Allex
100 MW
Note that changing to a more powerful controller ads a lot of excessive heat to the motor. So make sure to have a temp sensor and consider venting.
Allex said:Note that changing to a more powerful controller ads a lot of excessive heat to the motor. So make sure to have a temp sensor and consider venting.
dh-paule said:Allex said:I heard that White industries are very noisy, true?
noisy ?
is the american v8 aound a noise ?
the same for white industries and chris king at bicycles
dh-paule said:everything is fine, climbing like goat, even in steep terrain )
but I am thinking about selling the bomber for a new project during upcoming winter
Not that I am not happy with all the upgrades he got during the time,
its a nearly perfect e-bike - so I think the guy that will get it will be as happy as me
Video is a real problem... cause you have to stop for filming the next spot.. once on the bomber I dont want to stop before <70V in the battery the bike always tells me: go go go
Cowardlyduck said:So
Cheers
Theodore Voltaire said:Cowardlyduck said:So
Cheers
Interestingly 130 F is about what you show on this graph CD. Were you measuring the outside of the hub?
Theodore Voltaire said:120-130 degrees F doesn't seem that hot to me. An electric motor like a totally enclosed 1/3 hp air conditioning condenser fan motor typically runs about 180-212 degrees F, and last for years. Those are the type of motors I work with on a daily basis.
I wonder why our seemingly much lower operating temperature is such a concern?
Rix said:Theodore Voltaire said:120-130 degrees F doesn't seem that hot to me. An electric motor like a totally enclosed 1/3 hp air conditioning condenser fan motor typically runs about 180-212 degrees F, and last for years. Those are the type of motors I work with on a daily basis.
I wonder why our seemingly much lower operating temperature is such a concern?
I am referring to outside ambient temp, those photos were taken from my work vehicle month before last. When I ride my bike with the outside temp at 120F, the hub heats up, and stays hot much quicker and longer than when the outside temp is say 80F. I have watched this phenomena time and time again. With my vented motor, when I hit thermo rollback, if the temps are around 80, just riding down the road at 20mph will cool things off within a minute or two and full power is restored, but when its over 100, even after 5 minutes, my heat gauge will barely reflect any cooling. Some folk have installed 110C thermistors which is like 240F or so in their motors and run temps up there with no damage or discoloration occurring. The stator on the right was my 5404, left is 5403. I got it so hot one time that when spit on the hub shell, it boiled. I know at my elevation of 4000 feet that water boils around 208F, so it was at least that hot. Just guessing, but that probably equated to over 300F on the stator itself, maybe more as I don't know for sure. This motor is still in service and runs great, my dad currently has it on the Bomber running a 19x1.4 MC with a SR241 2.75-19 tire on it. Even the sensor wires are browned a little as well as the high temp epoxy coating. Its a tough motor.
stritzky said:Rix said:Theodore Voltaire said:120-130 degrees F doesn't seem that hot to me. An electric motor like a totally enclosed 1/3 hp air conditioning condenser fan motor typically runs about 180-212 degrees F, and last for years. Those are the type of motors I work with on a daily basis.
I wonder why our seemingly much lower operating temperature is such a concern?
I am referring to outside ambient temp, those photos were taken from my work vehicle month before last. When I ride my bike with the outside temp at 120F, the hub heats up, and stays hot much quicker and longer than when the outside temp is say 80F. I have watched this phenomena time and time again. With my vented motor, when I hit thermo rollback, if the temps are around 80, just riding down the road at 20mph will cool things off within a minute or two and full power is restored, but when its over 100, even after 5 minutes, my heat gauge will barely reflect any cooling. Some folk have installed 110C thermistors which is like 240F or so in their motors and run temps up there with no damage or discoloration occurring. The stator on the right was my 5404, left is 5403. I got it so hot one time that when spit on the hub shell, it boiled. I know at my elevation of 4000 feet that water boils around 208F, so it was at least that hot. Just guessing, but that probably equated to over 300F on the stator itself, maybe more as I don't know for sure. This motor is still in service and runs great, my dad currently has it on the Bomber running a 19x1.4 MC with a SR241 2.75-19 tire on it. Even the sensor wires are browned a little as well as the high temp epoxy coating. Its a tough motor.
Does it smell funny when the motor gets hot ?
Highest I've seen outside the hub was 90C in the past as that's what the temp stickers I use on the outside max out at. I don't measure from the outside any more though. The temps in my testing were from a sensor mounted underneath the windings and a display I've mounted up where my CA used to sit.Theodore Voltaire said:What's the highest temperature typically seen when measuring the outside of the hub? I checked mine over the course of the summer and the highest temperature I've seen was about 130 F.
Thanks Rix. Yes, that was my conclusions also on the fan speeds. I rode to/from work today with the fans only running at 12V as a result. I think when the weather warms up a bit I might turn them up to 14-16V as I calculate there is a couple of volts sag in the wiring anyway so it shouldn't hurt the fans.Rix said:Nicely done CD, It would appear that the diminishing returns for max cooling with the fans is north of 12 volts. looking at your chart @ 12 volts get your you down to 50-45c in about 1 minute, @ 18 volts, 47 seconds, so by an increase of 50% in voltage, you are getting about a 23-24% quicker in crease in cooling with a slightly less heat spike. I guess that means keeping your fan at 12 volts will ensure maximum life span of those little motors for the return you get in cooling. At 15 volts, your volts are increased by 25% and your cooling time decrease by only 9.5% with the same heat spike. That's not worth it. When the weather gets hot there, I would like to see some data about the cooling ratio specifically between 12 volts and 18 volts. We are still in the mid 90s here during the day, 37C+, but not nearly as hot as it was in July. This was our July high. Of course the official temp was 110F at the airport, but airport sits behind a mountain. Anyway with summer temps like this, you can see why I am interested in your modification.
Emmett said:The motor hub already spins. So if mostly riding at medium+ speeds in dry conditions, then why use any extra fan? I am imagining an air intake scoop plus exit venturi. So during forward wheel rotation there is lots of air flow through the hub. Mods only to the hub cover on one side.
Theodore Voltaire said:Emmett said:The motor hub already spins. So if mostly riding at medium+ speeds in dry conditions, then why use any extra fan? I am imagining an air intake scoop plus exit venturi. So during forward wheel rotation there is lots of air flow through the hub. Mods only to the hub cover on one side.
I was thinking about scoops also. Seems like since holes in the motor plates make so much difference, scoops would be the better than fans, and a lot simpler to implement. The downside might be a lot of dirt getting inside the motor though.
I can certainly understand why our motors get hot. Every time I reset my CA it has a 65-67 amp max recorded. That's a huge amount of current. It's hard for me to even imagine how the winding can handle that.