Best Motor/Esc combo for 2RWD EMTB

[stw]

Hi guys,

I am looking now for ling time to all topics - its so exciting to see what you build. I wanna convert my MTB now too... For me it is now not really clear which setup would be best for a electric mountainboard for 6s. I figured out in all other topics that following components are mostly used but it was more or less not possible to find out which setup works perfect. It would be important for me to have no problems with cog / sync loss and startup from still...

I would now assume, that I would have a good 6S setup by using SK3 6364-190kV with HK150A ESC. A bit of improvement would be the SK3 6374 with 170kV due to more torque and less cog/sync problems. What do you think/recommend?

In generall for all users it would be great to get your setup and your experience with pros/cons written down. So feel free to share your setup

I think most used components for EMTB are:

Motors:
SK3 6364 with 190, 213 or 245 kV
SK3 6374 with 168 or 192kV

Escs:

Alien 150A dual
HK 150A car
HK Trackstar 150A
HW Ezrun
HW XeRun

 

[BShady]

I would forget about 6s. Go to 10s. The added voltage will help with top speed and possibly the starting power. Using a HV will let you use the lower Kv motor and higher gear ratio and yet still be happy with the overall power and speed.

If I re-build my EMTB:
9-10s (at least)
150amp dual alien ESC (up to 12s)
64/9 gear ratio (1:7) #25 chain
TACON 245kv motor (they are beasts).

 

[mortifiedMORTY]

Right now I'm currently using the 6364 on a longboard and it runs great. It's on a 6s so the battery doesn't last too long but the speed is great. For a mountain board, I would think you should focus on a higher battery setup like two 6s per motor or just go ahead and do a 10s per motor as said above.

As for the ESC, to do it right the first time and if you had the money, the mamba monster 2 would be ideal. It is a very high quality and has a rating for 120 A but only supports up to a 6s battery setup. Cheaper would be the mamba max pro but it is rated a little lower for the same battery setup. I made the mistake of getting a castle creations talon 90 which is made for airplanes/helicopters. It works well and was only $70 with no problem starting from a complete stop as it is programmed to deal with delicate gears of a helicopter's prop but lacks brakes....

 

[BShady]

I really don't unserstand the mamba monster Xls. They are at least $180 for just one!!!!! The alien ones are very good and only cost $200 for dual. Even the Hobbywing ESCs have been used and proven very good. I just think the price for the mambas are ridiculous no matter how good of a product they are.

 

[mortifiedMORTY]

Yeah that's a good point... The alien power systems do offer 120A ESCs for $70 which is a good price. For some reason I prefer the idea of having two ESCs with two motors just in case one fails.

 

[okp]

just a dumb question.

If I take two ESC (Mamba Max), one for each motor. How can I get everything perfectly synchronised with the receiver ? do I have to parallel both ESC receiver wires into one... and same for the lipo (which results on a DUAL ESC?) ? Is it the same as stacking up lipos to get mAH capacity addition ?

 

[BShady]

Yes you use a y harness that connects the 2 reciver wires into one. Lipos is done the same way as well but we call it a parallel connecter.

 

[okp]

well, when I was into RC, I was swearing by these ESC :

http://www.teamtekin.com/rx8.html

Controls: Forward/Brake/Reverse
Input Voltage: 2S-6S LiPo / 4-16S NiMH-NiCD
BEC: 6.0v / 7.4v @ 7amps
Motor Limit Brushless Mode: 2S - No Limit
3S - 4000kV
4S - 3000kV
5S - 2000kV
6S - 1700kV
Motor Limit Brushed Mode: No Limit
Max Current: 220amps per phase
Timing Profiles: 7 choices (on board)
Brushed Modes: FWD Only / FWD-REV / FWD-REV Delay
Brushless Modes: FWD Only / FWD-REV / FWD-REV Delay
Dimensions: 1.5 x 2.2 x 1.4" / 38 x 55.8 x 25.5mm
Weight: 2.7oz / 76.5g

I'm running 7S 10AH... so even two of them will not do the job right ?

