EU Parliament Agrees EBike Safety Depends on Speed not Power

This is a good development!

It's always a better idea to leave the personal responsibility up to the user rather than over-regulate.

Not to mention the possibility of a after market industry taking the basic models up a notch in power.

Anyone not selling E-Bikes that are up-gradable is missing out on a huge opportunity IMHO.

I don't know about europe, but in the states, there is always a way to get performance parts for cars/motorcycles to give them more performance, and yes, it's sort of in a "grey" area, because many of the performance parts are designated for racing use only, but as long as the people driving the vehicle aren't being total idiots, they are allowed to slide.

There are plenty of idiots using bone stock vehicles and driving/riding recklessly, so laws and regulations should reflect how a vehicle is used more than how much performance it has. :wink:
 
The part that amused me was:
“Although the detail is not clear it seems that most manufacturers will have to reduce the weight of their bicycles to meet the new 25kg maximum weight limit if they want to retain a full throttle.”
25 kg = 55 pounds. Take any MtB, add a 14-pound motor to it, and you’ll have maybe 11 pounds left over for batteries? That’s about 20Ah @ 36V. Not very useful range there Mr. Nanny-State. :p

Disappointed, KF
 
Kingfish said:
The part that amused me was:
“Although the detail is not clear it seems that most manufacturers will have to reduce the weight of their bicycles to meet the new 25kg maximum weight limit if they want to retain a full throttle.”
25 kg = 55 pounds. Take any MtB, add a 14-pound motor to it, and you’ll have maybe 11 pounds left over for batteries? That’s about 20Ah @ 36V. Not very useful range there Mr. Nanny-State. :p

Disappointed, KF

take my norko aline, do nothing to it, and you have 5kg left for motor, battery, and everything else. more short sightedness. yay.
 
spudboy62 said:
.
I'm glad I don't have every aspect of my life overseen by a bunch of bureaucrats in Brussels.
.
.

Yeah, the ones in DC are bad enough. :roll:

However the dust settles on this it will still have an impact here as the companies making e bikes will have to comply and they will just send the compliant ones here for sale as they do now, even though our current regs are higher. At one point in the EU not too many years ago e bikes were at the same under the radar stage they are here today, but as sales increased the bureaucrats saw a need to regulate for regulations sake ($$$$) and don't think that can't happen here in the future.

If the regs in China were less strict you would see a big difference also but they align more or less with the EU.
 
the new Swiss ordinance for electric 2-wheelers will become effective on 1st of May (sorry, text only available in [d], [f] and ). It simplifies substantially the present chaos as there will be only 3 classes: the e-bicycle, the e-moped and the e-motorcycle

  • the e-bicycles (or e-velo, Leicht-Motorfahrräder) are equal to bicycles with max. 0.5kW, with max. 20km/h (motor only mode) and max. 25km/h (motor assisted mode); helmet recommended
  • the e-mopeds (Übrige "Motorfahrräder") are equal to mopeds with max. 1kW, with max. 30km/h (motor only mode) and max. 45km/h (motor assisted mode); helmet madatory
  • the e-motorcycles are equal to motorcycles

This means both e-velos and e-mopeds can be driven without pedaling up to the lower speed limit and with pedaling (pedelec) to the upper limit. Beyond the upper speed limit it's muscles only :x . The new regulation is also a first step in the direction of what we call the 'chamaeleon' (a 2-wheeler which can change class) as it is allowed to use the e-moped as an e-velo in bicycle areas provided it is (temporarily) 'trimmed' to the e-velo limits.

What we need now are smarter controllers, CA or Speedict etc. which allow to programm such limits and change them on the fly!
r
 
Good gawd. What use is a motor if you are limited to 12 or 15mph? (yeah, 15mph up a big hill is good, but it's crawling on the flats).

Oh wait, so the e-moped class allows you to air pedal at 27mph..... that's not too bad.


Does it say anything about downhills or tailwinds? My road bike will coast at 25mph down shallow hills.
 
veloman said:
Good gawd. What use is a motor if you are limited to 12 or 15mph? (yeah, 15mph up a big hill is good, but it's crawling on the flats).

Oh wait, so the e-moped class allows you to air pedal at 27mph..... that's not too bad.


Does it say anything about downhills or tailwinds? My road bike will coast at 25mph down shallow hills.
my throttle-off, motor-freewheeling tricycle does over thirty downhill a 4% 1/4 mile hill.
lol wut?
would I be ticketed for gravity power? :lol:
 
If you were paying for tags title and insurance on ebikes they wouldn't mind how fast you were riding. Since we're not, then we can't enjoy traveling at the speeds that automobiles can.
 
cruiserbikeman said:
If you were paying for tags title and insurance on ebikes they wouldn't mind how fast you were riding. Since we're not, then we can't enjoy traveling at the speeds that automobiles can.


But they design a road for only full auto speed. If it was 100% safe to go 20mph, then they have an argument. But it's not. Pedestrians don't pay for tags, title, insurance, and they get their own safe facility almost everywhere. Just saying....

