Electric Rickshaw Taxi

[numberonebikeslover]

Dear All;

I’ve been flapping my wing to test my flight to start a project “Electric Rickshaw Taxi”. This may be something more than my ability as a layman in the field of electric bike; therefore, I would request the members for their advice, support and their contribution.

Most of the time members have been asking me for their contributions in the form of things and stuff I might need for my built but I’ve always denied them with apologies. Few days back a message totally changed my perspective towards what I’ve been denying. A good man by the name John convinced me not to change my rules and principles but to let others help me so that I can transfer that help to the others in my community and to promote electric vehicles in my community.

Therefore, I decided to do this project. What I have with me is my pocket, my resources, my knowledge, experience and my time. I’m open to any kind of donations, products, precious feedbacks and suggestions. I don’t know that I will be able to shoulder this huge responsibility the way and to the extent the contributing members expect from me but I will try my level best and I’m all yours. I would like to bend this project towards the inclination of the members as well.

I must mention that there is so poverty in my city that there are people who can’t afford three times meal a day. A three wheeler taxi is very famous in my home town by the name of Rickshaw which runs on a 150 cc engine and can carry 3 passengers and a driver. It can travel with the speed of 60 km/hr. Most poor people who could not get a job drive these for making their livings. Those people who are well-off and wants to make a living and can afford to buy 4 to 5 ricksaws (each for about Rs, 2,00,000 . They give them on fixed daily rent (Rs. 300 to 400) to jobless drivers who can’t own a rickshaw to be used as taxi. Most of the time the deal between the owner and driver is Rs. 300 to 400 for the owner and the remaining money if made is of the driver to take home. There are times when some drivers are unable to earn enough to even fulfill the owners deal. Life is miserable here at times. Reason! Corrupt politicians, difference of classes, different education systems for different classes and mostly lack of education.

A low cost electric rickshaw can be a great solution to a poor man’s joblessness problem.

I want to achieve following objectives:
> A four seat electric ricksaw (may be a four wheeler)
> Not more than 3 feet wide (so that it can cruse through heavy traffic and narrow streets)
> Maximum speed 50 km/hr on straight roads.
> Paddling provision so that in case where batteries totally fail (shut-off for safety of battery) it could be paddled to reach certain destination.
> Low / No maintenance cost.
> A cabin with a windscreen (summer is hottest while winter gets coldest)
> Maximum distance per charge about 120 km

With the afore-cited specifications what every one suggests about:
Motor power (if hub motor):
Battery capacity (in Lead Acid type):
Controller’s Amps:

Please contribute in the form of precious feedback, donations, or any product you think is useful in this project.

Respectfully Yours
Naeem

 

[etard]

Naeem,
I don't think I am alone in saying we are 100% behind you on this! I trust that your skills, persistence, and enthusiasm is more than enough to accomplish this task. My girlfreind has been encouraging me to take up a cause, something that I can relate to and be assured of the benefits of my contributions. I think I have found it here with your community. I think your project is very ambitious but possible. I think the biggest challenge you will face is the range of 120 km, I might suggest having two battery packs that can be switched out during the day. I'm sure John might agree that the scooter hub motors might be your best option for a reliable and strong drive system, although I don't know if the front wheel would have enough traction have accomplishing this. Please let us know how best to send money, what is available for sale in your area, and your design input for the rickshaw. God bless you Naeem.

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Dear All;

I’m going through different prices offered by the Chinese products and I’ve come across a 1000 Watt Brushless hub motor, a controller and a set of twist throttle as follows:
Motor Unit price = 119 USD
Controller Unit price = 35 USD
Twist Grip Throttle set = 2 USD
Total Price = 156 USD
Express Charges to send the goods
to Peshawar Pakistan = 136 USD
Grand total of = 292 USD
The question is would this motor be able to carry the weight of four people which may be about 240 Kg (60 kg average x 4= 240) Plus the weight of the rickshaw body so we can say roughly 300 – 350 kg.
With this motor I suppose the batteries needed must run it for 100 to 120 km per charge so what I suggest I would need batteries of 150 Ah which are readily available in the market but not SLA. The ones used in vehicles, each for Rs. 8000 (8000 x 4 = 32000) One USD is equal to 86 Rs. So 32000 = 32000/86=372 USD.

