of comparing, I'm assuming basically level, paved terrain.

 

[.nomad]

I think history has answered this already. Horses are a lot of work.

This from the Henry Ford Organization:
As a farm boy, Henry Ford disliked horses and the drudgery of farm labor. As an industrialist, he sought to improve the farmer's life through the mechanization of farm work. Beginning about 1906, Henry Ford directed his engineers to devise an agricultural tractor to replace the horse on the farm. At the time, most tractors weighed more than two tons and cost around $1,000. Henry Ford hoped to create a small, inexpensive tractor that most farmers could afford. Literally, a Model T for the soil.
http://www.thehenryford.org/exhibits/pic/2003/03_aug.asp#more

Also, there was a huge bicycle fad at about this same time, as noted in popular song:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daisy_Bell

I'm just not seeing any way in which a horse would be a step up . . . except in some very narrow circumstances and even then you can still get a DUI on a horse.

I think it's a given that horses are more work in terms of maintaining.

The opinions favoring e-bikes over horses are starting to pile up. If I was mostly confident e-bikes were a travel improvement over horses before, I am even more so now.

 

[LockH]

I notice in this thread so far nobuddy has mentioned the maybe "overhead" re food grown to feed horses. Their "energy sources" may suffer degradation from "pests". Other animals, bugs, etc that constantly insist on "sharing" WattEVer grows. Plus, depending on local environment, some land may be less arable for growing any sorts of plants, or may "suffer crop failures". Depending how energy is "gathered" (generated), perhaps none of the above applies to the "e-bike". Yes?

 

[Punx0r]

In favour of the horse: it can be a companion on long trips and a lifelong friend. Until it bites you. Or throws you. Or tramples. Still, revenge can be yours because you can also eat it in times of starvation.

In favour of the bicycle, if it falls and breaks a wheel you don't need to shoot it.

You can also keep a bicycle in your house without it disturbing your television watching or its emissions causing your neighbours to complain to the local authority.

 

[dogman dan]

Having to secure feed, water, and in some cases shelter for your horse is part of my general statement, "Horses are a pain in the ass". Also, there is the shit. This can be a valuable item, or a problem depending on where it gets left.

In the cities, the shit was one of the prime reasons why electric trolleys were the real horse replacement, before any gas cars were common.

So really, electric was the first thing to replace the horse in cities.

 

[.nomad]

Having to secure feed, water, and in some cases shelter for your horse is part of my general statement, "Horses are a pain in the ass". Also, there is the shit. This can be a valuable item, or a problem depending on where it gets left.

In the cities, the shit was one of the prime reasons why electric trolleys were the real horse replacement, before any gas cars were common.

So really, electric was the first thing to replace the horse in cities.

Good points! Plus the e-bike output, assuming future motors you can connect another device to, is transferable so it's battery can someday act as a little portable power plant with all the low energy devices we have now..i.e. cell phones, tablets, GPS, etc...

 

[Reactor]

Unfortunately I grew up with horses!
Surely the biggest difference is the personality.
Am I the only one here that has been thrown off a horse simply because it wasn't use to being riden. Never happen on my ebike.
Or trying to ride a horse on a longer ride than the usual and having the horse constantly turning because the lazy a@# wants to go home ASAP.
Or worse still when galloping through saplings or a forest and the horse wants to go one way while I have my mind set on another, that never ends well! Ebike can be 100% directed by me.
My ebike has never bitten me on the ass as opposed to a particularly spiteful shetland pony my mother bought because it looked "cute".
My ebike has never opened doors to retrieve a weeks worth of feed (energy) in one day.
My ebike is ready to go at a moments notice it does not play "Catch Me If You Can" in a large paddock it doesn't need horse shoes, or a saddle or saddle cloth or reins or irons or physically large area or grass or water.
My ebike doesn't shy away from dogs and leave me stranded, it doesnt zero in on low lying branches.
An ebike wont or shouldn't break down all by itself.
When I am not using it an ebike doesn't deliberately go and roll in horse turd, having just been cleaned!
Ebikes are a definite step UP!

