First Conversion - Giant Sedona - Your input greatly apprec.

[OCMike]

Does the battery the triangle? Have a chuckle at my choice of words

Result - ping don't fit

Hopefully Raul will pass on cal3thousand's bike and I'll like it enough to spend the cashola!

http://youtu.be/hNi9uGyZYl4

8.9 x 5.9 x 4.1 fits no problem --- that's the 36v 15ah ping.

 

[e-beach]

Just an FYI if you haven't seen this yet. More fat to chew on. http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=32312

BTW cal3thousand is a super nice guy and his work is also very nice.

 

[ken1645]

OCMike, it's been funny reading this thread. It seems every post you change your mind on what you are wanting to get

I watched your video and as for your battery situation, did you already buy the battery which will not fit? If so, why not just buy a new bicycle from walmart?

Or as others are saying you could get a rear cargo rack thing and mount the batteries on there. Some people use a tool box and simply put all the batteries in there and drill a small hole for the wires coming out.. some padding in it as well.

Personally I've got 8 of 5s lipo 20c Turnigy batteries from Hobby King to do 20s2p which I know will fit in a triangle frame bag inside the frame.. (using 72V controller and 1000W rear yescomusa kit). Wes seems to really know his stuff so I'm basically recreating his setup I've been tinkering with electronics (mainly high powered burning lasers) for years though and studied electricity in college.

Best of luck. I'm enjoying putting everything together, just got my torque arms epoxyed onto the frame 2 days ago, it's now just a waiting game for a couple more parts coming from China.

 

[OCMike]

OCMike, it's been funny reading this thread. It seems every post you change your mind on what you are wanting to get

I watched your video and as for your battery situation, did you already buy the battery which will not fit? If so, why not just buy a new bicycle from walmart?

Or as others are saying you could get a rear cargo rack thing and mount the batteries on there. Some people use a tool box and simply put all the batteries in there and drill a small hole for the wires coming out.. some padding in it as well.

Personally I've got 8 of 5s lipo 20c Turnigy batteries from Hobby King to do 20s2p which I know will fit in a triangle frame bag inside the frame.. (using 72V controller and 1000W rear yescomusa kit). Wes seems to really know his stuff so I'm basically recreating his setup I've been tinkering with electronics (mainly high powered burning lasers) for years though and studied electricity in college.

Best of luck. I'm enjoying putting everything together, just got my torque arms epoxyed onto the frame 2 days ago, it's now just a waiting game for a couple more parts coming from China.

Hi ken1645,

Thanks ... yes - so many things going through my brain - hard to know what to do ... but I think I'm zeroing in. Everyone has been very helpful here. Thank You everyone! Sorry that I'm having such trouble deciding and then just doing it. I actually tried to purchase from yescom online but I couldn't get their website to accept my paypal payment - it just kept going back and forth between logging in to paypal and the site saying something was wrong. I think I was trying to buy a 48v 800watt rear install kit. May be I'm happy I couldn't get the payment to go through.

Yes, a rear cargo rack is an option but people are saying the overall balance of the bike will not be good. I'm kind of wanting triangle mount. May be a different battery than ping is the way to go. Or maybe I should just get the 36v 15ah ping.

But then dogman said cal3thousand's bike with long windings would be good for city stop and go and the voltage could be stepped up at a later time. A ready made DIY that somebody else did is attractive IF it's a good deal. And cal3thousand has good feedback - so here I am

Ultimately I can see myself doing the rc LiPo thing but it's one thing at a time.

This board has been great!

Good luck to you with your project ... sounds like it's going to be fast!

 

[OCMike]

If you want front, here's the same kit for less with free shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Front-Wheel-Electric-Bicycle-Conversion-Kit-24-36-48V-250W-500W-700W-800W-1000W-/290754569359
Like others mentioned though, a rear would be better. And I'd go for the 48V1000W kit.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rear-Wheel-Electric-Bicycle-Conversion-Kit-24V-36V-48V-250W-500W-700W-800W-1000W-/290754592384

For a battery, I'd use multiples of 2 of these depending on the range you want.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=16793
That'll give you a 44.4V pack perfect for the 30A controller that comes with the kit.
Of course you'll need a charger if you don't have one already. Cheapest would be any 6s charger. Best option imo would be this one to charge as 12s.
http://www.hobbypartz.com/75p-1220-charger.html?gclid=CNa3z9_N57ICFayPPAod10MAPw

OK, I've decided - I think wesnewell's suggestion seems best. Thanks!

