I go from 48v to 60v and no increase in top speed

Morph,

Leamcorp is having a very similar problem with a high speed BMC motor he purchased.


http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=8562&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=30#p132599


Read the thread and you'll see he has a very high no-load speed and disappointing on road performance. Hi-powercycles, the guys he bought it from, said they got it up over 42 mph with 55+V LiPo's but it took 60 AMPS to do it :eek:


Well you WANTED a high speed motor and that's what you got but getting there is gonna take some doing. If you feed it enough current you assume an aero position you might get some more speed. The motor would probably kick butt on a recumbent with a faring since there would be less wind drag allowing the motor to get up to its power band or as I said before in a smaller wheel.

-R
 
does anyone have a 5303 motor? Would it really get me to 36 mph? I"m 230 lbs. I"m seriously considering buying one. This forsen hub is good but I'd like a bit more speed.

Would I be able to run a Phoenix racer hub motor on the controller that I have now? It looks like one of those infineon controllers. It's 48v 1000w. I'd be nice if I could just buy the motor and rim and put it on so I'd just have to buy the batteries.
 
http://www.ebikes.ca/store/store_motors.php
you could request one in a 26" rim, and get a compatible controller and DC cycle analyst for less than the phoenix kit @ electric rider you were looking at.
You would need to get a different bike with strong dropouts though. I would get a rear motor to lessen the chance of the forks breaking.
You might be able to use the controller you already have, but it would need to be modified for more current, and the wiring may be wrong for the 5303. Better to buy a better controller with a higher amp limit, and a wider voltage range. If you go full throttle with the 5303 in a 26" wheel you wont get very good range.. unless you spend major $$ on a battery(PSI cells come to mind)

With your forsen, you would need the lipo setup I told you about to get the max performance without a ton of weight, and even then the range would suck(10 miles?). If I had known more about the motor I would have steered you towards a different one, or different batteries, but I had never heard of the forsen motor before. We could try 48v or 60v 18ah(put another set in parallel and see what happens) with SLA and see if that goes faster and how far it goes, maybe that will work for you, otherwise your gonna need to invest some $$ in a better solution.
 
nomad85 said:
http://www.ebikes.ca/store/store_motors.php
you could request one in a 26" rim, and get a compatible controller and DC cycle analyst for less than the phoenix kit @ electric rider you were looking at.
You would need to get a different bike with strong dropouts though. I would get a rear motor to lessen the chance of the forks breaking.

With your forsen, you would need the lipo setup I told you about to get the max performance without a ton of weight, and even then the range would suck(10 miles?). If I had known more about the motor I would have steered you towards a different one, or different batteries, but I had never heard of the forsen motor before. We could try 48v or 60v 18ah with SLA and see if that goes faster and how far it goes, maybe that will work for you, otherwise your gonna need to invest some $$ in a better solution.
Click to expand...

yeah the 5303 and a controller would be $640 unless they charge me to put it in the rim. I'll e-mail them and ask if they could do that for me. I was going to buy my batteries from their too. Let me see what ebikes.ca says first.
 
I edited my last post with some more info. I don't think 8ah of nicads/nimh will cut it either.
 
FalconEV says the Forsen hub motor is a direct drive motor. He said "non geared" so I assume that means direct drive. Right? Nomad, could it be that the Forsen is a direct drive motor? What do you think?

If I get the 5303, I'm going to put it on a new bike. I found a bike at wal-mart for $68 and it's all steel.
 
nomad85 said:
I edited my last post with some more info. I don't think 8ah of nicads/nimh will cut it either.
Click to expand...

Dogman says the nicd will run the 5303 just fine. Are you talking about the Forsen? I'm not really into getting Lipo batteries. Too expensive and too dangerous I think.

I'm going to test the motor out tomorrow and see how far it will go this time now that I've gotten used to what an EV bike is like.
 
I don't think so... In a higher Ah rating yes, but not 8ah, you wont even go 4 miles at full throttle... Check what others with 5XXX are using, I don't know of any using anything other than lithium, at least not those who are going for high speeds. Methods had one, DoctorBass uses a 5304, I think Ypedal has a few, ask them what to use. I can tell you how to get to 31mph with a nine continents kit @48v, but I haven't ever tried a 5XXX motor...
 
morph999 said:
I found a bike at wal-mart for $68 and it's all steel.
Click to expand...


This might be a personnal choice from someone who raced in mountain bike downhill 10 years ago....but I would stay away from those cheap bike, try to get a used good quality bike instead of a POS new.

For 300$ USD you can get a good (used) hardtail freeride bike...

You can have a look here http://www.pinkbike.com

Do it right and do it once!
 
I'll buy better SLA's before I buy some $800 LIPO batteries. Are you talking about those RC batteries from hobbycity? I went on their forum and asked them if I could use those and they said I'd get about 15 minutes worth of usage and that was it.