 

[torqueboards]

Either of those motors or ESC's work.. You would just have to change your gearing ratio accordingly to your KV/voltage. Everyone has different versions of either of those.

 

[okp]

ok, let's imagine someone would like to put
- two mamba max 2XL ESC connected in parallel
- 2 x 50mm motors, 270KV, 2000watt, 60Amp, 9t
- gear ratio 36T (270kv)
- pulley size : 12T

- 7S 10AH

for 76mm wheels in dual diagonal.

anything wrong in this setup, except that the 41mm height of the ESC and that this is more than 400USD of ESC ?

 

[BShady]

Dude that's crazy $400usd for the ESCs you can practically build a whole board with cheap to regular ESCs that will work extremely good If not perfect.

What am I missing about these mamba monster2xl that people still think about buying them? With the extra $200 I save by getting the cheaper ESC, I would double or even triple my battery range!!!!

 

[okp]

well, my last week superman flight fall allowed me to rethink the "cheapest" purchase situation. For safety, we normally don't have to use the word "should", but "shall".

When I was into RC, I build overpowered monsters and I each time I tried to go for a cheap ESC or lipos, I have had reliability issues one time or another (but with less impact)). I had top notch remote transmitter and so on.

I am now standing on the RC car and reliability equals safety. I am not sayin that the mamba price is normal, but that according to a certain level of quality and company experience or user feedback it seems to be a top notch ESC. I had it and also tekin's in the past on 1/8 and 1/10 cars. Flawless.

I will change my transmitter and will try pushing my board again to its limit ... but with full protection... my hip is still highly painful but I can still go to the toilets hopefully The wiring is perfect, mechanical also. So if anything just stop me again, unless a rock... this will be the electronics. So I will have to find a way to fix this. The never ending search of performance.

Honesly if it cost me 500 USD of electronics and a non nunchuck transmitter to go for 45MPH with "no or within tolerance" risk, I'm ready for that. But regarding what happened to me, I was in total control of the board, no rocks... just got stopped while still having the nunchuck stick full up. Something has stopped me and I have to find what.

 

[mortifiedMORTY]

This makes me reconsider using the nunchuck transmitter. Even on the site where they are sold it reads "do not use this as a controller for your board". Hopefully they will become more reliable in the future. Sucks that you crashed like that man.

 

[torqueboards]

This makes me reconsider using the nunchuck transmitter. Even on the site where they are sold it reads "do not use this as a controller for your board". Hopefully they will become more reliable in the future. Sucks that you crashed like that man.

We still don't know if this is the case.

 

[BShady]

Btw okp I defenitly feel bad for you. A fall like you had sounds really bad I'm just scarred to fall period! Hope you have a full recover fast and easy.

I defenitly believe mamba makes top notch ESCs but we have seen people go 50mph on the Hobbyking ESCs as well.
It could be you got a bad ESC. Nothing can be told without testing.

Did you get a chance to Try a regular RC controller yet? Sorry we are jacking this guys thread!!!!!

 

[stw]

Yeah that's a good point... The alien power systems do offer 120A ESCs for $70 which is a good price. For some reason I prefer the idea of having two ESCs with two motors just in case one fails.

I think these are out of stock...

What are problems with 150A HK Esc's? Which esc will be best value for money? The Ezrun, Trackstar, Alien 150A dual or another one?

What is better for EMTB a 6364 or 6374 - I gues 6374 has more torque? But draws maybe also more and is also causing more sync problems due to low kV?

Would be great to see here some recommendations or priorisations of best motor/esc combo based on your experience.

 

[mortifiedMORTY]

Best value would be determined by longevity and price in my eyes. The hobby wing esc is fairly cheap and most people seem to have good experiences with them.

 

[nowind]

Hey stw,

i´m using the :
HW 150A XERUN
SK3 6374 168kV
6S Zippy Compact.
Gearing is 13/54.

It workes really nice, of course they are some sync problems from stillstand but its small and more a problem of not sensored Motors/esc.
You can start from stillstand still on a angled surface. You just need a little sensitive in your throttle finger.
I will try with shorter gearing from 13/65 for real offroad use because i not need more the 30kmh.

