E-S Stealth Electric Bike Owners

[Emmett]

Yeah I was thinking of that but I want to try and do it the programming route before having to physically mod the throttle..

It might be physically defective with the initial position of magnet and hall sensor. Probably very easy to correct it.

Where are you making these programmed adjustments? Directly in the controller (correct place) or in the display (erratic results).

 

[1abv]

Yeah I was thinking of that but I want to try and do it the programming route before having to physically mod the throttle..

It might be physically defective with the initial position of magnet and hall sensor. Probably very easy to correct it.

Where are you making these programmed adjustments? Directly in the controller (correct place) or in the display (erratic results).

Its not physically defective. Unless 4 brand new ones of them are all defective at once. What controller do you have?

 

[Cowardlyduck]

Guy's, it's a well known fact, most cheap Chinese throttles are all the same as far as having a dead zone at the start. It's what leads to many flips off the back for first time riders, and it's one reason why the Adaptto controllers let you program in a throttle ramp and linear throttle profile.
A proper ramp from a quality throttle will look like this:

However my original Stealth Fighter throttle looks like this:

And this is how yours would probably look like also.

Cheers

 

[TheDougB52 Bomber]

Speaking of shocks... what's the go with all the air shocks these days? Is that the way things will just go? I was looking at alternate mountain bike shocks and most of the new ones I found were all air?
Mountain bike shocks even up to the task? Someone said the stealth bike was a pitbike shock?

Kind of want a more compact design as I'm worried my seat post (Fox 2013 DOSS) will hit the top of my shock.
The damned thing has a valve that sticks out the bottom and worries me no end.

 

[1abv]

Guy's, it's a well known fact, most cheap Chinese throttles are all the same as far as having a dead zone at the start. It's what leads to many flips off the back for first time riders, and it's one reason why the Adaptto controllers let you program in a throttle ramp and linear throttle profile.
A proper ramp from a quality throttle will look like this:

However my original Stealth Fighter throttle looks like this:

And this is how yours would probably look like also.

Cheers

Yeah makes sense I figured it was a reprogramming issue… I have a CAV 3 and have been trying to fix it with that but having some trouble with getting the settings to affect the throttle at all.
Thats why I was looking for the original throttle or some help with a CAV 3 guru… Ive tried contacting GRIN to see if they could help as well. The Throttles I got from stealth don't have the correct length cord and also have the dead zone.

 

[bigbore]

Speaking of shocks... what's the go with all the air shocks these days? Is that the way things will just go? I was looking at alternate mountain bike shocks and most of the new ones I found were all air?
Mountain bike shocks even up to the task? Someone said the stealth bike was a pitbike shock?

Kind of want a more compact design as I'm worried my seat post (Fox 2013 DOSS) will hit the top of my shock.
The damned thing has a valve that sticks out the bottom and worries me no end.

Which tyre is the rear tyre in the pic? CST makes motocross tyres also?

 

[Emmett]

Yeah I was thinking of that but I want to try and do it the programming route before having to physically mod the throttle..

It might be physically defective with the initial position of magnet and hall sensor. Probably very easy to correct it.

Where are you making these programmed adjustments? Directly in the controller (correct place) or in the display (erratic results).

Its not physically defective. Unless 4 brand new ones of them are all defective at once. What controller do you have?

Where are you making these programmed adjustments?

I have a Bomber controller. Unrestricted by the DC-1. LiPo 75V battery system. Peak around 6500W through a H4040 (very slow wind for bursts up tricky short hills/rocks) or TC3065 motors.

Defective is a subjective term. If you want or expect a linear throttle response to position then every new throttle they make could be deemed defective. Maybe they designed the "dead spot" to be there on purpose for safety. Which is stupid because a delayed then aggressive response curve like CD showed is not safe. I've thought about gluing in a return stopper, and maybe I will.

I think my stock crystalyte throttles have a curve like CD showed. They are more on/off throttles. Junk grade it seems. Sometimes a little tricky to use with decent motor power. But I break them often in crashes (twist beyond full open or closed) so cheap is good. I always have a spare ready to go. I get their "full width" twist throttles and modify them into a 3/4 grip twist setup with a good MX bike soft grip installed. So just the 1/4 on the end is fixed.

 

[Rix]

I have my adaptto throttle ramp up setting on the most agressive profile, #3 and my ramp up map is very similiar to the 2nd pic CD posted. This to me feels most like a my old KTM SX144 powerband. Then I also set my sensor points well inside the boundaries of the sensor ranges so I have slight dead spot at the beginning of the range, but then hits full before I am done twisting the throttle. Now those who haven't ran the adaptto yet are probably thinking I am sicko for such an aggressive set up a system peaking 11kw, but the advantage adaptto has is precise power can be metered and I can take off very easily, or I can whack the throttle, and go like a bat out of hell. Did I mention I love the adaptto MAX E?

 

[Emmett]

Did I mention I love the adaptto MAX E?

No you didn't. Do you really love it??

Did I mention I love hall wires with tougher insulation?