 

[The fingers]

Rate 'em both by the cuss factor. 100 years ago Grandpa cussed the team. 50 years ago Pop cussed the tractor,the machinery, and those darned VW's passing everybody on the shoulder during a traffic jam. Do we cuss the bicycle as much? Personally I don't, since it's cheaper and more reliable than my truck, and I pass the traffic jam in the bike lane taunting all the cagers. :lol:

 

[Ykick]

Pretty much align with reactor - the only time I ever desired to use horse on the farm is/was checking property late summer, tall grass.

Give any horse credit for being smart enough to keep their water open during hard freeze but I fail to get what's "technological" about a horse?

They're biological and while I appreciate and enjoy the nostalgia of "horse power" there really isn't a "step up/down" to be found comparing eBike technology to Horse biology, IMO.

As far as usefulness is concerned - horses were then, this is now - eBikes are now!

 

[LockH]

Hehe... But eons ago, the horse-drawn chariot was very "high tech"... (as was the hot air balloon, etc, etc.)

 

[.nomad]

Unfortunately I grew up with horses!
Surely the biggest difference is the personality.
Am I the only one here that has been thrown off a horse simply because it wasn't use to being riden. Never happen on my ebike.
Or trying to ride a horse on a longer ride than the usual and having the horse constantly turning because the lazy a@# wants to go home ASAP.
Or worse still when galloping through saplings or a forest and the horse wants to go one way while I have my mind set on another, that never ends well! Ebike can be 100% directed by me.
My ebike has never bitten me on the ass as opposed to a particularly spiteful shetland pony my mother bought because it looked "cute".
My ebike has never opened doors to retrieve a weeks worth of feed (energy) in one day.
My ebike is ready to go at a moments notice it does not play "Catch Me If You Can" in a large paddock it doesn't need horse shoes, or a saddle or saddle cloth or reins or irons or physically large area or grass or water.
My ebike doesn't shy away from dogs and leave me stranded, it doesnt zero in on low lying branches.
An ebike wont or shouldn't break down all by itself.
When I am not using it an ebike doesn't deliberately go and roll in horse turd, having just been cleaned!
Ebikes are a definite step UP!

This is hilarious and at the same time I think you've made a great case for, not only why e-bikes are a step up from horses but a humane substitute for horses. I can understand why a horse wouldn't want to be a beast of burden, especially on some days when it just doesn't really feel like it. As long as it's in functional condition, you don't have that problem with an e-bike.

 

[.nomad]

Pretty much align with reactor - the only time I ever desired to use horse on the farm is/was checking property late summer, tall grass.

Give any horse credit for being smart enough to keep their water open during hard freeze but I fail to get what's "technological" about a horse?

They're biological and while I appreciate and enjoy the nostalgia of "horse power" there really isn't a "step up/down" to be found comparing eBike technology to Horse biology, IMO.

As far as usefulness is concerned - horses were then, this is now - eBikes are now!

Horses, while biological organisms, are certainly employed by humans as a technological solution for getting somewhere.

 

[Ykick]

Horses, while biological organisms, are certainly employed by humans as a technological solution for getting somewhere.

Yeah right, that "walking thing" is so very technological, LOL....

 

[LockH]

Hey! Hold yer horses there buddy... Maybe throw "speed" into your calculations?

 

[flathill]

horses are powered by the sun and food is everywhere

the real question is could a solar powered ebike have the same range per day?
probably not if you did not pedal
and it wasnt a enclosed dorkmobile
you dont pedal a horse of course

ebikes also cant climb steep rocky hills without a path
unless you are a trials rider and have a really light ebike
ebikes also dont self replicate
horses for the win

 

[.nomad]

Horses, while biological organisms, are certainly employed by humans as a technological solution for getting somewhere.

Yeah right, that "walking thing" is so very technological, LOL....

?

It's not whether something is living or inanimate that makes it a technology but how it is applied.

 

[LockH]

horses are powered by the sun and food is everywhere

???

Maybe check w/our friend from "Desert Pacific Cali, in the US of A re "food EVerywhere? (Although I am currently enjoying a bottle of "stuff", made in part from the blue agave plant. Might perhaps discourage the horses from sampling those peyote mushrooms. They might "see gawd" - the ebike - or something.)