Dauntless
100 TW
EVTodd said:
Yes it is. I'm even thinking you mean to build something like:
[youtube]1xjxg1Y7q8w[/youtube]
Motocross Style Electric Moped Project
- Thread starter EVTodd
- Start date
Yes it is. I'm even thinking you mean to build something like:
[youtube]1xjxg1Y7q8w[/youtube]
While deciding what route I want to go with this moped I've been thinking a lot about how my conversion might make it difficult to license and insure this thing in the future.
Has anyone on here converted a moped, scooter or motorcycle from ice to electric in Illinois?
The moped is already registered and licensed so I'm at a loss about what I would actually have to do to keep it legal. Would I have to do anything if I keep it within the power rating for this class of vehicle?
If anyone has already jumped through the Illinois hoops for a conversion I would love to hear about it.
Has anyone on here converted a moped, scooter or motorcycle from ice to electric in Illinois?
The moped is already registered and licensed so I'm at a loss about what I would actually have to do to keep it legal. Would I have to do anything if I keep it within the power rating for this class of vehicle?
If anyone has already jumped through the Illinois hoops for a conversion I would love to hear about it.
hillzofvalp
100 kW
EVTodd said:Just found this photo of an electric moped. What motor is that?
that is sick!- That's what I originally intended to do but then I got greedy... and the mb5-E was born.
Dauntless
100 TW
Well, don't know how similar your laws are to ours, but if I had one of those already registered in my name and I converted it to electric. . .
. . . .I'd keep the registration up and keep riding it. In California a moped is a register once situation. No renewal. If they stop you, let them have the registration.
The rare gas or electric that WAS registered I when I bought it I took the pink slip to the DMV and they never asked to see the bike. One was an electric that I understand was way too powerful to be registered as a moped, but someone got lucky, probably licensed at the shop, etc.
And if you're REALLY the irrepressible type and want to start EDUCATING the cops to leave electrics alone, you carry a few of these pages printed out to show them just in case they DO figure out 'Hey, that's not stock.' I mean, look how they have 50cc electric motors. 80cc, 100cc. Just like on your registration. Perhaps there's some nice 50cc stickers around.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19964__Turnigy_RotoMax_100cc_Size_Brushless_Outrunner_Motor.html
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__14426__Turnigy_CA80_80_Brushless_Outrunner_50_80cc_Eq_.html
. . . .I'd keep the registration up and keep riding it. In California a moped is a register once situation. No renewal. If they stop you, let them have the registration.
The rare gas or electric that WAS registered I when I bought it I took the pink slip to the DMV and they never asked to see the bike. One was an electric that I understand was way too powerful to be registered as a moped, but someone got lucky, probably licensed at the shop, etc.
And if you're REALLY the irrepressible type and want to start EDUCATING the cops to leave electrics alone, you carry a few of these pages printed out to show them just in case they DO figure out 'Hey, that's not stock.' I mean, look how they have 50cc electric motors. 80cc, 100cc. Just like on your registration. Perhaps there's some nice 50cc stickers around.
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__19964__Turnigy_RotoMax_100cc_Size_Brushless_Outrunner_Motor.html
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__14426__Turnigy_CA80_80_Brushless_Outrunner_50_80cc_Eq_.html
Here in Illinois we have to renew the sticker on the license plate every year but there's no inspection or anything.
I guess I just want to do it right but I'm not sure what the right way is. You have to have insurance on a moped here too so there's another little detail to think about.
I guess I just want to do it right but I'm not sure what the right way is. You have to have insurance on a moped here too so there's another little detail to think about.
See if you can get your conversion cost subsidized, and/or get information about any reclassification concerning title/registration:
http://www.illinoisgreenfleets.org/fuels/index.html
Wow, $4000 worth of equipment isn't much for a car, but would make a nice rig for you! I might need to move to Illinois long enough to get that! If you do 10 of these for yourself, does that qualify for fleet incentives?
And then this may apply:
http://www.illinoisgreenfleets.org/fuels/index.html
Wow, $4000 worth of equipment isn't much for a car, but would make a nice rig for you! I might need to move to Illinois long enough to get that! If you do 10 of these for yourself, does that qualify for fleet incentives?
