How much is getting tested & matched A123 20ah cells worth?

Okay, you guys have convinced me to build my own 36V20AH battery pack in 12s1p. I got lots of great ideas on battery pack builds on this forum.

I thought the pre-assembled pack from Victpower might be an easy way to go, but I now believe I can do a better job then Victpower. Plus I just did not want to deal with having to repair or replace a pack even under warranty due to the shipping expense.

So put me down for at least 12 cells. I may want 1 or 2 more for spares. Any estimate what the shipping costs might add per order or per cell? Also, do you have an updated timeframe for ordering and actually receiving these cell packs.

Thanks for taking the lead on this process.
 
I'm starting to think I done good. I just got an email that my 40 custom welded blocks of cells will ship out Monday along with my A123's. I probably should have just gone just for A123's, because this was included with my address confirmation.
View attachment A123 first 4 cells test data.bmp
He stated that the A123s were being handled through a "professional battery factory", and that all cells are new with full tabs. Hopefully this is a sign that at least some of those cell making machines are now out of the hands of the idiotic A123 management and in the hands of those who understand that you run such machines 24/7 producing as many cells as possible before they become totally obsolete, and be willing to sell them to anyone who wants to buy them. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

John
 
arkmundi said:
John in CR said:
He stated that the A123s were being handled through a "professional battery factory", and that all cells are new with full tabs. John
Click to expand...
So, I'm unclear if there's an offer here or not, and what's its for. Is it possible to get just cells, not packs, no welds, capacity tested? Thanks. :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

I want to get my first order in hand before referring everyone to him. Anything from raw cells to finished packs and everything in between. My hope is that we can act as a group at least for the first order or 2, so we can maybe get a bulk discount despite the separate shipping, but more importantly have a larger population of cells for matching purposes.

Arkmundi, since you were looking to put a group buy together, I nominate you to be the group coordinator. Once I get this first 4 cell, I'll be ordering 27 with the first group batch. I think in the interest of caution, we shouldn't get too carried away and limit the first one to 300-500 cells.

John
 
John in CR said:
Arkmundi, since you were looking to put a group buy together, I nominate you to be the group coordinator. Once I get this first 4 cell, I'll be ordering 27 with the first group batch. I think in the interest of caution, we shouldn't get too carried away and limit the first one to 300-500 cells. John
Click to expand...
Thanks for the confidence. Maybe the way to step into it is get the interest first, then as a group consider ourselves a cooperative purchasing group, then go through some consensus on how to manage it. There seemed to be a general lack of trust and respect here at ES for the whole group buy thing, and my thread. Barkmau and I split a Victpower carton of 14 7/7 and it was really easy. So one shipment from Hong Kong and an additional 16.37 from MA to FL, so there's advantage in shared shipping alone. We did Fedex ground to avoid any potential problems shipping Li-ion and it worked well.
 
2 ES global mods gave the group buy thread that failed credibility.

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=41354&start=15#p610351

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=41354&start=45#p624002

Now some of the kids are sure it was health problems that caused http://endless-sphere.com/forums/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=6806 to take peoples money on paypal as a gift for battery cells and not send their cells. Ok........

I would not worry about what Big Moose says for sure about group buys or spam for that matter.

I almost jumped in on that deal. :( Big Moose's posts made it look for real to me.

I want 8 cells. I know how to do paypal and I know the rules.
 
Etriker, this won't be any group buy. I'm suggesting group ordering for mutual benefit. Oh and I just realized that I hadn't mentioned that these orders require balls and faith in fellow man....he doesn't take paypal. I used Moneygram, but Western Union is super cheap too from the US to China. Bank wire is another option, I think. FWIW, I only use paypal with one of my vendors in China. I've never been ripped off by someone out of China, only Malaysia and Florida, and in both of those cases I ignored some red flags.

John
 
agniusm said:
Any update on this?
Click to expand...

My 40 test packs of some other cells didn't get fished until Wednesday, so my shipment didn't go out until Thursday or Friday. My fingers are crossed to have them late next week. It all depends if my boxes are routed through the long or short Customs route. I'm comfortable enough that I already started some other non-A123 transactions with him.