But I do see your point.
 
veloman said:
cruiserbikeman said:
If you were paying for tags title and insurance on ebikes they wouldn't mind how fast you were riding. Since we're not, then we can't enjoy traveling at the speeds that automobiles can.


But they design a road for only full auto speed. If it was 100% safe to go 20mph, then they have an argument. But it's not. Pedestrians don't pay for tags, title, insurance, and they get their own safe facility almost everywhere. Just saying....

But I do see your point.

Oh I'm not disagreeing with you. I think they are jealous of e-bikes since they can't rake us over the coals like they do automobile drivers. So what they do is pass draconian laws that harass e-bikers. I'm soon hoping to hit the road doing 27-30 mph with 64 volts of lifepo4. :D
 
15 mph limit is stupid along with pedal assist only. It makes far better sense for the rider to apply the power when they need to, and pedal without power if they want without having to switch off the controller!

I see most drivers break the speed limits daily everywhere. Why not limit a car to the maximum limit of 120 kph ? The speed limits for cars here are ridiculous because I can drive off a good quality main road at 50 mph limited on to a dirt road that has grass growing up the middle at 50 mph where is the logic in that ? The main road could easily do 100 kph but the police speed vans are parked there on the good road yet cars regularly speed over 40 mph through towns and villages with no speed control what so ever, most of our towns and villages ahve very narrow streets and 50 kph is too fast. rather than a 1 speed limit for all, they should be applied according to the quality and size of the road!

Governments in Europe do not want any form of transport they can't tax the shit out of!
 
http://www.bike-eu.com/news/new-swiss-e-bike-rules-allow-for-more-powerful-motors-5949.html?cmpid=NLC|Bike%20Europe|10-jul-2012|New%20Swiss%20E-Bike%20Rules%20Allow%20for%20More%20Powerful%20Motors
 
Miles said:
http://www.bike-eu.com/news/new-swiss-e-bike-rules-allow-for-more-powerful-motors-5949.html?cmpid=NLC|Bike%20Europe|10-jul-2012|New%20Swiss%20E-Bike%20Rules%20Allow%20for%20More%20Powerful%20Motors

Holy cow !

1'000 Watts now legal in Switzerland !

Got to upgrade my motor or soon I'll become street legal ! How boring :/)
 
I wonder why they keep enforcing such low speed limit. When i was fit I was able to keep 32-35km/h with a regular mtb using 1.8 street tires and I also could sprint to almost 50kmh for a short while.
Either way I would have no problem registering my ebike as long as I could go as fast as cars are limit to.
 
The latest.........

http://www.etra-eu.com/newsitem.asp?type=3&id=2911494

The European Parliament is about to vote the review of the type-approval. In a dramatic appeal to all MEP’s, ETRA urges them not to vote article 2.2(g) of the compromise text. According to ETRA, this article is an open invitation for electric bicycle manufacturers to circumvent the type-approval procedure. ETRA issues a stark warning that article 2.2(g) will produce serious safety risks and put lives at risk.

The European Parliament and Council have reached a compromise on the Proposal for Regulation on the approval and market surveillance of two- or three-wheel vehicles and quadricycles. This compromise still needs to be formally debated and voted in Plenary. That is scheduled for Monday 19 and Tuesday 20 November.

In the run-up to the Plenary session, ETRA has made a dramatic appeal to all Members of the European Parliament not to vote article 2.2(g) of the proposal. That article stipulates that the Regulation does not apply to vehicles primarily intended for off-road use and designed to travel on unpaved surfaces.

According to ETRA, this article is a permit for manufacturers of electric bicycles to circumvent type-approval and to put vehicles on the market with optimum functional danger levels rather than safety levels. ETRA also calls the article a permit for manufacturers to put vehicles on the market for irresponsible consumers who are only interested in speed and power output.

ETRA Secretary General Annick Roetynck further explains: “Manufacturers can very easily declare their electric bicycles vehicles primarily intended for off-road use and designed to travel on unpaved surfaces, since there are no criteria whatsoever set for labelling a vehicle as such.” Designed to travel on unpaved surfaces has in this context no meaning whatsoever because even if they are designed for that purpose, there is no rule against use on public roads. For comparison, many a mountain bike is used on public roads though it is primarily intended for off-road use and designed to travel on unpaved surfaces.

Annick Roetynck continues: “If a manufacturer labels his electric bicycle as a vehicle primarily intended for off road use and designed to travel on unpaved surfaces then the vehicle is out of the type-approval and there are no other technical rules applying. There is only the General Product Safety Directive which obliges the manufacturer to put a safe product on the market. Furthermore, the owner of the above vehicle will be allowed to use the vehicle without any other obligations, i.e. helmet, insurance, driving licence, age limit, … There is no speed limit by construction set for his vehicle, nor a motor output limit.”

