Hill Climbing Assistance

[eKitsTW]

I think it was mentioned the 16” wheels if electrified would be great hill climbers. I may just mid drive or front ehub the folder. It is chromoly. Use it as commuter. Would the mid drive interfere with the seatpost going all the way through when folding?

Personal avice....
Second hand bikes cost USD$100 to get one in Japan or Taiwan easily. Why stick on that?!
If 20inch foldable,also gets bike parts more convenient.

 

[metanewbie]

No problem.
For a patchwork kit, I would recommend Grin. I think they are quite professional. However, if you don’t mind the expensive cost of replacing the battery in the future, you can consider it.

We design and develop our own controllers and motors, and use our own software to adjust them, unlike those patchwork kits purchased on Taobao. The motors and controllers of those kits are all standard specifications, just like wearing a uniform.

Additionally, I have reservations about custom e-bike conversion kits offered by personal workshops. While there may be great handmade items in them, customization means only the original maker can perform repairs. If the person cannot be found one day, maintenance becomes an issue.

Good warnings. I’m curious. With one of your hubs could I get a local bike shop to respoke one of my existing wheels and install it? The wheels have disc brakes.

 

[metanewbie]

Personal avice....
Second hand bikes cost USD$100 to get one in Japan or Taiwan easily. Why stick on that?!
If 20inch foldable,also gets bike parts more convenient.

It folds and I set up the gearing very well on it. Both of my bikes use the same chains, derailers,shifters, and cassettes and I have a surplus of spare parts for them.

Plus, I don’t want more than two bicycles. I’ve been down that path before …

 

[eKitsTW]

Notice:hub is 36 holes.
That is Ok as you wish.
Our hub kit is more cheap as well...
Rim brake/disc 6 holes brake both compatible.

 

[metanewbie]

I was not aware of the QIROLL untill you mentioned it. Did you see this extensive review Tech review: QIROLL Q-RE PRO - 320W E-bike Kit - SupermotoXL Designs - Life, Designs, Hobbies ? He really likes it on his lightweight (11 kg total weight) bike for commuting, compared to his heavy Bafang BBS02B (which left him stranded once).

Besides my concern about it the more research I do, the more likely this might be the best overall boost. Everything else comes with a lot of weight or trade offs. This friction drive has a nice option of being completely disengaged.

 

[Zambam]

What does a lot of stuff look like and how do you currently carry it?

Since you are 155 lb, then you also have the option of a TSDZ2B mid drive. Since you pedal a lot already, the torque sensing pedal assist will work great, and you can take advantage of the gearing you already have (I believe 52T is available) on the smaller bike. Hard to tell what the chainring to chain stay clearance looks like on the larger bike without a better angled photo. You could run 250W, 500W or 750W.
This guy is using 500W. He passes some riders on a few steep spots, so you can see what it would look like to pass your current self. Sound level is reasonable, especially compared to a friction drive.

Wrong video (Bafang)? This one is the TSDZ2B. Figure on adding approx 9 to 12 lbs (depending on battery size) with the TSDZ2B kit.

 

[Zambam]

Besides my concern about it the more research I do, the more likely this might be the best overall boost. Everything else comes with a lot of weight or trade offs. This friction drive has a nice option of being completely disengaged.

The QIROLL kit is advertised as 1.8 kg (4 lbs)! Is that w or w/o battery?

 

[metanewbie]

The QIROLL kit is advertised as 1.8 kg (4 lbs)! Is that w or w/o battery?

The battery is 3.3 lbs. The unit is very light. I’m wondering if it’s better to get the Pro version with proprietary battery, regenerative braking, 320 watt, bidirectional placement or the Flex version which accepts any 24v-36v but 240 watt, unidirectional placement, and no regenerative braking.

If I went flex, what’s a good affordable 36V battery?

 

[metanewbie]

Wrong video (Bafang)? This one is the TSDZ2B. Figure on adding approx 9 to 12 lbs (depending on battery size) with the TSDZ2B kit.

Yeah all that extra weight and bulk are concerning especially if I only want the occasional boost.

 

[docw009]

It looks like that’s what the above mentioned kit runs. Are there any disadvantages to using those batteries?

Small watt-hour capabilty. like80-160 watthours. My ebikes burn 8-10 WH/mile.

Glamour shot of my Nova with a 36V2.4AH hoverboard pack tucked under the seat. That's 70WH. Barely had enough power to ride to the dock and back.

Same bike with a 600WH pack, rigged up for a long ride in South Dakota.

 

[metanewbie]

Assuming I go with the friction system, I'm considering one of two scenarios:

Pro Version $439.00 H70 33V-9ah Battery*1 / Continuous Power 320W / Cycling mode: ECO Sports and Regenerative braking.
Flex Version: $198.00 Continuous power 240W / Cycling mode: ECO and Sports / Compatible with 24-36V battery / Use 36V-5ah battery or more

If I went with Flex, I would get this frame bag battery with 10 or 15 ah. I've been advised that affordablebikes.ca has safe batteries.

Which is the better choice?

 

[neptronix]

You have a ~12 mile ride, and the power output will be intermittent; you'd probably be more than happy with a 10ah battery.

Never heard of affordablebikes.ca before, interesting company, i like that they sell big batteries, whereas my favorites, ebikes.ca and em3ev.com, do not. What have you heard about the quality of their batteries?

