Doctorbass 2WD ADAPTTO / NYX / MXUS 32kW 105 pounds

[Doctorbass]

Nice project Doc =)

I am surprised that you want to attempt hi speed with such a low voltage though.

I will follow your developments.

Well, It will be configured for more quick acceleration than top speed. but top speed should be in the 125 130km/h minimum. To get a decent 1/8 mile time it will need to be both quick and fast.

I might test the new Adaptto MAX-E 14kW nominal on this ebike. this could reach up to 40kW .. but it will require NO2 for the motor lol

Doc

 

[Doctorbass]

FRONT WHEEL MOTOR FINISHED and INSTALLED!

Wasn't so easy! but finally acheived! I had to drill every single eyeslet and file them to fit the 12 gauge nipples.

Next task: true the wheel and have proper spoke tension and then finally Install front motor MAX-E controller and wiring to the motor and battery and rear wheel drive MAX-E communication link!

I will also have to proceed to the rear MXUS motor wheel. Actually it'S the 5403 still installed on the bike.

 

[Stielz]

What a awesome machine!

Is the second max-e going inside the battery space?

 

[Doctorbass]

What a awesome machine!

Is the second max-e going inside the battery space?

Well not sure yet i might mount it vertically on the fornt of the fork below the LED lamp for better cooling and shorten the phase wires to the maximum.

Doc

 

[Cowardlyduck]

Looking good Doc!

FRONT WHEEL MOTOR FINISHED and INSTALLED!

Is that offset to the side going to be ok?
I mean, will it track straight with the front not centred?
You could always go with a bigger front disk (maybe 250mm) if you wanted to space the disk away from the hub less.

You should also investigate using a disk side impellor to draw air into the holes near the axle.

Cheers

 

[macribs]

Nice project Doc =)

I am surprised that you want to attempt hi speed with such a low voltage though.

I will follow your developments.

Well, It will be configured for more quick acceleration than top speed. but top speed should be in the 125 130km/h minimum. To get a decent 1/8 mile time it will need to be both quick and fast.

I might test the new Adaptto MAX-E 14kW nominal on this ebike. this could reach up to 40kW .. but it will require NO2 for the motor lol

Doc

You could do water cooling first, and then if you need more do a "reversed RIMS" cooling for the motors. Rather then having a Recirculating Infusion Mash System (term used in beer brewing to describe inline heating) you could use maybe copper tubing coil around the cooling line from the radiator and towards the motor inlet. That way your cooling fluid would be super chilled before entering the motor. The cooling of copper or chill plate could be ie a large peltier element along with dry ice, liquid gas or any other way you can dream up to rapidly super cool the motor cooling inlet line.

The thing is that you will only need maximum heat removal capacity for 12 seconds or less on the drag strip or a little longer if you get battery capacity to do a 1/4 mile race. But you could have the motor pre cooled before the run from you cooling loop, you could chill it below zero degrees C as long as you have alcohol based liquid coolant. And even during the 1/8 mile run you would poor ice cold chilled water into you motor inlets.

 

[madin88]

Well, It will be configured for more quick acceleration than top speed. but top speed should be in the 125 130km/h minimum. To get a decent 1/8 mile time it will need to be both quick and fast.

I might test the new Adaptto MAX-E 14kW nominal on this ebike. this could reach up to 40kW .. but it will require NO2 for the motor lol

Doc

do you know whats the difference between 14kW and 10kW Max-E?
i wonder if it's only a different software or if Adaptto also did some improvements on the powerstage -> like we both did

Some time ago i have built a FAT bike first with only one MAC on the rear and later with a second on the front. Even with higher current settings after the 2WD conversion the motors did not get as hot as the single rear MAC did. I think the same thing happens in your case: about half the load (or something like 60 rear : 40 front) on each motor during acceleratin, faster acceleration means the time the motors sees large phase currents is shorter, double the mass to suck the heat and so on..
I believe a simulation in ebikes.ca simulator with about half the total vehicle mass should come close to what you get in real.
With only 1p of this crazy LiPos i think the battery will be empty before the motors starting to overheat

 

[fechter]

Most drag bikes have a hard time keeping the front wheel on the ground. Less weight on the front will make it prone to losing traction. You might consider doing something with the saddle to allow shifting your weight as far forward as possible.

 

[madin88]

I wonder what happens if you put >100A regen into these Lipos. That would be over 20C CHARGE rate

 

[Allex]

Oh look it's a bike with front drum brakes

Nicely done, very good craftsmanship!

 

[gone_walkabouts]

looking forward to getting the perforance stats on this one !!

 

[Doctorbass]

Alot of work now to prepare the 2WD bike to be on time for the Interbike 2015!

Rear MXUS motor:
- Upgrade phase wires + install proper high amp connector and hall connector CHECK
- Modify the holes in the cover
- Drill and file every single eyeslet of the Doubletrack 24 rim
- Install the 12 gauge spokes and true the wheel
- Build the dual Adaptto controller high power harness with dual seperate 160A 150V DC breaker.
- Upgrade to the new Adaptto controller for the 14kW cont 20kW burst version.
- reinforce the CF frame where the head tube is to support the high thrust of the front fork
- replace both tube and tires.
- program and test/tune the 2WD.
- adjust total battery current to not make the Farasis cells to suffer too much until the 150C drag racing pack is ready!
- Make sure everything is "safe"

Once i will be back from Las Vegas i will a build the 20s2p 9Ah drag racing pack for total power availlable of 80kW burst with minimal voltage sag at 35-40kW.

