GGoodrum
1 MW
Nice charger. that will do nicely. 
Even Newer 4 to 24-cell Battery Management System (BMS)
- Thread starter GGoodrum
- Start date
j3tch1u
10 kW
gary, i've got a v2.2 board and i haven't gotten around to ordering the parts. can i use the current v2.3 BOMs? if not, perhaps you could repost? thanks!
GGoodrum
1 MW
j3tch1u said:
Yes, you can just eliminate Q2 (KSP44), one of the 10k resistors and the 15V zener. Here is a v2.2-specific BOM: http://www.tppacks.com/documents/24-CH%20BMSv2.2%20BOM.txt
-- Gary
j3tch1u
10 kW
thanks very much gary.
doh 299-820-RC is out of stock.
can i substitute:
299-750-RC
or
CFS1/4L821J (1/4W, more expensive)
doh 299-820-RC is out of stock.
can i substitute:
299-750-RC
or
CFS1/4L821J (1/4W, more expensive)
GGoodrum
1 MW
j3tch1u said:
Try 270-820-RC. Otherwise, I think the 750 ohm version should be fine.
-- Gary
methods
1 GW
j3tch1u said:
If you bump from 1/8W to 1/4W be sure to check that the package size will fit.
I dont have a board in front of me but if I recall there was plenty of room for a 1/4W
-methods
flashedarling
100 mW
- Joined
- Jul 21, 2008
- Messages
- 49
A quick question about transistors.
I have a transistor labeled FAN431 and another labeled KSA931 which are not in the schematic. Do I have the following right.
FAN431 = LM431 = U102
KSA931 = BD136 = Q101
And my Power MOSFET Transistor = Q4
Do I have that right?
I have a transistor labeled FAN431 and another labeled KSA931 which are not in the schematic. Do I have the following right.
FAN431 = LM431 = U102
KSA931 = BD136 = Q101
And my Power MOSFET Transistor = Q4
Do I have that right?
GGoodrum
1 MW
flashedarling said:
Yes, to both questions. The BD136 is a larger TO-126 format, and should be used if lower value shunt resistors are used for balance currents greater than 500 mA, while the KSA931 is a TO-92L package.
j3tch1u
10 kW
thanks guys. the 270-820-RC's were in stock so i got those.
Jay64
100 kW
Are the components the same between a 16 channel and 24 channel build, just in more quantities? If a 24 channel board is built can it be used on a 16 cell pack?
yes they are.
all the channels are identical so the parts are the same.
if you decide to charge the 4.x volt lithium ion cells then you will have to change a couple parts to allow for the higher charging voltage and the higher lvc voltage.
all the channels are identical so the parts are the same.
if you decide to charge the 4.x volt lithium ion cells then you will have to change a couple parts to allow for the higher charging voltage and the higher lvc voltage.
Jay64 said:
Jay64
100 kW
So I will need to have slightly different boards for using with lifebatt and a123 cells?
GGoodrum
1 MW
Jay64 said:
No, the boards can be identical. Both are still LiFePO4-based chemistries, so the CC/CV crossover point needs to be around 3.65-3.70V, and the LVC needs to be around 2.1V. The standard parts in the BOMs set the CC/CV crossover point at about 3.68V. Methods/Patrick uses different resistor values in each channel to set the crossover point to about 4.19V, and uses 3.0V version of the TC54 chip used in the LVC logic, in order to use this board with standard RC-type LiPo packs, which are Lithium-Cobalt-based.
-- Gary
Jay64
100 kW
Somehow between placing my BOM and doing the actual order it looks like a couple of parts didn't get ordered. So I am re-ordering them and was going to order the components for a second board. It looks like all the other stuff is back in stock now, but now they are out of stock of item 299-820-RC, the 1/8W 5% Carbon Film Resistors 820ohms 5%.
Btw, what is the difference between a carbon film resistor and a metal film resistor? Is there a reason why one would be used rather then the other?
Btw, what is the difference between a carbon film resistor and a metal film resistor? Is there a reason why one would be used rather then the other?
Jay64
100 kW
Bear with me on this question...from what I have read, I am think that I can separate the different sections of the board, but still have them connected with 6 wires to have it still act as one unit. But I can not use the bottom 4 channels that would be cut off a board for a 16 channel build all by themselves. I believe that part is true. However, if I cut the bottom 4 channels off a 16 channel build, would I be able to add that bottom section onto a 24 channel build using those 6 wires, or would that overload some of the main components that power the whole board? Just wondering if I do a couple of 16 channel build if I then would be able to use the extra pieces to do a 28 channel build or something like that.