Your feedback and suggestions would be highly appreciated.

Respectfully
Naeem

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Naeem,
I don't think I am alone in saying we are 100% behind you on this! I trust that your skills, persistence, and enthusiasm is more than enough to accomplish this task. My girlfreind has been encouraging me to take up a cause, something that I can relate to and be assured of the benefits of my contributions. I think I have found it here with your community. I think your project is very ambitious but possible. I think the biggest challenge you will face is the range of 120 km, I might suggest having two battery packs that can be switched out during the day. I'm sure John might agree that the scooter hub motors might be your best option for a reliable and strong drive system, although I don't know if the front wheel would have enough traction have accomplishing this. Please let us know how best to send money, what is available for sale in your area, and your design input for the rickshaw. God bless you Naeem.

Thank you very much for your prompt and useful response.
1) I agree the distance 120 km per charge is a big challenge and it could be accomplished by having another pack ready to be switched. or being kept home on charge to be replaced during lunch break. Let me tell you, Peshawar is a very small city. Only the entering road is by General Trunk Road near Haji Camp and exit road is the same which travels through Peshawar is about 24 km maximum. Inside the city are places which passes through narrow bazaars and streets in which continuous speed can't be attained. While going to the side by villages the distance may be 60 to 70 kms from Peshawar. So a normal average range in a total day a rickshaw travels may be 100 to 200 kms.
2) About the motor I've posted about a Chinese one easily importable due to the fact that we have a shared border with China. Therefore, import expenses are lesser than importing from Europe or America.
3) The best way to send me money would only be through Western Union. I think after when the design is finalized and I start to invest then the money would be required. Right now it will be appropriate to first decide and discuss what is more appropriate. As i mentioned earlier it is totally on members to turn the wheel to any direction they want. only if possible for me with my limited resources.
4) Only Lead acid Batteries (not SLAs with large capacity) are available. That day i went to a bazaar (Karim Pura Bazaar) where i first time saw 24 ah SLA but pretty expensive Rs. 4000 (46.511 USD) each.

Thanks

Respectfully
Naeem

 

[numberonebikeslover]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhngvMM7fRk&feature=related

after seeing this video it seems like i make a motor of my own. A 3 phase BLDC sensorless motor.

 

[whatever]

this company specialised in electric tricycles, I believe they still make them to order but are now more into ebikes,
contact mr huang
at
http://jbebike.en.alibaba.com/

 

[whatever]

this page takes you direct to the tricycle models
http://jbebike.en.alibaba.com/productgrouplist-210159254/electric_tricycle.html
they have one model that can be sent disambled, you will have to ask them about it, disambled its quite easy to freight it out of china
bon appetite

 

[numberonebikeslover]

this page takes you direct to the tricycle models
http://jbebike.en.alibaba.com/productgrouplist-210159254/electric_tricycle.html
they have one model that can be sent disambled, you will have to ask them about it, disambled its quite easy to freight it out of china
bon appetite

Thank you very much but i do not agree with the conventional design of rickshaw which is being used in my city. I've with me a number of things i want to try with innovation and beauty. Any way its not really bad at all.

I'm also thinking about making my own BLDC with some imported parts like controller etc.

Thanks for your response.

 

[John in CR]

Hi Naeem,

The jump from a low speed ebike for one person to a trike for multiple passengers capable of relatively high speed and very long range is a huge jump. Of course anything is possible, but in this case I believe overly ambitious. I think you are greatly underestimating the power and battery requirements (and their weight).

Before giving us some more information to help us better define the requirements, I'd suggest a change in the overall solution. Range and speed are the most costly, and are what prevent electric cars from being the norm. Instead of an electric rickshaw that competes with a gas powered one in all respects, wouldn't one with a lower top speed and shorter range for only use in the city still be a very useful for work as an in-city taxi?

A few Questions:

What is the terrain in and around your city? That is, is it generally flat or are there lots of hills?

Are there any pedal only rickshaws already in use where the terrain is flat enough to make sense?

