Brose with no auto lift-off

[triplemaya]

I have a BMW with a Brose motor. There is no momentary lift off of power when I change gear. So lots of crashing from the gears unless I lift of pedalling as I shift gear. I have contacted experts and yes, this is not a fault, the motor just does not have this functionality.

This is a big surprise as all the other bikes I have had do this. Bosch do it just brilliantly since their mk3 motors on.

My question is are all the Brose motors like this? I know Specialized have a different specific firmware. I thought they might have been able to implement it. Anyone got one and can clarify this?

 

[E-HP]

I have a BMW with a Brose motor. There is no momentary lift off of power when I change gear. So lots of crashing from the gears unless I lift of pedalling as I shift gear. I have contacted experts and yes, this is not a fault, the motor just does not have this functionality.

This is a big surprise as all the other bikes I have had do this. Bosch do it just brilliantly since their mk3 motors on.

My question is are all the Brose motors like this? I know Specialized have a different specific firmware. I thought they might have been able to implement it. Anyone got one and can clarify this?

If it's by design, then the bike likely doesn't have the shift sensing hardware either, regardless of firmware.

 

[triplemaya]

Thanks, but this is exactly what I am curious about.

Is the shift sensing a hardware property or can it / is it implemented in firmware?

I would be fascinated if anyone can point me to an article on how Bosch or some manufacturer make this work.

 

[triplemaya]

As stated in original post it is a BMW ebike. There is no accessible wiring.

 

[triplemaya]

I have a gear sensor off a bafang.
But there is no way I am taking my wiring apart!
I am not planning to modify the BMW.
Plus I always found the use of the gear sensor on the bafang to be useless. Yes, it helps you to not fry your gears and chain. But the motor takes far too long to recover. So the bike stops on a steep hill.
My solution is to fit an IGH, an Enviolo system. This means I can shift under power. It completely eliminates the problem, of course.

"My question is are all the Brose motors like this? I know Specialized have a different specific firmware. I thought they might have been able to implement it. Anyone got one and can clarify this?"

Also interested in any info about how the Bosch system works.

 

[triplemaya]

Thanks for the info about gearsensor.com. Out of interest I have emailed them to ask about how this would work.

 

[E-HP]

Thanks, but this is exactly what I am curious about.

Is the shift sensing a hardware property or can it / is it implemented in firmware?

But there is no way I am taking my wiring apart!
I am not planning to modify the BMW.

So just to be clear, you don't want to modify the bike, but also believe that there's unutilized hardware/a shift sensor installed, that can be turned on via firmware?

 

[triplemaya]

I guess I really should have given more description, but I thought the question was clear enough.

I like the BMW a lot but it is a diamond frame. I need a step through.

The only bike I have found with the 90nm Brose motor and a step through frame is a Specialized.

Specialized do their own firmware. And they use the 2.2 motor. The BMW is a 2.1.

So I was hoping that one way or another, the Specialized bikes would have the facility that the BMW does not.

SO

"My question is are all the Brose motors like this? I know Specialized have a different specific firmware. I thought they might have been able to implement it. Anyone got one and can clarify this?"

Is that clear enough?

 

[triplemaya]

Regarding the Bafang gear sensor, yes. That solves the shifting problem very nicely for powering along on the flat. But as I said, my experience was that when the motor cut for a moment, it did not resume with full power for too long, leaving the bike to slow on a steep hill. Perhaps this is a setting that can be modified. But with the bbs02 I had I found the one time I needed to shift down under power, the process took to long to recover. Perhaps you or your expert friend could let me know what the problem might be there.

 

[amberwolf]

I think a better way to ask your question, that is more clear to readers, would be something like:

"Do the Specialized step-thru versions of the 90nm Brose system support gearshift-sensing that turns the motor off during shifting gears, unlike the BMW bike with the "same" system?"

The best people to ask this of would really be the company (Specialized) themselves, for the specific model bike you want to get (because they might not have the same features on every model...).

It's possible that someone on this forum does have experience with the systems in question, and can answer it, but the company supplying the bikes ought to be able to answer such questions better, and if they cannot, it might point to insufficient support in case of future problems / etc., in case that is a situation you wish to avoid.

I guess I really should have given more description, but I thought the question was clear enough.

I like the BMW a lot but it is a diamond frame. I need a step through.

The only bike I have found with the 90nm Brose motor and a step through frame is a Specialized.

Specialized do their own firmware. And they use the 2.2 motor. The BMW is a 2.1.

So I was hoping that one way or another, the Specialized bikes would have the facility that the BMW does not.

SO

"My question is are all the Brose motors like this? I know Specialized have a different specific firmware. I thought they might have been able to implement it. Anyone got one and can clarify this?"

Is that clear enough?

 

[E-HP]

I think a better way to ask your question, that is more clear to readers, would be something like:

"Do the Specialized step-thru versions of the 90nm Brose system support gearshift-sensing that turns the motor off during shifting gears, unlike the BMW bike with the "same" system?"

The FAQ on the Specialized website might imply that they don't. They state:

• Shift the gears earlier than you would on a traditional bike.

• Ease up on pedalling power when shifting.

If they had a shift sensor to cut power, then easing up shouldn't be necessary.

 

[triplemaya]

"Climbing too steep of hill in too tall a gear"

Exactly. So I don't think ahead enough, or get taken by surprise by how steep it is. And then the motor bogs. So for a clueless and / or inattentive rider the nuvinci is a godsend.

 

[triplemaya]

" The best people to ask this of would really be the company (Specialized) themselves, for the specific model bike you want to get (because they might not have the same features on every model...)."

I called Specialized, but found myself in a wearingly long conversation which I ended unsure if he had really answered the question. He spent the first five minutes on subjects like how to ease off pedalling when shifting. He gave a definitive answer in the end, but I was not convinced he was not just trying to get rid of me! Other agents on that line have been superlatively informed and very quick to grasp the issue at hand. So I guess that time I was just unlucky. So I thought I would go to the community to see if others had this issue.

 

[triplemaya]

"The FAQ on the Specialized website might imply that they don't. They state:
Shift the gears earlier than you would on a traditional bike.
Ease up on pedalling power when shifting.
If they had a shift sensor to cut power, then easing up shouldn't be necessary."

Quite. Obviously, therefore, they are giving blanket advice, which does not help. Specialized sell plenty of Bosch powered bikes on which this is not necessary at all. On the Bosch bikes I have owned there is absolutely no need to ease off. My CX mk 3 in particular shifts flawlessly under full power anywhere on the range.

Hence calling Specialized for information. And subsequently posting here hoping for advice from the horse's mouth - someone who owns a Brose powered Specialized bike.

 

[triplemaya]

Aaaaanyway.

Thanks for all the replies. Clearly all well meaning and obviously taking time to help someone. Cheers. :thumb:

 

[triplemaya]

PS

This was the reply from Gearsensor.com

Hi Andrew,

are you an ebike manufacturer?

Only ebike manufacturer can arrange Gearsensor connection directly with Brose.


Best regards / S pozdravem



Radim Mráz

gearsensor.com / Head of Sales, Co-owner



Agentura Repro s.r.o.

Czech Republic

Šedivská 739, Letohrad 561 51

Phone: +420 736244467

www.gearsensor.com

radim.mraz@gearsensor.com



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Dne 26.08.2022 v 17:39 Andrew napsal(a):
> Hi
>
> I found your page:
>
> https://gearsensor.com/
>
> You have a picture of a mid drive motor bike. For a brose mid drive how would you connect the shift sensor to the motor?
>
> Thanks
>
> Andrew Soltau