You can use either carbon film or metal film resistors. I forget what the advantages to either type are, but for this application it won't matter.
As far as chaining BMS sections together, I don't think there is any real limitation other than the total voltage of the pack and the ratings of the FET. I think 40 (maybe even 60) cells in series would be fine with a 4110, since it only 'sees' the voltage difference between the charger output and the pack voltage. Worst case is when you first connect a fully depleted pack, but the FET instantly turns on making the voltage across it near zero. I won't start throttling until the cells are nearly full, by which time there won't be much voltage differential.
As far as chaining BMS sections together, I don't think there is any real limitation other than the total voltage of the pack and the ratings of the FET. I think 40 (maybe even 60) cells in series would be fine with a 4110, since it only 'sees' the voltage difference between the charger output and the pack voltage. Worst case is when you first connect a fully depleted pack, but the FET instantly turns on making the voltage across it near zero. I won't start throttling until the cells are nearly full, by which time there won't be much voltage differential.
j3tch1u
10 kW
GGoodrum said:
gary, what is the correct orientation for KSA931PNP on ver 2.2 board (flat side facing right or left)? in the printed instructions included with the kit, the picture indicates "right" but in your latest ver 2.3 schematic, it's "left".
GGoodrum
1 MW
j3tch1u said:
Sorry about that.
They should face right, as in the v2.2 instructions. For v3.3, I made room for the larger BD136 shunt transistors, which are good for higher shunt currents than the KSA931 without getting too hot. Both the BD136 and the KSA931 have the E-C-B pinout orientation, as you look at the nomenclature on the front of the part. I will make this clearer in the next version of the instructions.-- Gary
Jay64
100 kW
Apparently a couple of parts went missing from the BOM to the order. So I am having to re-order 3 more parts, but I don't want to spend $13 in shipping just to get $0.15 of parts. I figured I would put in another full order, but now the 1/8W 5% Carbon Film Resistors 820ohms 5% are out of stock. I called mouser to see if they could offer an alternative part and they suggested:
1/8W 5% Carbon Film Resistors 910ohms 5% part #: 299-910-rc
1/8W 5% Carbon Film Resistors 750ohms 5% part #: 299-750-rc
Would either of these parts work in place of the 820ohms resistor, or would it be better to switch to 1/4w and keep the 820ohms value?
They are getting the 820ohms in on the 11th, but I'm trying to get something done for the Battery Beach Burnout, so I am running out of time.
1/8W 5% Carbon Film Resistors 910ohms 5% part #: 299-910-rc
1/8W 5% Carbon Film Resistors 750ohms 5% part #: 299-750-rc
Would either of these parts work in place of the 820ohms resistor, or would it be better to switch to 1/4w and keep the 820ohms value?
They are getting the 820ohms in on the 11th, but I'm trying to get something done for the Battery Beach Burnout, so I am running out of time.
Jay64 said:
I'd go for the 910 ohm ones. You could even use 1k instead of 820. 1k should be easy to find.
1/4 watt ones are kinda too big to fit in the holes without a lot of messing around.
Jay64
100 kW
Thanks Fechter!
GGoodrum
1 MW
marto said:
The boards will be back in stock on Monday. I think several have used this board with regen, with no problems.
-- Gary
steveo
100 kW
Hey everyone,
Is there a pdf avaliable to reference which parts go where on this bms board.
thanks
-steveo
Is there a pdf avaliable to reference which parts go where on this bms board.
thanks
-steveo
i am not sure if this is the right place to ask this question but if it isnt then one of you mods are welcome to start a new topic and move the message.
i was wondering what type of connectors does the crystalyte controllers use for the brake inhibits?
because i want to connect the bms to the brake inhibit but right now the only way is what is pictured below
right now i have a piece of telephone wire poked into the connector .
i could cut and splice but if i should need to send the controller in for repair it would be more difficult.
does anyone know what type connector it is i know it is a 3 pin connector and if someone has ordered the connectors from mouser or digikey before that would help
due to a bug in the board software you will have to right click on the image and open image in new window or disable the stylesheets
i was wondering what type of connectors does the crystalyte controllers use for the brake inhibits?
because i want to connect the bms to the brake inhibit but right now the only way is what is pictured below
right now i have a piece of telephone wire poked into the connector .
i could cut and splice but if i should need to send the controller in for repair it would be more difficult.
does anyone know what type connector it is i know it is a 3 pin connector and if someone has ordered the connectors from mouser or digikey before that would help
due to a bug in the board software you will have to right click on the image and open image in new window or disable the stylesheets
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