1000w Rear DD from yescom. Six 6S1P 5000Mah 22.2v Zippy's with which I'll make three 12s2p 44.4v 5ah batteries, a Thunder 1220 charger, a CA - need help in choosing the correct one (is there a version 3.2?), and Torque Arms. This will all be installed on my Giant Sedona.

I'll go to Yescom myself to buy the kit ... it's the same price as ebay when you select 48v and 1000w. I think a return will be easier with yescom since they're local to me.

I don't know if the controller is rigged for a CA hook-up. I think it has to have a shunt with a specified resistance to calibrate the CA. Since my batteries are so small and LiPo has a pretty tight temperament I need the CA to keep tabs on the batteries at all times. Having 3 batteries should be enough - even if I went to 10ah I'd still want the CA ... I think the CA makes things more interesting anyway and is probably almost mandatory if you're running LiPo - with a 10ah set up I'm not sure how the charging would go since the thunder 1220 charges 12 cell batteries and a 44.4v 10ah set up would be 24s8p. I think with the right set up and connectors I could make sure the cells are balanced (to within some tolerance) and then see what happens if I do 24s4p = 88.8v 5ah (for fun once I gain a little experience). Most of my no pedaling trips will be around 7 miles round trip - for pedaling trips I'm a pretty good pedaler. Each 44.4v 5ah battery will weigh about 3.5 pounds so I plan to always carry an extra with me. Rotating 3 seems good.

Is this a good plan? Does it even make sense?

List of purchase items:

1000w rear dd motor kit
six zippy 5000Mah 22.2v rc LiPo's
Thunder 1220 Charger
Power Supply (which one?)
CA (will I need to upgrade the controller and v3.2?)
Torque Arms
A flat resistant tire (suggestions)
Rack
Panniers
Rear View Mirror
ThudBuster

I must be forgetting some stuff ... what am I forgetting?

Thanks everyone -- super helpful to say the least -- beers are still on me!

 

[e-beach]

Is this a good plan? Does it even make sense?

List of purchase items:

1000w rear dd motor kit

works for me

six zippy 5000Mah 22.2v rc LiPo's

Starting at 44v may put you too close to lvc. 5ah may get you 7 miles. If you want those batteries consider 66v 10ah in a triangle bag if the controller will handle 66v. A 48v controller should do it, but the only way to know for sure is to open it and see what the capacitors can take. Wes would know the answer to that.[/quote]

CA (will I need to upgrade the controller and v3.2?)

The "Stand Alone" CA is recommend for the yescomusa kit.

A flat resistant tire (suggestions)

I have had very good luck with my Bontrager 26 inch H2 hard case tires in the city and on the sandy bike paths. Also consider 2mm thorn resistant inner tubes filled with appropriate amount of puncture sealant. People around here like Slime.

...... beers are still on me!

 

[OCMike]

66.6v 5ah would be 18S3P -- doesn't that make charging awkward? The Thunder 1220 does 12 cells balanced.

Can you not set the LVC yourself (either in the controller or CA)?

My thought process:

Two zippy 6S1P 22.2v 5000Mah in series make one 12S2P 44.4v 5ah battery. Then with these 44.4v bundles I can put them together parallel or series depending on what I want (range or power). Actually, I'm not sure how easy that is ... it might be a matter of just slapping them together with the correct pre fabricated connector and I'm off at either 44.4v 10ah or 88.8v 5ah. But I suspect it's more involved than just doing it. I probably need to make sure the cells charges are balanced between packs before I slap them together and I'm not sure about putting batteries in series then parallel then series then parallel? I assume the single 6S1P zippy's are parallel at the cell level. I think when we put these guys together in parallel/series parallel should go first to keep halve's, thirds, quarters at lower voltage and series to increase the voltage last -- just seems safter -- don't know if it makes any difference in final outcome.