Doc

 

[wojtek]

great project!!! Thumbs up

 

[macribs]

Wow less the 3 weeks Doc. I really hope you manage to get the bike properly assembled and tested ahead of interbike.
You should really consider showing off you dragrace on 2 wd on a big screen on interbike. I am sure jaws will drop

Will your bike be on the NYX stand?

 

[spinningmagnets]

Doc, will your bike be at any particular booth?

 

[Doctorbass]

Doc, will your bike be at any particular booth?

Adaptto and NYX boot are at the same booth :wink:

It will be really difficult to show a drag race on video BEFORE the interbike as the bike have to be shipped like in about a week!! i have to do everything during this week + my normal day work, taking care of my wife, give the dog 2 walk a day and managing our new kitchen reconstruction and continu shipping makita battery!! :lol:

a week have 168hours right?? :lol:

Doc

 

[macribs]

Yeah what I pictured was a big screen beside you bike on the booth at Interbike, showing the drag race.
But I understand, time is an issue to complete the build and to make the shipping in time.
Anyway enjoy interbike - cool that you get your hands on the new max-e v2.

Bad ass booth Adaptto and Nyx together. Two outstanding companies both on the cutting edge.

 

[Doctorbass]

OK phase wires upgrade on the rear motor is finished!

I used my favorite method to join the phase wire and the strands together using copper pipe crimp and solder and sealed shring to avoid the solder to leak when overpower make it melt !!

I took the 12 gauge teflon wire from my 5403 to upgrade the 14-16 original wire gauge and will only use it for a short lenght then it will be joined to 8 AWG and XT150 connectors for the adaptto.

btw i also measured directly at the winding terminal ( no wire) the resistance phase to phase and i got:

Green-Blue: 55.2miliohms
Blue-Yellow: 55.2 miliohms
Yellow-Green: 55.3 miliohm.

Barent from Kinaye motorsport sent me the spec sheet witch indicate 0.060ohm witch is close but probably is including the resistance of the 14 gauge wire harness.

I used my 0-100A regulated power supply to supply a constant current of 10A to not heat too much the winding and false the result, and my DVM to get the voltage.

I also measured the inductance and got

Green-Blue: 161 uHenry
Blue-Yellow: 160 uHenry
Yellow-Green: 163 uHenry

this indicate me that the winding appear to not be damaged and all 20 strands per phase are conducting

Doc

 

[Stielz]

Looks good!

It would be cool to see a direct comparison between the clyte 5403 and the mxus. Although I assume the speed constant are too different to get a fair comparison?

 

[Doctorbass]

Looks good!

It would be cool to see a direct comparison between the clyte 5403 and the mxus. Although I assume the speed constant are too different to get a fair comparison?

No worie i also have a 4T mxus witch match the 9kv of the 5403 :wink: i'll do all these test in teh coming weeks!

Doc

 

[Doctorbass]

I am in the process of filling all the eyeslet holes of the Doubletrack 24 rim right now to make the 12 gauge nipples to fit inside.... DAMS that's SO LONG !!!! even i have used a drill to remove from 156 to 185mil" i still have to file all the remaining 11 mil" to fit the 196 mil" of the nipple!!! :lol:

I have half holes done now... 18 holes left !!! :?

That's the price to pay to avoid the need of the easy to assemble motorcycle rim and save 7-8 pounds weight !

OLD GREAT DOUBLE TRACK 24 !!!! WITH 39mm wide make very stable tire and strong wheel!

Doc

 

[Ohbse]

I've done the same thing a number of times doc, it's a real pain the wrist.

Last one I built I ended up mounting a high quality round file intended for chainsaw sharpening in my drill and used both spin and back and forth motion to greatly speed up the filing process. That made a big difference.

 

[Doctorbass]

Rear Wheel MXUS+ Doubletrack 24 laced and true!

 

[Doctorbass]

OK... progressing!

Both motor and wheel done!!

Wheel 99% ready, Need only to install wire harness now.

Doc

 

[macribs]

Looks good!

It would be cool to see a direct comparison between the clyte 5403 and the mxus. Although I assume the speed constant are too different to get a fair comparison?

No worie i also have a 4T mxus witch match the 9kv of the 5403 :wink: i'll do all these test in teh coming weeks!

Doc

Sweet looking wheels, vented and ready to race. Dang those looks good.

Wonder if you should have that 4T in your rear wheel and a 3T upfront? Most torque on the rear, less likely to break traction up front.
Yet when you need the speed wind from 3T you still have it upfront. I wonder how much peak performance we will see on this thing.

Now that you got Adaptto v2, do you think you could get even more power from using the QS 205 H50 v3 extra motor rather then mxus 3000? Would the extra weight from the QS hold you back? Or maybe contribute to heat removal?