And then this may apply:
Code:
(625 ILCS 5/3-805) (from Ch. 95 1/2, par. 3-805)
Sec. 3-805. Electric vehicles. The owner of a motor vehicle of the first division or a motor vehicle of the second division weighing 8,000 pounds or less propelled by an electric engine and not utilizing motor fuel, may register such vehicle for a fee not to exceed $35 for a 2-year registration period. The Secretary may, in his discretion, prescribe that electric vehicle registration plates be issued for an indefinite term, such term to correspond to the term of registration plates issued generally, as provided in Section 3-414.1. In no event may the registration fee for electric vehicles exceed $18 per registration year.
(Source: P.A. 96-1135, eff. 7-21-10.)gogo said:See if you can get your conversion cost subsidized, and/or get information about any reclassification concerning title/registration:
http://www.illinoisgreenfleets.org/fuels/index.html
Wow, $4000 worth of equipment isn't much for a car, but would make a nice rig for you! I might need to move to Illinois long enough to get that! If you do 10 of these for yourself, does that qualify for fleet incentives?
And then this may apply:
Code:(625 ILCS 5/3-805) (from Ch. 95 1/2, par. 3-805) Sec. 3-805. Electric vehicles. The owner of a motor vehicle of the first division or a motor vehicle of the second division weighing 8,000 pounds or less propelled by an electric engine and not utilizing motor fuel, may register such vehicle for a fee not to exceed $35 for a 2-year registration period. The Secretary may, in his discretion, prescribe that electric vehicle registration plates be issued for an indefinite term, such term to correspond to the term of registration plates issued generally, as provided in Section 3-414.1. In no event may the registration fee for electric vehicles exceed $18 per registration year. (Source: P.A. 96-1135, eff. 7-21-10.)
Thanks for the info!
I've actually seen that site before and I'm not quite sure it would apply to this kind of conversion. I need to sit down and read all of it.
Btw, where are you in Iowa? I'm in the Quad Cities.
Ok guys, I'm back on to this project. Here's my latest crazy idea...
This bike is a hardtail but I had purchased another Garelli frame that has rear suspension with the hopes of using a longer pit bike swingarm to make the wheelbase longer. Anyway, long story short, the hardtail is already registered, the full suspension frame has never been registered so it's going to be all but impossible to use it. So... My bright idea is to cut the back off of the hardtail frame and mount a swingarm on it. Keep in mind that they are essentially identical frames except for a simple tube that's welded into a hole on the motor mount for the swingarm on the full suspension version.
And before someone freaks out over me cutting up a moped frame, these old Garelli mopeds are basically worth next to nothing. I picked up the entire bike dirt cheap to play around with so I'm not that concerned about it.
Now, since I only have access to a wire feed welder that I wouldn't trust to doing frame mods with I would like to cnc a beefy 6061 aluminum mount that bolts on to the motor mount with additional bolts going through the ledge above the mount to tie it all into the frame.
If you take a look at my simple drawing, the yellow lines show the approximate cuts I would like to make to remove the rear end. The blue blob is the aluminum hunk I would use for the swingarm mount and the grey T things are the bolts going through the motor mount and through that ledge on the frame (which will be a handy place to stack lipo too
). That ledge is actually pretty beefy and welded to the bottom tube of the frame.
So, any thoughts on the idea? I know Motopeds have bolt on aluminum mounts for the swingarm so I'm hoping it's not too crazy. Most of the older mopeds that have rear suspension have pretty flimsy mounts so it doesn't appear to take a lot to improve on the typical setup.
This bike is a hardtail but I had purchased another Garelli frame that has rear suspension with the hopes of using a longer pit bike swingarm to make the wheelbase longer. Anyway, long story short, the hardtail is already registered, the full suspension frame has never been registered so it's going to be all but impossible to use it. So... My bright idea is to cut the back off of the hardtail frame and mount a swingarm on it. Keep in mind that they are essentially identical frames except for a simple tube that's welded into a hole on the motor mount for the swingarm on the full suspension version.
And before someone freaks out over me cutting up a moped frame, these old Garelli mopeds are basically worth next to nothing. I picked up the entire bike dirt cheap to play around with so I'm not that concerned about it.
Now, since I only have access to a wire feed welder that I wouldn't trust to doing frame mods with I would like to cnc a beefy 6061 aluminum mount that bolts on to the motor mount with additional bolts going through the ledge above the mount to tie it all into the frame.