What is the climate like? Is it generally very sunny, especially around the middle of the day? I ask because solar cells are incredibly cheap right now, and since a proper rickshaw needs a fairly large top to shade the passengers, it may be a perfect vehicle for making a solar panel roof to decrease battery requirements or extend range, as well as decrease operating cost by getting some of the electricity for free every day for years. The economic side is not significant, because the relatively small amount of panel area can't produce much money value each day, but having them would make them more of a novelty and increase the demand for the E-rickshaw and permit slightly higher fares.

How much does electricity cost per kilowatt-hour, and is it common practice to take an hour or longer break(s) from work during the day for prayer or to eat lunch or another reason? I ask because if there is a good chance for an opportunity charge during the day, then with an extension cord and a meter (something like this http://www.amazon.com/P3-International-P4400-Electricity-Monitor/dp/B00009MDBU ), then they could do quick charges almost anywhere without going all the way back to the garage and pay a fair price for the small amount of they draw during the charge.

I'd also like to add that you are much more likely to receive contributions of materials for the build than money contributions even though it is likely for the contributor to pay more in shipping costs.

John

 

[fechter]

Great project!
I'd suggest starting by researching the existing versions of similar vehicles. They are very popular in India.

Here's a few:
http://nariphaltan.virtualave.net/itm00009.htm

http://www.speedace.info/electric_rickshaw_trike.htm

http://www.shenji.cc/products/show.asp?i=27

A forum member in my city built one using a BMC geared hub motor on the front wheel that worked quite well, but top speed was limited.
View attachment 1


Since a rickshaw has a long frame, it may be possible to use a hub motor as a mid-drive (driving the chain) so that it runs through the gears. This is a great help in hilly areas or where you need a higher top speed. A rear wheel hub motor will have a chain sprocket on one side. Here's the classic example:
http://clevercycles.com/products/stokemonkey/

 

[fechter]

Check out ChinaPhil's tricycle kit toward the bottom of page one:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=23854&p=346863#p346863

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Hi Naeem,

The jump from a low speed ebike for one person to a trike for multiple passengers capable of relatively high speed and very long range is a huge jump. Of course anything is possible, but in this case I believe overly ambitious. I think you are greatly underestimating the power and battery requirements (and their weight).

Yes Sir, When i started my work towards making an electric bike, all that i remember was asking my elder brother, who is an electrical engineer, about a toy car (I was 5 then) my question was that what makes it run? so he explained about electric motor and battery cell. I innocently said to my brother that when I'll be your age, I will make a car big enough for me to sit in with a very big electric motor and very big battery cells. He laughed about it but i was so determined that i kept my research as i grew. I belonged to a very poor family so i couldn't afford to do experiments which would have enabled me a lot earlier to make tough projects as learning by doing makes you learn faster. It was only when I started to make a living and spare some money to do different experiments when I started my practical work. Right now I feel a lot different and i've done something practically and keeping in mind my quick learning ability I'm sure I will do it, but with the help of nice people on the ES like your self.

Before giving us some more information to help us better define the requirements, I'd suggest a change in the overall solution. Range and speed are the most costly, and are what prevent electric cars from being the norm. Instead of an electric rickshaw that competes with a gas powered one in all respects, wouldn't one with a lower top speed and shorter range for only use in the city still be a very useful for work as an in-city taxi?

What I'm making is definitely a city taxi indeed. 120 km is something I hope to achieve with a set of two battery packs, i.e. one in rickshaw and one on charge for replacement later. but for a small city like ours, 80 km per charge would be more than sufficient. Suppose my cousin who owns a rickshaw and drives it all day with having a lunch and prayers break of one hour or more. at times he comes back home for the break and returns on duty after 2 - 3 hours later then he goes back at night about 10 pm. He lives about 16 km away from Peshawar a village called as Bakhshi-Pul. If we take his example then 32 km is just a range to make to place where he could use it as taxi. 32 - 80 = 48 km remaining for running as taxi. There is another fact i came across. When a battery is put on load with intervals last longer than the battery put on load constantly; am i right about it? The same will go for this taxi as there are times when a driver has to sit idle for the passenger. Here a paddling generator could also be made so that the driver could charge his battery without having to have a charging facility and make good use of his time.

What i've noticed and presume from my experience that an average man can produce about 100 watts of mechanical power by paddling? Please correct me if i'm wrong.

About the speed: It is not an issue as there is so much traffic all the time so 35 to 40 km/hr is more than sufficient.