ETRA finds it very difficult to see the consistency in Commission, Council and Parliament’s position with reference to electric bicycles in this legislative dossier. One of ETRA’s requests to the European authorities was to exclude pedal assisted electric bicycles with assistance up to 25 km/h from the type-approval, irrespective of their motor output level. The motor output has no effect on the speed since the motor automatically stops at 25 km/h, irrespective of that motor output. IMCO adopted the relevant amendment but it was subsequently deleted in the trialogue negotiations because Commission and Council feared the amendment would create a safety risk. In parallel, with article 2.2(g) Commission and Council proposed to exclude a category of vehicles, including electric bicycles, without any specification of speed and motor output limit!

ETRA is unequivocal about article 2.2(g): absolutely inconsistent, dangerous and irresponsible.

Warnings for this same article were issued by the motorcycle community. As a result, enduro, trial and heavy duty quads were explicitly re-included in the compromise text.

ETRA has been warning Commission, Council and Parliament about the fact that this article will be abused to avoid the type-approval procedure for electric bicycles since 2009 and has proposed an amendment to overcome the problem, but that was eventually totally ignored.

According to ETRA it is very likely that manufacturers of electric bicycles will use the way out of type-approval offered to them by article 2.2(g) because type-approval is an extremely complicated, expensive and inappropriate regulation since it is designed for conventional mopeds and motorcycles, not for electric bicycles.

The Commission and Council have systematically ignored ETRA’s proposals aimed at developing appropriate and effective regulations for electric bicycles. Originally, the IMCO Committee agreed with ETRA’s proposals and included them through the necessary amendments in the van de Camp report. However all these amendments were deleted again from the compromise text agreed between Council, Commission and Parliament, the text to be discussed and voted in the next Plenary Session.

In a reaction on this compromise to Rapporteur van de Camp, his Shadow Rapporteurs and to the IMCO coordinators ETRA stated: “We are disillusioned beyond words to find that all amendments for the benefit of electric bicycles have been deleted from the compromise text. This is no less than dramatic for the electric bicycle sector in the European Union, since it means that a type-approval procedure, which is totally inappropriate and ineffective for electric bicycles, will continue to apply for at least another decade! This will very seriously obstruct the development of the European electric bicycle market.”

ETRA was informally told that the amendments for the benefit of electric bicycles were sacrificed for the sake of reaching a compromise. Commission and Council continued to oppose the amendments because they had concerns about the resulting safety aspects. ETRA’s response to this: “We deeply regret that Council, Commission and Parliament have refused to accept our in-depth and repeated clarifications and reassurances on this issue. Instead, the incorrect, unfounded and inflammatory argumentation of the opponents to our proposals has prevailed. Ironically enough, the compromise text turns out no less than dramatic for the electric bicycle business because with article 2.2(g) it will without any doubt produce very serious safety risks. The fact that none of the opponents to our proposals have taken this risk into consideration nor acted upon, proves in our view their lack of understanding of the whole type-approval issue with reference to electric bicycles.”

ETRA firmly believes that precisely the fact that the future type-approval procedure is not appropriate and effective for electric bicycles creates the risk that manufacturers will avoid the procedure on the basis of Article 2.2(g).

It is still possible to table amendments before Plenary, provided these amendments are supported by at least thirty MEPs or one political group. That is why ETRA has formulated two amendments aimed at remedying the problems resulting from the compromise text for electric bicycles. All MEPs have been urged to support the amendments.

The new type-approval procedure for electric bicycles will have to be implemented before the end of 2016. This leaves ETRA with 4 more years to obtain better regulations for electric bicycles should this ultimate effort before the vote in Plenary fail.
 
Of course it's relevant. These guys whine about the 20mph limit (in the USA) being too low. Their argument is that they can go faster than 20mph. But for how long? A 750W controller/motor will push a bicycle at 20mph on flat indefinitely (or until the battery runs out).
 
30-35kmh is not hard, and you can keep it for hours.
20mph is fine for bike paths I'm not complaining about that. But if you have to use streets a higher top speed will make your ride safer
 
gensem said:
30-35kmh is not hard, and you can keep it for hours.
20mph is fine for bike paths I'm not complaining about that. But if you have to use streets a higher top speed will make your ride safer
Around here and within the town center, 35 mph is enough, but just beyond downtown it picks up to 40 mph on the connectors and it's a struggle to stay with the flow of traffic that is moving only slightly faster.

Example: There's a road between Redmond and Woodinville called the Red-Wood Road (creative, eh?) and it's a "fast" connector between two hamlet centers maybe 6 miles apart. In parts, there is no margin, just white fog line and then a ledge/drop-off. The problem is the associated bike lane running parallel about 1/4 mile away along the slough has a 15 mph speed limit and you wouldn't take it any cos of all the kiddies and joggers. The alternate routes are much longer. At the height of rush hour, I can keep pace with the smog-spewing cars.

So in agreement - what we need is reformation and cap limits of speed upwards from 35 to 45 mph because there is little infrastructure between the two modes of transportation.

~KF
 
There should be a blanket speed limit of 20mph for all vehicles in built up areas. Then everyone can share the same space and travel at the same speed and pedestrians can cross at any point. Jaywalking :roll:
 
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