 

[1abv]

Hey fellas let me make this a bit more specific….

Here are the pics of the original throttle. If anyone has a spare one of these it would be great. This brand / model of throttle worked great and had no dead spot. All of the others that I have tried do have a dead spot.

Problem: dead spot at the start of throttle..

What I have done:
Installed a few new throttles..
Adjusted the CAV3 as follows:
-Setting the Min throttle out from .49 all the way up to 3.49…. does not change anything. The dead spot is still there.
-Tried to find the diagnostic display to get the throttle in at rest and WOT of the new throttles which I can't locate when I go though the menus the diagnostic display is not there.

Anyone know how to adjust the throttle besides this? again I have already send an email to Grin Tech about this..

What im trying to get help on:
If anyone has info on adjusting with the CAV3 other than what I have already tried that would be great..
if anyone has a spare of this specific throttle.

Thanks..

 

[bigbore]

Bravo Simone! Buona esercizio! Mio fratello Italiano ha adetto, "parlare di meno, aleno di piu". So when you were pedal assisting in the deep sand, were you so tired you couldn't speak?

Yeah you described exactly what I was doing

Did I mention I love the adaptto MAX E?

+1
Anybody already reported that the controller is able to limit the power so as not to overheat the motor also in the most critical conditions such as on deep sand? The hottest motor temp I have there is about 85°C in Boost mode and the Temp limit is set at 135°C.
The beauty is that I do not have to stop for overheated motor but instead I reach a balanced situation where the power is reduced and the motor never exceeds 85 °C, this did not happen with the old 5403. I guess the QS 205 with Statorade and Adaptto Max-e is a very reliable setup. ...... Then Hubsinks are coming 8)

 

[Rix]

Speaking of shocks... what's the go with all the air shocks these days? Is that the way things will just go? I was looking at alternate mountain bike shocks and most of the new ones I found were all air?
Mountain bike shocks even up to the task? Someone said the stealth bike was a pitbike shock?

Kind of want a more compact design as I'm worried my seat post (Fox 2013 DOSS) will hit the top of my shock.
The damned thing has a valve that sticks out the bottom and worries me no end.

[i
Which tyre is the rear tyre in the pic? CST makes motocross tyres also?

CST is technically a very old school cheap MC tire company. CST is formally known as Chen Sheng, and anyone that rode dirt bikes back in the 70s and 80s will tell you that when money was tight, and a new tire for their MC was needed, Chen Sheng tires from JC Whitney was called into service. :wink: :lol: I remember buying a 120x17 Chen Sheng tires for my 1982 Husky XC430 for 15 bucks.

 

[Rix]

Speaking of shocks... what's the go with all the air shocks these days? Is that the way things will just go? I was looking at alternate mountain bike shocks and most of the new ones I found were all air?
Mountain bike shocks even up to the task? Someone said the stealth bike was a pitbike shock?

Kind of want a more compact design as I'm worried my seat post (Fox 2013 DOSS) will hit the top of my shock.
The damned thing has a valve that sticks out the bottom and worries me no end.

Really like your bike Doug, how do you like that rear tire?

 

[1abv]

Ok so more info.. here is the diagnostic screen.. It was turned off at the factory for some reason. When I roll on the throttle the in does not change and the out flickers, changes to around 3.7 isn and goes back to 4.99 at full throttle.

Settings:
Setup Throt In= 0.00v WOT
Setup Throt Out= .049-4.99v
ThrI min imput= .099V
ThrI max imput= 3.99V
ThrI Fault Volts= 4.49V

Any ideas?

 

[Cowardlyduck]

1abv, that throttle you posted pics of is the same as mine. I think it's from Crystalyte, but could be wrong.
The fast ramp pic I posted is the ramp I get from that throttle, and it definitely feels like it has a dead zone to me. No different than the cheap 'E-bike' throttles available everywhere that look like this:

It may just be your throttle is special if it doesn't have that dead zone at the start.

Anyway, EM3EV have a good selection of cheap throttles you could try out:
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=41_57
It may be worth trying a few different throttles to see how you like them.

Cheers

 

[Emmett]

Ok so more info.. here is the diagnostic screen.. It was turned off at the factory for some reason. When I roll on the throttle the in does not change and the out flickers, changes to around 3.7 isn and goes back to 4.99 at full throttle.

Settings:
Setup Throt In= 0.00v WOT
Setup Throt Out= .049-4.99v
ThrI min imput= .099V
ThrI max imput= 3.99V
ThrI Fault Volts= 4.49V

Any ideas?

Probably I'm missing something, but the only idea I have is that if the budget throttle produces no signal change for the initial part of the twist, then no programming settings further downstream can fix that. Somewhat like carving a sculpture out of a turd. It's still a turd.

If however you know that throttle does produce a signal from the initial twist (it's not a turd), then I would try to ensure the is no extra circuitry and programming between that signal and the part of the controller that must apply the real power response to throttle input change. If you have the throttle input connected directly to your controller and you are programming the controller, then ignore this idea too and carry on.