A few Questions:

What is the terrain in and around your city? That is, is it generally flat or are there lots of hills?

Mostly flat, only few hills like an overhead bridge known as "Jail Bridge", "Kohati Gate to Yakkatoot" and Ganj Gate to Yakkatoot. There is this constant uphill which you can't notice until one observe it keenly. it is about 20 kms when you are travelling from city to Hayatabad.

Are there any pedal only rickshaws already in use where the terrain is flat enough to make sense?

None that i know of but mostly the terrain is totally flat except few mentioned.

What is the climate like? Is it generally very sunny, especially around the middle of the day? I ask because solar cells are incredibly cheap right now, and since a proper rickshaw needs a fairly large top to shade the passengers, it may be a perfect vehicle for making a solar panel roof to decrease battery requirements or extend range, as well as decrease operating cost by getting some of the electricity for free every day for years. The economic side is not significant, because the relatively small amount of panel area can't produce much money value each day, but having them would make them more of a novelty and increase the demand for the E-rickshaw and permit slightly higher fares.

It is so sunny here that rains are fewer. The sky is clear for months. I thought solar panels are expensive but could you give me example by the price and specification of a panel which could charge a 100 amps battery with let us say 5 amps continues on full sunny day. having to have solar pannels would make it so nice and would definately increase the range.

How much does electricity cost per kilowatt-hour, and is it common practice to take an hour or longer break(s) from work during the day for prayer or to eat lunch or another reason? I ask because if there is a good chance for an opportunity charge during the day, then with an extension cord and a meter (something like this http://www.amazon.com/P3-International-P4400-Electricity-Monitor/dp/B00009MDBU ), then they could do quick charges almost anywhere without going all the way back to the garage and pay a fair price for the small amount of they draw during the charge.

Electricity is getting more and more expensive these days and there is increase after every 3 - 4 months these days. but not as expensive as petrol and CNG. Petrol of super quality is 74 Rs. Litter. while CNG is 55 Kg. I'm sure that electricity would prove to be cheap and reliable. The electricity is produced by dams, by storing the river water. That is why it is cheaper than other resources.

I'd also like to add that you are much more likely to receive contributions of materials for the build than money contributions even though it is likely for the contributor to pay more in shipping costs.

John

I was astonished to note when I asked for shipping cost of a 5 kg package of hub motor kit from china which is the nearest country to Pakistan it was about 206 USD by DHL while express courtier (Chinese company) offered to do the same by 156 USD while the goods were of Rs. 136 USD. It would be honoured for any thing shipped to me but if it is on the cost of loss of such huge amount of money, i would call it a loss.

Right now it is just an idea i'm working on and sorting out. It has to be designed and needs time to think about and see different designs and to reach a certain point of decision. At the moment i think if the kind members could give me suggestions like Mr. Fetcher did in his message (which i would study today). then i would design a drawing to share and discuss with the members.

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Check out ChinaPhil's tricycle kit toward the bottom of page one:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=23854&p=346863#p346863

This is a nice Chain Driver motor.

It surely is nice one indeed for trike or Rickshaw.

Thanks.

Sincerely
Naeem

 

[ChinaPhil]

The tricycle kit is the one fitted to a lot of Beijing delivery tricycles. My wife picked it up whilst she was in Beijing. As the picture shows it is complete (horn, light, ignition lock, chain, sprockets etc.) except for 48V batteries. Now I have to find a tricycle, maybe previously owned/abused.

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Great project!
I'd suggest starting by researching the existing versions of similar vehicles. They are very popular in India.

Thank you very much. It has given me great points to think about. I am thinking about using four wheels instead of three but it is just one of the options i'm thinking about. and also slight tilting action as well if there is room possibility. Moreover, it would be a lot better if there is room for 4 passengers (two at each sides both sitting at the back of each other, facing opposite directions) more passengers in little possible room.

Sincerely
Naeem

 

[numberonebikeslover]

The tricycle kit is the one fitted to a lot of Beijing delivery tricycles. My wife picked it up whilst she was in Beijing. As the picture shows it is complete (horn, light, ignition lock, chain, sprockets etc.) except for 48V batteries. Now I have to find a tricycle, maybe previously owned/abused.