 

[metanewbie]

You have a ~12 mile ride, and the power output will be intermittent; you'd probably be more than happy with a 10ah battery.

Never heard of affordablebikes.ca before, interesting company, i like that they sell big batteries, whereas my favorites, ebikes.ca and em3ev.com, do not. What have you heard about the quality of their batteries?

There's an Ebikes discord, and they recommend them.

So you'd go with the Flex?

 

[neptronix]

I'd go with the flex, the top speed of it is lower, which is a good sign. I would keep an eye on the thermals during your first rides. The forum is probably curious about your results, or at least i am. Hope to see you post up a build thread.

 

[metanewbie]

I'd go with the flex, the top speed of it is lower, which is a good sign. I would keep an eye on the thermals during your first rides. The forum is probably curious about your results, or at least i am. Hope to see you post up a build thread.

I was wondering the same. You probably don't want something too powerful for a friction drive unless you have a subscription for new tires. I wonder how I can monitor the temps.

 

[neptronix]

Any laser temp meter will do, cheap is fine. Perfect is the enemy of good enough.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313&_nkw=laser+temp+gun&_sacat=0&_odkw=laser+gun&_osacat=0

Find the hottest part of the drive to measure and use that as your reference point. Add 20C to the measurement to make a napkin math assessment of what the hottest part is. If that crosses 100c, you're in the motor's danger zone. Adjust use of the drive accordingly ( maybe it needs a break halfway up the hill, maybe it doesn't )

 

[metanewbie]

Any laser temp meter will do, cheap is fine. Perfect is the enemy of good enough.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2334524.m570.l1313&_nkw=laser+temp+gun&_sacat=0&_odkw=laser+gun&_osacat=0

Find the hottest part of the drive to measure and use that as your reference point. Add 20C to the measurement to make a napkin math assessment of what the hottest part is. If that crosses 100c, you're in the motor's danger zone. Adjust use of the drive accordingly ( maybe it needs a break halfway up the hill, maybe it doesn't )

I will investigate that!

You might find this interesting.

 

[Zambam]

This thermocouple meter has quick real time response & affordable. I have the probe inside my TSDZ2. Works good. https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256...st_main.5.42aa1802s3TWTU&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa

 

[neptronix]

Honestly i don't like that effect of heating up the tire. If you are using vbrakes too, going down hills, that also heats up the tire.. and a critical amount of heat will make a tire pop.

I'm probably a lot more nervous about this because i live in the land of steep mountains. people blow out tires of non ebikes with vbrakes long after the fading point when descending some miles of -7% average grade.

I live in an area that is hot more often than not, so that would be another drawback i didn't think about.

Conversely a big plus if you're in a cold area.

The lower powered drive would have less of this effect, i imagine.

 

[metanewbie]

Honestly i don't like that effect of heating up the tire. If you are using vbrakes too, going down hills, that also heats up the tire.. and a critical amount of heat will make a tire pop.

I'm probably a lot more nervous about this because i live in the land of steep mountains. people blow out tires of non ebikes with vbrakes long after the fading point when descending some miles of -7% average grade.

I live in an area that is hot more often than not, so that would be another drawback i didn't think about.

Conversely a big plus if you're in a cold area.

The lower powered drive would have less of this effect, i imagine.

I'll have to consider that all. I'm typing on a spreadsheet to work out my numbers and speculations — nerd moments.
Is that why you would go Flex vs Pro because it's not so heat intensive?

 

[neptronix]

No, because it has a much lower top speed relative to the small difference in wattage between the two drives. This would make it geared better for your 700c wheel and be less likely to overheat.

 

[metanewbie]

No, because it has a much lower top speed relative to the small difference in wattage between the two drives. This would make it geared better for your 700c wheel and be less likely to overheat.

Ooh, okay. I switched 700c from 3x9 48/36/26T 11-34 to 30T x 11-38. I find it much easier to focus on the road and shift gears, and it has a similar low-gear ability. I did lose top speed, however. Once I reach about 20 MPH, I spin out with the 1x9 and coast on a flat or downhill. Does that matter?

I'm also considering purchasing two of their quick-release bracket to easily swap the system to the 16" folder that's 52T x 11-38. But would that cause a problem for the Flex? According to a gear calculator, the gearing between both bicycles is similar, but I recall you mentioning about small wheel torque.

 

[E-HP]

Wrong video (Bafang)?

You’re right! Same YouTube channel though. Not sure what happened when I pasted the link.

 

[metanewbie]

You’re right! Same YouTube channel though. Not sure what happened when I pasted the link.

The TSDZ2B sounds much louder than the Bafang. Is that because of bicycle + camera positioning, or is it a noisier system?

 

[neptronix]

Ooh, okay. I switched 700c from 3x9 48/36/26T 11-34 to 30T x 11-38. I find it much easier to focus on the road and shift gears, and it has a similar low-gear ability. I did lose top speed, however. Once I reach about 20 MPH, I spin out with the 1x9 and coast on a flat or downhill. Does that matter?

No, this motor has one gear and will want to do ~25mph on the flat on a 700c, your gearing is great, the motor's is going to be poor.

I'm also considering purchasing two of their quick-release bracket to easily swap the system to the 16" folder that's 52T x 11-38. But would that cause a problem for the Flex? According to a gear calculator, the gearing between both bicycles is similar, but I recall you mentioning about small wheel torque.

Yes the wheel is nearly half the diameter of the 700c, so the roller motor should be much better geared for the hill climb.