Please tell me if I'm off base somewhere -- I'm a total noob and I feel like I might be jumping into the deep end prematurely.

Seems like 3 44.4v 5ah batteries would do me right as long as I keep on top of the charge (CA required). Like I said I'm a pedaler ... there are occasions where I don't want to arrive at destination sweaty so no pedaling sometimes ... I have a car though ... so I can make that part of it work no matter what.

 

[wesnewell]

OK, I've decided - I think wesnewell's suggestion seems best. Thanks!

1000w Rear DD from yescom. Six 6S1P 5000Mah 22.2v Zippy's with which I'll make three 12s2p 44.4v 5ah batteries, a Thunder 1220 charger, a CA - need help in choosing the correct one (is there a version 3.2?), and Torque Arms. This will all be installed on my Giant Sedona.

6 5000mah 6s packs will make a 12s3p 15ah 44.4V pack. You don't need a CA. If you want one, get it later when you understand what it is. If you want something to monitor your battery charge, get this.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Waterproof-Digital-Voltmeter-DC-15V-To-120V-Red-Led-Voltage-Digital-Panel-Meter-/170846310527

I'll go to Yescom myself to buy the kit ... it's the same price as ebay when you select 48v and 1000w. I think a return will be easier with yescom since they're local to me.

I don't know if the controller is rigged for a CA hook-up. I think it has to have a shunt with a specified resistance to calibrate the CA. Since my batteries are so small and LiPo has a pretty tight temperament I need the CA to keep tabs on the batteries at all times. Having 3 batteries should be enough - even if I went to 10ah I'd still want the CA ... I think the CA makes things more interesting anyway and is probably almost mandatory if you're running LiPo - with a 10ah set up I'm not sure how the charging would go since the thunder 1220 charges 12 cell batteries and a 44.4v 10ah set up would be 24s8p. I think with the right set up and connectors I could make sure the cells are balanced (to within some tolerance) and then see what happens if I do 24s4p = 88.8v 5ah (for fun once I gain a little experience). Most of my no pedaling trips will be around 7 miles round trip - for pedaling trips I'm a pretty good pedaler. Each 44.4v 5ah battery will weigh about 3.5 pounds so I plan to always carry an extra with me. Rotating 3 seems good.

The CA doesn't keep track of your battery condition. It will display voltage, just like the volt meter, and provide ah used, etc. All you really need for a gauge is the volt meter. The best way to use your pack will be as one 15ah pack. That will put less stress on the batteries, will only weigh ~10 lbs and will fit easily in the triangle if you don't have a rear suspension bike. You'll get a range of ~30 miles at 20mph, or ~15 miles wot (~28mph). I don't want to talk you out of a CA, but it's a luxury item and not needed in any way. Get it later when you understand more if you still want one.

List of purchase items:

1000w rear dd motor kit
six zippy 5000Mah 22.2v rc LiPo's
Thunder 1220 Charger
Power Supply (which one?)
CA (will I need to upgrade the controller and v3.2?)
Torque Arms
A flat resistant tire (suggestions)
Rack
Panniers
Rear View Mirror
ThudBuster

I must be forgetting some stuff ... what am I forgetting?

Thanks everyone -- super helpful to say the least -- beers are still on me!

You want a 12-15V power supply of at least 400W. Lots of people use old computer PSU's or cheap server psu's.
https://sites.google.com/site/tjinguytech/my-projects/convert-pc-ps

 

[OCMike]

The best way to use your pack will be as one 15ah pack. That will put less stress on the batteries, will only weigh ~10 lbs and will fit easily in the triangle if you don't have a rear suspension bike. You'll get a range of ~30 miles at 20mph, or ~15 miles wot (~28mph).

Thanks ... how would I configure that to make use of the Thunder 1220 charger?

Do I parallel 3 groups of 2 (each group of 2 is in series)? And break it down each time I need to charge and charge one 12S2P at a time? Would it be better to parallel 3 at a time (creating 2 18S6P = 2 22.2v 15ah batteries) and series the 2 groups of 3? Doesn't this make charging a chore? Or can I just charge the whole 44.4v 15ah battery all at once? How would I accomplish the balancing and making sure all the cells are in good shape?