If I'm not wrong, batteries are heaviest part in e-vehicle industry, therefore, most expensive to be shipped? Any way, good luck with the built. May be you can come up with your own design if you are into welding frames and things like one of the member (AussieJester) "Kim" he is one among the best builders of this website. I admire his work and dedication. Following is the web link of one of his built:

http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=20588

Respectfully
Naeem

 

[amberwolf]

What i've noticed and presume from my experience that an average man can produce about 100 watts of mechanical power by paddling? Please correct me if i'm wrong.

Yes, but even if the equipment needed to generate power from that and then convert it into a charge for the batteries is the most efficient possible, you'll still only get maybe 80% or a bit more of that 100W.

Then there is the energy used to carry around that extra weight of generator, pedals, etc., as well as the charging electronics and wiring. If that energy is significant, then it is no longer worth carrying all that around and spending all that effort pedalling, if too small a percentage of it actually ends up in the batteries. I dont' know how much power that would be.


I assume the driver would not pedal 100% of the time, for various reasons. So assuming they drive it for 10 hours, they have a potential of, oh, call it 800Wh of power they could generate (assuming 80% efficiency and 100W input for 10 hours). If they pedal only when stopped for 2 hours of that, they only actually generate 20% of that 800Wh, or 160Wh. This is probably an optimistic amount, as I doubt most people will keep that up during their entire breaktime. If they pedalled a significant amount of the time they're driving, as well, then they might generate enough power to make it worth it.



It takes about 100Wh to run CrazyBike2 with little or no pedalling at around 11-12MPH average speed for 5 miles, for about 30 minutes of actual riding time, as the bike is currently setup. About 20Wh/mile. That's a 300lb bike+rider combo on essentially totally flat well-paved roads with essentially no wind. On gravel roads or other poor traction conditions I expect that would probably be at least 150Wh. If there were any hills it'd go up a whole lot because of the weight.

I expect it would take at least three or four times that amount of power to run the rickshaw, at a minimum, and possibly a lot more depending on the load, wind, and road conditions. If we round that up to say 500Wh, or 100Wh/mile, then that's a pretty high power consumption vs the amount of power the pedalling would put back. At 100Wh/mile, for say 12mph average speed, that is 1200Wh in one hour of travel time. If pedalling only gets back 80Wh in that time, (which I am not certain of) then it's of little relative benefit to do it, as you won't gain much range back from it--less than a mile extra.


Keep in mind that I am not great with numbers to start with, so I may have gotten lost on a misconception somewhere for the pedalling-generation portion of this. Hopefully so, as that might mean you could get a lot more power out of it than I think you can.

 

[liveforphysics]

A roof made of solar cells.

I've got enough high quality high efficiency cells to make a solar charging roof on a rickshaw. Give my your address, they are yours.

You are going to want an 8x8 wind on a 9c motor. A pair of rear hubmotors would be best, but it does make the design of the rickshaw rear axle more complex, as they need to be supported on both sides.

A pair of 12-fet infinions would be a great controller choice. I will also buy those for you.

Then you're going to want some ThunderSky batteries. Likely the 100Ah cells, maybe higher, and >20 of them in series. That is going to cost about $2,200usd, and perhaps another $600-1000 in shipping. Unfortunately, I'm not quite rich enough to buy those for you, but maybe some folks will combine resources to make it happen?

 

[numberonebikeslover]

A number of ideas coming to my mind. The following design is there with me for about two years when i thought of doing something like this and was not able to do it, so i took it out on computer with Microsoft paint. I've just added seating positions and labeling of the diagram.

It uses a powerful Motor may be 2000 watts 48 or 60 volts, fixed inside or outside a small 4 gear shifting gear box of a bike in order for different situations of the road the driver have a choice to switch for power or speed and a clutch as well in order for controlling the transfer of power which may be removed or not being used as in electric power there is no need for idling like an engine. The gear box is provided with a toothed gear on out put shaft, which is connected to the rear wheel by chain drive system. Rear wheel is a bike wheel which also has a drum break. Front wheels are powerless but the steering system is like a car equipped with shock absorbers and springs. I also intend to use a slight tilting factor with the steering. Batteries would be placed below the seats where the passengers would be sitting but in such that the batteries could be switched with another pack easily.