I swear on the HW esc´s, i´m into RC for many years now.
Using everything like castle or tekin stuff and the HW stuff is just the smoothest and best imo.
Have a look into the new IP67 waterproof Quikrun from HW, this will be my next esc.

You have to think about what you want, a 6S Setup is more than enough for most people. Its imo the best bang for the buck.

 

[benj]

I like 6S on my MTB, it's a great mix of acceleration versus top speed, nice and manageable.

I have tried a lot of setups, 5S, 6S, 8S and 10S. 10S was too much for me, a 45kph top speed is seriously quick, but mostly it was so twitchy and hard to manage, it was like riding a savage Kinda fun, but not easy, and not really enjoyable.

I would recommend 6S for an excellent smooth, easy to handle ride, and 8S if you want to be a bit mental, but still manageable. Don't forget, when you're trying to hold a trigger steady at 25kph on bumpy ground - that's not easy - and a wrong twitch above 8S and you really notice it

 

[stuntmanmike]

I have tried all set ups as well , I think a good rule of thumb is 6s for street & 12s for off road. The Mamba XL2 is the esc to go with on the mountain board, one for each wheel/motor. Its always better to have a lot of power in reserve as things get sketchy quick on a mountain board in the woods.

 

[psychotiller]

The Xl2 is an awesome ESC. And having used them I do believe you get what you pay for. I still doubt that the Wiimote had anything to do with the fall in this thread. I have 4 boards set up with Wiimotes, using 3 different esc's,and the issue as presented hasn't happened to me.

 

[stw]

I have 4 boards set up with Wiimotes, using 3 different esc's ...

I like 6S on my MTB, it's a great mix of acceleration versus top speed, nice and manageable.

I have tried a lot of setups, 5S, 6S, 8S and 10S. 10S was too much for me, a 45kph top speed is seriously quick, but mostly it was so twitchy and hard to manage, it was like riding a savage Kinda fun, but not easy, and not really enjoyable.

I would recommend 6S ...

Psyhotiller and benj - which 6s setups (motor, esc) have you tested and what is your experience?

 

[psychotiller]

EZrun Pro with SK3 6374, Tacon 160, Turnigy G160 245 and 290kv

XL2 with G160 290KV @6s and 8s

Mamba Monster 1 and 2 with Tacon 160 and G160 and Aeolian 63mm 270kv

HK 120 with Tacon 160 and G160 245kv

All of my setups have been run with a few different RX/TX models too. The worst was the Quanum with several dropped signals and inability to sync.
I fell once because I lost signal, and fell over the front of the board. The brakes didn't come on though. I fell because I was accelerating hard, leaning forward when suddenly I was coasting and severely unbalanced.

My buddy did have a cheap HK controller that had shit brake settings. He couldn't disable the drag brake setting or minimize it. So when he would try to coast, or when he lost signal, his board would go hard brakes. Now he runs a Mamba 2. Bottom line, if you lose signal and your brakes come on you have a problem with your ESC.

All in all, I'm pretty happy with my builds. I still believe the Wiimote is the best controller I've used. I still believe for 6s that the EZ run is the best ESC for Eboards. For 8s, the XL2. The software for both is hard to beat.

 

[okp]

great feedback and info sharing. So... why not putting brakes to 0% ? I think this is really something that I am thinking how. I'm quite sure this will end like this

I am not saying that the fall comes from wii receiver or nunchuck, but I am trying to eliminate variables, what is sure is that it acts weird with the Alien 150A ESC. So I will try another receiver, then another ESC and if I am still in good shape maybe we'll know the end of the story

anyway, psychotiller, I noticed you were using XL2 ESC, so I'm really happy to read your feedback. much appreciated.

 

[torqueboards]

Awesome review psychotiller!

Okp --- Alien ESCs same as mine and all the others you see. unfortunately aren't the best programmed. I've had mad issues with them and their consistency. Unfortunately, they are one of the only ones in the market with a built in BEC and 8S+ and dual motor. Some work great and some are just crappy.

Wait for Vedder ESC's. Those will be awesome