I don't have rear suspension ... triangle bag for the batteries? So many things to be worked out ... I think this set up is the winner - cost effective, powerful, room to modify, hopefully FUN FUN FUN!

Thanks again.

 

[e-beach]

6 5000mah 6s packs will make a 12s3p 15ah 44.4V pack. .....

OK, If wesnewell says the 44.4v pack will work, it will work.

A CA will let you set your LVC higher then the stock LVC on your controller. I don't think you can adjust the LVC in yescom controllers unless you are really good with controller electronics.

@wesnewell. Since I can't seem to get my brain wrapped around it at the moment, what is the lvc of the yescomusa 48v controllers?

@OCMike if you haven't checked out this thread, give it a good read before installing your yescomusa kit. It has tips for you. :wink:
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=46016

Also this series is dry and slow but has good information on general e-bike building.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=C27Rjh3ZQes#!

 

[dnmun]

there was a 48?V20Ah lifepo4 pack for sale in LA for $250 and that woulda solved the shipping problem since you live in LA.

 

[OCMike]

there was a 48?V20Ah lifepo4 pack for sale in LA for $250 and that woulda solved the shipping problem since you live in LA.

May be I'm a fool for not jumping on that deal. But that battery weighs 17.25 pounds and probably won't fit in my triangle. San Diego is a 2 hour drive from my location. It does seem like a good deal though - since I'm going to spend $400+ for my set up, may be even more when it's all said and done.

Thanks though!

 

[dnmun]

ok, thought that was LA.

 

[wesnewell]

48V controllers have an lvc of 42V. Just added to this.
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49638&p=733752

 

[OCMike]

Just ordered the Thunder 1220 charger online.

Tried to order 6 Zippy 5000mAh 22.2v LiPo's ... but they are on back order and HK wouldn't let me order items that are not in stock.

Are these (http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewitem.asp?idproduct=21373) a good alternative?

Hopefully, I'll have time tomorrow to go to yescom and get a 48v 1000w kit.

Then it's off to the races ... wish me luck!

 

[wesnewell]

They will work, but with shipping it might be cheaper from the USA warehouse.

 

[OCMike]

That blows ... HK website says "This product available from a warehouse near you!" even after I've logged into paypal.

Then when I choose shipping my choices are sing or swiss at a huge cost.

I guess I wait for the batteries ... I submitted my email address to HK so they say they'll eMail me when they get'em in stock.

I've got a store named Hobby People just down the street from me but their prices are sky high (in comparison) for this stuff. OTOH returns would be geographically easy. I guess it's best to get the kit, install it, and then take another look at waiting for batteries. I've already bought Thunder 1220 - it's on it's way.

Look at these - http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__9176__Turnigy_5000mAh_6S_20C_Lipo_Pack.html - Even cheaper ... but not from a US warehouse either.

 

[OCMike]

Yescom website says out of stock on the 1000watt kits. Is an 800watt kit just as good? I mean, with over - volting and stuff what's the difference? I'm thinking they might be the same and this is just marketing type crap - more selection but same product.

I wanted to go today and get it .

The 800watt rear kit says this about the battery requirement: nominal capacity not less than 17Ah is compatible with the motor.

The 1000watt rear kit says this about the battery requirement: nominal capacity not less than 14Ah is compatible with the motor.

That seems backwards in my noob mind.

 

[e-beach]

Yescom website says out of stock on the 1000watt kits.

I was curious myself, I just talked to them and said that they should have the 48v 1000w rear kits in by Friday May 31st

As far as I know the 800w is 800w and 1000w is 1000w.

 

[OCMike]

Yes, I just talked to them too. I was told they have them on order and they have a few in stock. I told them they sale on ebay and on ebay it says available. The girl confirmed but said when they only have a few in warehouse she likes to physically check to make sure they're actually there. She's going to call me to confirm and then I'm there ...

Thanks!

Great links on your last post too! Really really helpful!