In order to put the weight of passengers, batteries and driver on all wheels equally, the length could be reduced so that there is traction in the rear wheel. but to make the ride stable in turns the passengers must be positioned in between the triangle of three tires i suppose. Otherwise the rickshaw might tilt and fall off while having a tight turn or hitting the break hard. for that reason if the entire rickshaw tilts while turning would make a lot safer.

Please, feel free to discuss. This is not final diagram but just an idea for discussion. It might lead to a final design.

Respectfully Yours
Naeem

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Oops!

Forgot to attach the diagram.

here it is

 

[numberonebikeslover]

Yes, but even if the equipment needed to generate power from that and then convert it into a charge for the batteries is the most efficient possible, you'll still only get maybe 80% or a bit more of that 100W.

Then there is the energy used to carry around that extra weight of generator, pedals, etc., as well as the charging electronics and wiring. If that energy is significant, then it is no longer worth carrying all that around and spending all that effort pedalling, if too small a percentage of it actually ends up in the batteries. I dont' know how much power that would be.
Keep in mind that I am not great with numbers to start with, so I may have gotten lost on a misconception somewhere for the pedalling-generation portion of this. Hopefully so, as that might mean you could get a lot more power out of it than I think you can.

I think that would just increase the weight as I was also guessing the same after a number of supposing calculations in my mind and on paper and I really don't want to spend expensive energy of the batteries on carrying extra weight.

Solar panels would be a good option in this regard.

Thanks for your precious feedback. I wish I could return the favour.

Sincerely Yours
Naeem

 

[numberonebikeslover]

A roof made of solar cells.

I've got enough high quality high efficiency cells to make a solar charging roof on a rickshaw. Give my your address, they are yours.

Wow man! thanks a lot. That would be biggest contribution in my project ever. Let us finalize the design first and a suitable position for the solar cells as well. See the diagram I posted today and please I would definately need your feedback on this one.

You are going to want an 8x8 wind on a 9c motor

I did not get it? 9C motor? i've seen 5C Lithium Ion cell according to which C is the amount of total load current could be put on the cell e.g. (1000 mah cell rated 5C means 1000 x 5 amount of current could be drawn? right? but with motor i did not get it? Call me ignorant in this regard. help me out please.

. A pair of rear hubmotors would be best, but it does make the design of the rickshaw rear axle more complex, as they need to be supported on both sides.

if hubmotor is used if the rickshaw is two rear wheel and one front wheel then i suppose we don't need axle for the rear wheels for the fact that they both are hub motors. But for a bicycle wheel i've a trick i earlier decided to use two wheels of bicycle in such that both wheels have brackets around them so they are caged / enforced. see the attached diagram.

A pair of 12-fet infinions would be a great controller choice. I will also buy those for you.

Well thanks buddy! I just don't know what to say? I would say that let us finalize the design then the motor only then one can say what controller to go with. What i think is that with the consultation of nice and kind members like your self I would develop a list of things which are in need for making this project happen would help every one in the ES to contribute in such that nothing is wasted. Moreover, shipping cost would be too much as i'm living quite far away from all of you, and no doubt will be expensive and i would really call it a loss, So i'm searching around for stuff that are already available here. So that not a single cent is wasted. You know i might make a rickshaw for as low as the price of a single hub motor shipped to me for far away. What ever i find here i will keep every body posted.

Then you're going to want some ThunderSky batteries. Likely the 100Ah cells, maybe higher, and >20 of them in series. That is going to cost about $2,200usd, and perhaps another $600-1000 in shipping. Unfortunately, I'm not quite rich enough to buy those for you, but maybe some folks will combine resources to make it happen?

Man you are a very rich person. You have love for humanity and such a man is a very rich man who has a good heart. My father always say that the most precious of all things in universe is human being. So you are a very rich man.

I'm astonished by the figures you mentioned 2,200 USD and + 1000 USD that equals 2,75,200 Rupees what that kind of money may be i would make 5 or six of such rickshawas, if i find useful parts here like my "very low cost electric bike".

Thanks a lot dear friend for your precious time.
Respectfully
Naeem

 

[floatingdog]

#1,

From reading this thread, I gather this is indeed an ambitious project. Your very low cost bike shows that you are up to the task. I would like to send a little money to help seed this project. It looks like you have a lot of work to build the chassis before motor and batteries can be applied. Please provide Western Union information.