 

[whitebomber]

Post burn-off Kalamunda Hills Perth WA. Made for a different kind of ride.

 

[Rix]

Post burn-off Kalamunda Hills Perth WA. Made for a different kind of ride.

Still a nice ride though, especially on your machine.

 

[stritzky]

Speaking of shocks... what's the go with all the air shocks these days? Is that the way things will just go? I was looking at alternate mountain bike shocks and most of the new ones I found were all air?
Mountain bike shocks even up to the task? Someone said the stealth bike was a pitbike shock?

Kind of want a more compact design as I'm worried my seat post (Fox 2013 DOSS) will hit the top of my shock.
The damned thing has a valve that sticks out the bottom and worries me no end.

Which tyre is the rear tyre in the pic? CST makes motocross tyres also?

Yes I would also like to know what tire that is...

 

[Rix]

Most likely the CST Legion or Surge 70/100-19.

 

[Villain]

Ok so more info.. here is the diagnostic screen.. It was turned off at the factory for some reason. When I roll on the throttle the in does not change and the out flickers, changes to around 3.7 isn and goes back to 4.99 at full throttle.

Settings:
Setup Throt In= 0.00v WOT
Setup Throt Out= .049-4.99v
ThrI min imput= .099V
ThrI max imput= 3.99V
ThrI Fault Volts= 4.49V

Any ideas?

IIRC
The throttle does not go through the Cycle Analyst and therefore those values mean nothing. Check your wiring, I think you will find that the throttle goes directly to the controller.

 

[Emmett]

Ok so more info.. Any ideas?

IIRC
The throttle does not go through the Cycle Analyst and therefore those values mean nothing. Check your wiring, I think you will find that the throttle goes directly to the controller.

That's what I was wondering when I wrote this:

If however you know that throttle does produce a signal from the initial twist (it's not a turd), then I would try to ensure the is no extra circuitry and programming between that signal and the part of the controller that must apply the real power response to throttle input change. If you have the throttle input connected directly to your controller and you are programming the controller, then ignore this idea too and carry on.

Certainly on the newer Bomber and Fighter bikes the throttle signal goes direct to the controller and the DC-1 display unit has an output which is throttle over-ride (like a governor), used to implement soft-start, economy mode and generally limit power and speed.

I don't know if the CA works the same way or if it uses the programming port on the controller.

 

[turbo9111]

Hi guys i haven't posted on here for a while but as my posts a few months back i have replaced my VBOX so i have a second hand one with one of the output shaft springs broken (its missing 1st 3rd and 5th gears) if any one is interested in making a offer comes complete with sprocket and shifter crank arms complete ??,
I've also just treated myself to a yamaha yxz 1000r buggy anyone else on here got one or into this kinda $hit awesome bit of kit!!!!!!!!!!

 

[1abv]

OK so here is what I found out...

from stealth
The throttle is controlled by the controller, on the setup menu of the CA you will find (throttle in and throttle out) and we set as 0.0v WOT (in) And 0.49-3.65v (out).
If you are trying to trim the dead zone out of the throttle the above setting is the best for this type of throttle unit.

it can be rewired to use the cycle analyst...

like so:

Step one is to determine how the system was wired initially before you change anything, follow the CA wiring from the display to the controller and see how it is connected.

It may go to an intermediary shunt or it play plug into the controller directly.

If it is plugged into the controller directly, you'll want to make the following changes; If it is not plugged in directly, you'll want to wire up the CA to the controller's throttle input and then go through the steps. You may want to consider wiring the ebrake in parallel with the CA3 as well as the controller.

1. Unplug the motor from the controller
2. Wire the throttle into the CA throttle input
3. Change the CA throttle in setting to "pass-thru"
4. Change the minimum throttle in to whatever the throttle in says + 0.1V (so if it says 0.84V initially, then change it to 0.94V etc)
5. Max throttle in to 4V
6. Min throttle out to 1V (you may want to play with this later)
7. Max throttle out to 4V

Have someone help you with the next steps or get the bike on a stand

1. Turn the system off
2. Plug the controller back into the motor
3. Lift the motor wheel off the ground
4. Turn the system on and check the diagnostics screen to the left of the startup screen
5. Check at what ThO (throttle out) the motor starts spinning
6. If the motor starts spinning right away, change the min throttle out to a lower value and repeat until you find the start point
7. Change the Min Throttle out to 0.05V below the starting voltage.


The other throttles that I bought (these were not the exact model that came with the bike) have a different offset so there will always be a dead spot unless you rewire to have the cycle analyst be in-between the throttle and the controller.

I bought a couple of throttles from electric rider that had a dead spot, then I bought a couple from stealth USA that had the same problem. Then Stealth AU sent me 2 of the throttles that came with the bike that work like the business!! thanks stealth for getting me the correct throttles! no more dead spot!

so end of the saga......the throttles that came with the bike have a specific offset that seems to be different from many of the generic throttles that are avail from online vendors.


BOOSH...

now on to the vboxx....

 

[JumperJackFlash]

1abv,

Isn't the original Stealth throttle just a Crystalyte throttle?