 

[wesnewell]

Yescom website says out of stock on the 1000watt kits. Is an 800watt kit just as good? I mean, with over - volting and stuff what's the difference? I'm thinking they might be the same and this is just marketing type crap - more selection but same product.

I wanted to go today and get it .

The 800watt rear kit says this about the battery requirement: nominal capacity not less than 17Ah is compatible with the motor.

The 1000watt rear kit says this about the battery requirement: nominal capacity not less than 14Ah is compatible with the motor.

That seems backwards in my noob mind.

I know for a fact that there's a difference between the 500W and 1000W. I've never bought an 800W kit, but there will certainly be some differences. Whether it's enough to affect performance I couldn't say for sure, but I'd wait for the 48V 1000W kit. Forget anything they say about battery ah size. Size has nothing to do with requirement. C rate does. By buying 15ah of 25C batteries, you can run any motor you want too. It can provide up to 375A of power to any controller. Max amp draw of the yescomusa motor controllers are 30A.

 

[docnjoj]

If the Gentleman goes with an entire package from Ebikes.ca, EM3EV, or Amped, it will all be figured out for him.
Then, after gaining experience, pick and choose components, make mistakes, do 3 or 4 builds.
If he has the ability to understand it all, over time, he will be the one recommending kits for noobs

Welcome to the Forum!

Tommy L sends.....

Yep what he said. ebikes.ca and the others are reliable and provide "plug and play". Not the cheapest but bargains seldom are!
otherDoc

 

[OCMike]

Yes, I just talked to them too. I was told they have them on order and they have a few in stock. I told them they sale on ebay and on ebay it says available. The girl confirmed but said when they only have a few in warehouse she likes to physically check to make sure they're actually there. She's going to call me to confirm and then I'm there ...

Thanks!

Great links on your last post too! Really really helpful!

Well I was out and about doing other stuff and I had choices as to which route to go home: 1) go straight home = 45 miles, or 2) go to yescom and see if they have it in stock = 60 miles.

I chose (2). Well worth it! Christina is a tatted little girl super cute and super helpful! She apologized for not calling me back and quickly went to the warehouse to scout for my item. 2 minutes later she comes back and says yup, $290 please. She was much more friendly and less curt than what I describe, but she was efficient ... but who cares, right? I'm just saying that if you like 23 YO skinny girls with larger than average top half wearing a skimpy tank top and shorts, you'd like going to yescom.

I took pictures - but I'm at Barnes & Noble right now and it seems as though their network is disallowing uploads. Just one pic of the outside front and one pic of the outside front of will call where I picked up my item. Sorry - I wanted to take a pic of Christina but I would have looked too much like a creepy old man - may be I am, but probably not!

Anyways - when I get home I'll break open the plain brown box it came in and see what I got. The links e-beach put in his post a couple posts back have upped my confidence a bit - may be I can do this build without help from somebody experienced? I'm thinking to film the whole thing and post it - Noob with Rear Install Kit ... Anyone interested in me documenting my bumbling around and watching it? Actually, I think I'm a little better than average in the mechanically inclined department - my problem is I can be easily confused and can fall into a mode of paralysis born from over-thinking.

And I still have a lack of battery problem! I'm also suffering from lack of torque arms and a lack of a way to carry everything. Not to mention my lack of experience with any of this. Other than that I lack NOTHING! At least the charger is on it's way. Radio Shack solves a power supply problem in a jiffy.

One thing at a time

 

[ken1645]

Yescom website says out of stock on the 1000watt kits. Is an 800watt kit just as good? I mean, with over - volting and stuff what's the difference? I'm thinking they might be the same and this is just marketing type crap - more selection but same product.

I wanted to go today and get it .

The 800watt rear kit says this about the battery requirement: nominal capacity not less than 17Ah is compatible with the motor.

The 1000watt rear kit says this about the battery requirement: nominal capacity not less than 14Ah is compatible with the motor.

That seems backwards in my noob mind.

I bought a 2nd 1000W kit today.. they are in stock at yescomusa.

I'm building a 2nd ebike on a better frame it's pretty cheap once you have all the infrastructure such as chargers / batteries / psu / wires/ etc.