Chaos 48v cutting out

Davejmag

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Apr 25, 2020
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Hi there, I’ve just stumbled upon this forum as I was looking up the issues with my sons scooter. He has a Chaos 48v 1600w stand up scooter. It’s been a great bit of kit for the last 2 years and he’s had plenty of use out of it. It’s now developed an intermittent fault, when he goes on it after about 20mins or so of hard use (he’s 14 so flat out everywhere) it cuts out. Power lights etc are still on but there’s no response from the throttle. After between 30 secs to 10mins it just goes again, as if it had been switched back on.
I’m not too clued up on electrics but I was thinking it was as if something had overheated and then cooled down to allow it to go again?
Any advice will be greatly appreciated, cheers.
 
It probably doesn't have a thermal cutout (most don't, except the permanent one when the smoke escapes).

The most likely thing is that the battery has dropped in voltage enough for hte controller LVC (low voltage cutoff) to disable the motor, but not far enough for the battery's BMS (if any) to shut off it's output (this would turn off all lights/etc too).

Then the battery "recovers" a little as the load is removed, so voltage goes up above the LVC. When the load is put back on it, it'll usually shutdown quickly again.

Most likely it needs a new battery. Two years is probably pretty good for a "cheap" battery used hard all the time.


You can test this with a voltmeter on the battery leads, measuring what it reads at full charge, and at "empty", when the scooter wont' work anymore, and then when riding it, watching what the voltage is when the scooter is about to cut out, and then when it actually has, and then when it recovers enough to start working again.

If the cutout voltage is about the same as when the scooter has shut off from dead battery, then that's what's happening.


There are some posts about this kind of scooter around here, if they help you any, like this one:
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=95150

More:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Chaos+48v+site:endless-sphere.com
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/search.php?keywords=chaos&terms=all&author=&sc=1&sf=titleonly&sr=topics&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search
 
First of all thank you very much for your reply.
I don’t know if this is a different issue or connected to what you are saying about the battery dropping voltage. When we were out a walk last night my son took it with him, we covered mostly grass and dirt paths so there was plenty of wheel spinning etc. It cut out after around 25mins but this time the lights all went out(1st time it’s done this)and there was smoke coming from near the front. Lifted up the deck and removed the batteries, the smoke was coming from the front compartment where the controller is. After around 10mins of pushing it we tried to turn it back on and it came on and worked fine again but we don’t have the 3 power lights at the throttle which usually stay on all the time to show the power in the battery. They now only come on when you open the throttle.
Do you think the smoke etc is to do with the batteries dropping voltage or is this another issue.

Reading through some of the links you gave me on your reply do you think I’d be better changing to 18650 batteries that some are recommending?

Thanks.
 
Davejmag said:
It cut out after around 25mins but this time the lights all went out(1st time it’s done this)and there was smoke coming from near the front. Lifted up the deck and removed the batteries, the smoke was coming from the front compartment where the controller is. After around 10mins of pushing it we tried to turn it back on and it came on and worked fine again but we don’t have the 3 power lights at the throttle which usually stay on all the time to show the power in the battery. They now only come on when you open the throttle.
Do you think the smoke etc is to do with the batteries dropping voltage or is this another issue.

Uh....smoke is very very bad.

Smoke means you could have a fire.

You don't want to keep using something that is smoking.

You want to fix it first so it doesn't smoke, so it doesn't catch on fire, especially when you're not looking and burn your house down.



So...no, smoke wouldn't usually be to do with battery voltage.


Smoke is to do with overheating something, meaning using it too hard for it's design, so something has failed.


It could be wiring, which is something that could cause a fire later even though you ahve it turned off and aren't using it. You need to open it up, and in the best possible lighting available (noonday sun, etc), very closely and carefully examine every inch of all of the wiring, especially that in the area the smoke came from (but not just there, everywhere), to see if there is anything unusual at all. Any sign of melting, distortion, discoloration, etc.

When you find the parts that have melted, trace where they go to and from. Take good closeup pictures of the damage, and of the parts the wires go to, and come from, in the best possible lighting, and attach them to your post here with the attachments tab, upload button. Then we can see which you might want to open up and examine next, or simply replace.


If there is no wiring damage, and you're absolutely sure of that, then still post the pictures, of every part that is in the area smoke came from, so we can at least guess which ones you should replace.


While it is possible that nothing at all will happen other than what already has, fire is really really really bad, and should always be avoided. So you should never take smoke as a benign sign, and should always immediately stop using whatever is smoking, and not use it again until it has been properly repaired.
 
Davejmag said:
Reading through some of the links you gave me on your reply do you think I’d be better changing to 18650 batteries that some are recommending?

No. They are very volatile, and can burst into an uncontrollable fire easily, especially when used in a way that can create smoke in the device they are in, and that very obvious warning sign to stop using the device is ignored.
 
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