Jiang did tell me that supply will be a when available thing, not ongoing and steady. We should start organizing who wants in and how many cells. I'm in for 27 on this next batch. Anyone with a bit of free time to volunteer to be the organizer? I have about a million other things I should be working on. I think it's prudent to wait to send any money until I have my first cells in hand, but that doesn't mean we can't get started.

John
 
John I would be interested in a 24s A123 pack with a high current BMS... would be you able to ask him how much the cells plus his labor time would be?

Thanks
 
gensem said:
John I would be interested in a 24s A123 pack with a high current BMS... would be you able to ask him how much the cells plus his labor time would be?
Thanks
Click to expand...

I think you'll want a BMS that doesn't see main current, and instead provides a signal to turn off based on a cell level LVC in the case of the controller, or cell level HVC in the case of the charger. Low power cells are what need the more expensive BMS's that see main current so the can protect the battery from current too high. Use your fuse for that, which you need anyway even with a current limiting BMS.

My package is in route, so I'll be comfortable in referring others to Jiang quite soon and we should discuss how to handle it. I'm going to put everyone in direct contact, but I think it's in our best interest to do some group coordination in terms of timing of our orders. He doesn't regularly carry the A123, so if he can buy in bulk, then we should able to get the best price. It also allows matching cells going to each. Those potential benefits are why I started the thread, but I don't want to be the organizer.

John
 
John yet you would need a BMS to control the charging process using a kpcharger and for cutting the throttle if you hit lvc on one of the cells.
Are your guy able to do battery packs like that?
 
Although I am not the longest-running member of this site, if needed, I am interested in helping with the coordination of this cooperative buying group.

I've worked with obtaining and distributing A123 cells from other successful group buys and can be verified as a real person (not a sock puppet).

As I mentioned in my earlier post, I am possibly looking for a larger quantity as well if the supply becomes available.
 
Good work. I think you are spot on about making sure the supply of a123 won't dry up before you heavily invest in them. If you're looking to get into the supply game, and I hope you are, it's gonna take a lot of work, time, and money to get people to consider ordering your product. Best bet is to invest in a product you'll know you will be able to sell for years. Not one that may dry up in a few months.
 
John in CR said:
My package is in route, so I'll be comfortable in referring others to Jiang quite soon and we should discuss how to handle it. I'm going to put everyone in direct contact, but I think it's in our best interest to do some group coordination in terms of timing of our orders. He doesn't regularly carry the A123, so if he can buy in bulk, then we should able to get the best price. It also allows matching cells going to each. Those potential benefits are why I started the thread, but I don't want to be the organizer.
Click to expand...
Still interested. Again, I believe this is a once in a life time opportunity to acquire best-of-breed at lowest possible cost.
 
i am actually curious about the a123 High Power AHR32113 Cylindrical Cell
i have not seen anyone use these or test these cells.... im actually contacting a supplier to see if i can even get a price list....

Edit- just got the price for these- geeze their 4.4ah going for 30/a pop maybe 20 through chinese vendors...expensive. at these rates might as well go with 20ah prismatics.
 
I got my 4 A123 cells today, along with my 280 custom arranged NMC's for testing.

The A123's are Korean made, which I like...no worries about cells from the bad machine in Michigan. The tabs extend 12mm from the plastic and had a circular pressure mark, which I assume was the testing machine.

They arrived at half charge of 3.29V, and took almost 10ah to fully charge. My iCharger 206b's wires get hot trying to discharge at 10ah or better, so I'm sending the first one on a cycle down to 2.4v and back to 3.65V at 6.7A both ways.

Anyone have ideas for testing? I'm going to do my own cycle, fully charge, and then let them sit to check for self discharge.

I sent him a note that they arrived in good condition, though Customs hit me with a special tax (a$$holes) that seems to be some new contamination assessment for lithium batteries???????? Hopefully I can get that money back because it's in error.

I asked him to check on supply and continuing avalability. He typically works Saturdays, so I may have an answer tonight.

F'ing A123, why didn't they make them 4-4.5" wide instead of almost 6.5" Imagine the inline packs we could make. I'll take some picks and post them later.

John
 
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