I hope you can find regional sources for your electric parts as shipping from China looks to double the prices. Even so, China may be your best bet. In order to be able to produce multiple instances of your rickshaw and replace broken parts, a standard design with readily available parts will be important.

In regard to money transfers, it looks like Western Union charges 10% + currency exchange costs. I don't know if you can create a Paypal account, but if you can, it appears the transfer costs are much lower. Perhaps our international community can suggest better options.

It will be interesting to see how the economics of this project work out. From your initial post, the traditional gas rickshaw costs 2,00,000 Rs (2330 USD) and it looks like you expect to be able to build for less. Yours will probably have less range and speed, but will hopefully cost less to operate given the cost of electricity and batteries vs. oil. Like the ES community in general, you are a pioneer on the leading edge of technology. Moving forward in time, you can expect the price of oil vs. electricity and battery technology to move in your favor.

I'm not sure how you feel about the subject, but IMO thinking like a businessman is not inherently a bad thing. If over the years, you can build a business that operates at a profit you will be in a position to provide jobs and products that improve life for many.

Best regards and best of luck,

John

 

[John in CR]

Naeem,

A good way to estimate the true energy requirements, ignoring that your weight is likely to be greater due to batteries, is to ask rickshaw drivers how much gas they use per day. They probably know their per kilometer usage.

Gasoline contains about 34kwh of energy per gallon, almost 9kwh per liter. Internal Combustion Engines (ICEs) aren't very efficient (look at all the heat they put off as waste), so after transmission and drive train losses, 25% efficiency for the existing rickshaws is a reasonable guess, and those with 2 stroke engines may be 20% or less overall. Since it is just educated guesses let's call it 2kwh of mechanical output per liter of gas for the petrol rickshaws. Maybe it is more like 1kwh of mechanical output per liter with all the running idle and stop and go riding outside the good efficiency range of the motors, but that's difficult to determine.

Our electric drives and the batteries themselves aren't 100% efficient either. 60-70% overall efficiency is a reasonable estimate for average output at the wheels, so it's something more like 3kwh in the batteries to get 2kwh. If these estimates are within reason, then with no opportunity charging during the day you need 3kwh of battery for each liter of gas those petrol trikes use per day. That's why opportunity charging will be so critical, and why I asked about the price of electricity. Plan on a high power charger to carry aboard too for getting as much energy as possible as quickly at possible during opportunity charging.

Forget pedal power as a planned means of charging the batteries. Food is more expensive than electricity per unit of energy, and the human body is only about as efficient as an ICE at converting fuel to mechanical output. Look at the human power part of the equation as a power assist to help the electric run in its more efficient range, especially during acceleration, up hills, and into head winds. The human body is great a providing short bursts of high torque with little fuel cost because it's always running no matter what. Human power is also a good emergency backup for the electric system.

The high amount of sun and flat terrain are both good for the plan. The sun can be a charging assist, with the practical limit determined by how much roof surface area you can tolerate, which will set by how windy your climate is and the top speed you want. Flat terrain makes hub motors practical, and direct drive hubbies are as simple and durable as it gets.

Regarding the battery and intermittent vs continuous load, the intermittent load results in the battery have less capacity to give, because higher current is drawn. The difference is quite pronounced with lead batteries, but I think it does happen to a much lower extent with lithium batteries too. Check out Peukert's Effect http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peukert's_law

 

[lifepo4ever]

i agree with John and if you plan to drive this rickshaw taxi in a very hot climate , maybe you gonna have some problem of heating because hub motor suffer of low speed if you draw lot of current . because you are in the trafic you don't have enougth speed to ventilate the hub motor , you will have to drill some hole , i just imagine 4 people sitting on a heavy ricksaw just to accelerate with will draw lot of current so lot of heat everytime you go and stop , i don't say its not acheivable project but i am sure it will cost more to build a electric rickshaw then a gaz powered one and also you will need a fast charger between the lunch time for your battery to recovery and this also cost lot of money , if your need is only a top speed of 20-25mph the project is very easy to achieve but if you need speed like combustion motor and range there a lot of $$$ to obtain the same performance and not worth it if you not rich , i live in canada and i can't afford a electric motorcycle and its my dream

i wish you best luck for your project