Here is a better solution I think. How about some B & B battery SLA's 12v 15AH . I saw some 12v 15ah B &B batteries that are 6 x 4 x 4 which means they'll fit in my bag on my rack. And with 4 of them, it'll only be about 6 lbs more than I'm already carrying.
 
it wont perform any better. SLA wont work for the motor(s) you want to run. Unless you get into the 20-30 ah, and the range would still suck.
 
morph999 said:
I'll buy better SLA's before I buy some $800 LIPO batteries. Are you talking about those RC batteries from hobbycity? I went on their forum and asked them if I could use those and they said I'd get about 15 minutes worth of usage and that was it.

Here is a better solution I think. How about some B & B battery SLA's 12v 15AH . I saw some 12v 15ah B &B batteries that are 6 x 4 x 4 which means they'll fit in my bag on my rack. And with 4 of them, it'll only be about 6 lbs more than I'm already carrying.
Click to expand...


It all come down to one thing...If you built a Ebike ...built it with quality parts...cause in the end, you'll find out that you wasted money on a cheap frame, cheap battery...and it won't do what you want and then you will build it right... if you do!

Get some A123 cell and a nice RC charger for them, they will last many years with stable performance.

Robin
 
if 48v 8ah NiCD are not enough then why do they sell them?

Nomad, what if I bought a 48v 8ah nicd and put it in parallel with 48v of SLA's that I already have so I'd have 48v 17ah of batteries. I think that is what Dogman suggested.
 
morph999 said:
if 48v 8ah NiCD are not enough then why do they sell them?
Click to expand...
It's enough for some bikes. You want an extreme e-bike, but you want to use lower end parts.. it just wont work. You need to put a budget together, decide on some realistic goals that are possible within that budget, then ask for help/advice to make it happen. I cant keep trying to help you when you change your mind every five minutes. If you get a budget and a realistic performance goal I would be happy to help. Also if you want to diagnose/improve your current bike, I can do that too. I do want to help you don't get me wrong, the more e-bikers the merrier, but your not being realistic.
peace.

My goal was 30mph for 20 miles(after I realized 35mph would be expensive), the budget was $1500. My current bike meets or exceeds those goals(depending on the wind :mrgreen: ), and if you don't count the first bike it came in under the budget :lol:
 
morph999 said:
if 48v 8ah NiCD are not enough then why do they sell them?

Nomad, what if I bought a 48v 8ah nicd and put it in parallel with 48v of SLA's that I already have so I'd have 48v 17ah of batteries. I think that is what Dogman suggested.
Click to expand...


If you want I have 400 cell 3.5 Amp NiMh all assemble in 40S1P string...they were used in a electric scooter that I built...and then destroyed in a sidewalk at 70KM/H the battery are from this : http://www.evalbum.com/1535

I can sell you half of it, this would be 48 Volt and 17.5 Amp for 300$ with a small 2 Amp charger.

They have about 20 cycle in them..and not complete cycle.

Rated at 10 C...I found out that they are good for 3 C without much voltage drop, at 10 C their output is about 2/3 , in your case (pushing 45 Amp they will do it easilly)

Let me know if you want them.

Robin
 
I'm sorry....I don't have more than $1000 to spend. I already spent money on the 1st bike. I screwed up. I don't know why everyone is so anti- phoenix racer on here. I bring up the idea that I want a phoenix racer hub and everyone says "no no no no, you don't want that". I don't get it.

the ebikes 48v 8ah nicd is rated 5c. That means it can handle 40 amps of continuous current. I don't see how the NiCD battery wouldn't be enough for the 5303.
 
morph999 said:
the ebikes 48v 8ah nicd is rated 5c. That means it can handle 40 amps of continuous current. I don't see how the NiCD battery wouldn't be enough for the 5303.
Click to expand...
It wouldn't be enough for 10 miles. You will need at least 1Ah per mile, probably more(SLA would need much more). Maybe 2 in parallel, that would be better, its not good to run at the max "c' rating, you will loose volts and end up going slower than you hoped.
 
Ypedal said:
The 5C nicads will work.. yes.. but don't do it..considering your weight and expectations..

If you weighed 150 lbs, and wanted jack rabbit takeoff but not as much sustained top speed the nicads would be ok... You sir .. are going to need lithium to satisfy the need for speed.
Click to expand...

I only have $1000.
 
Ypedal said:
Save up.. do it once and do it right. ( in the mean time, research is free ! )
Click to expand...

That's the best advice he got so far!

We are not trying to push you away from this Ebike thing....but we want you to build it right and be happy with it once done...with your current budget you just can't to this properly!


Robin
 
You could swap out the forsen for a more balanced motor and get some decent range out of your SLA batteries, you could get a 4XXX series(407 or 408) from ebikes.ca or see if ampedbikes.com would sell you just a motor since you already have a controller and throttle. You could get 10 miles at 20-23mph from those batteries.
 
morph999 said:
ok....I just did it...lol.... 44.6 mph ....not bad so maybe it was the wind? Or maybe I need 72v ? Since I mounted the speedometer to the front wheel, I just went in there and lifted it up and push the throttle....44.6 and that's after I went riding for 20 min so maybe more than 44.6
Click to expand...

Morph,

In all the back and forth I forgot to ask you if you're getting better range now. You say above that you went riding for 20 minutes and the batteries were still above cutoff so how many miles did you go and what was the the maximum and average speed on your speedometer?

-R
 
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