If you take a look at my simple drawing, the yellow lines show the approximate cuts I would like to make to remove the rear end. The blue blob is the aluminum hunk I would use for the swingarm mount and the grey T things are the bolts going through the motor mount and through that ledge on the frame (which will be a handy place to stack lipo too
). That ledge is actually pretty beefy and welded to the bottom tube of the frame.So, any thoughts on the idea? I know Motopeds have bolt on aluminum mounts for the swingarm so I'm hoping it's not too crazy. Most of the older mopeds that have rear suspension have pretty flimsy mounts so it doesn't appear to take a lot to improve on the typical setup.
MitchJi
10 MW
Hi,
If the frames are essentially identical, I would just use the frame that already has the swing on it. How hard can it be to change the Vin numbers to match?
If the frames are essentially identical, I would just use the frame that already has the swing on it. How hard can it be to change the Vin numbers to match?
No thoughts on this huh? Ok, I guess I'm just going to do an experiment. If it doesn't end up working I'll have a different swing arm mount welded on at some point.
My thought here is to bolt on an aluminum mount with bearings pressed into it instead of the cheezy bushings that most mopeds use. I guess my big question is how much strain does the swing arm mount get? I was looking at stress simulations of swingarms on the 'net and it looks like the middle of the swing arm gets most of the stresses with little at the frame mounting point. Btw, I'll be using a dual shock setup.
My thought here is to bolt on an aluminum mount with bearings pressed into it instead of the cheezy bushings that most mopeds use. I guess my big question is how much strain does the swing arm mount get? I was looking at stress simulations of swingarms on the 'net and it looks like the middle of the swing arm gets most of the stresses with little at the frame mounting point. Btw, I'll be using a dual shock setup.
I'm a big fan of factory setups. My inclination would be to find a titled full-cradle frame motorcycle with enough clearance to mount a hubmotor on the front of and above the swingarm, good front suspension, and twin leading-shoe drum brakes. Then I'd remove most of the engine case leaving just the portion that stiffens near the swingarm.
This would retain all the safety of the factory engineering and allow lots of space and mounting possibilities for the batteries. Selling bits of the ICE stuff can potentially defray the total cost.
This would retain all the safety of the factory engineering and allow lots of space and mounting possibilities for the batteries. Selling bits of the ICE stuff can potentially defray the total cost.
gogo said:
I would like to do a motorcycle conversion some day but right now I have this bike and I see at least some potential in making a lower power setup with it. I think something in between a bicycle and a motorcycle (a moped
) would be fun to tool around town on. I personally think moped wheelbases being so short (around 45") makes them look like clown bikes. It would be nice to figure out a way to extend it a few inches. Maybe keeping it a hardtail and coming up with some sort of bolt on dropout extenders would be easier. Maybe not...I would still like to know if anyone out there has an opinion on how much stress is on a swingarm pivot.
Dauntless
100 TW
Today I was so sure I was going to have what I needed to build my big idea to make you sooooo geen. . . .
Yet another recalcitrant seller, I just can't pry the damn thing loose. . . .
Yet another recalcitrant seller, I just can't pry the damn thing loose. . . .
Sorry, I got carried away with my own brain child.EVTodd said:I think something in between a bicycle and a motorcycle (a moped
I would still like to know if anyone out there has an opinion on how much stress is on a swingarm pivot.
The swingarm of a double shock system is mainly experiences tension, so you can think of it as a string pulling in a line from the the mounting pivot to the axle. When the moped is on the center stand and the back wheel is off the ground, the force is in the opposite direction.
When your'e leaned over in a turn the swingarm can experience a twisting force which results in an upward force on the 'high-side' of the pivot and a downward force on the 'low-side'.
Dauntless
100 TW
What's unfriendly? If we're not the ones to tell you how to do this, you DON'T want to attempt our little experiments for us.
Mine is for a little something that lays around as junk that might make for the full cradle frame. If I start asking for ideas before it takes shape people will be thinking 'What in the WORLD?'
But okay, since mine will involve a hardtail frame and a swingarm from another source, I'll just be sliding in the swingarm with the kingpin right where the axle would go. Then there's a shock to be mounted. There's your longer wheelbase. all depends on the particular hardtail frame.
Mine is for a little something that lays around as junk that might make for the full cradle frame. If I start asking for ideas before it takes shape people will be thinking 'What in the WORLD?'
But okay, since mine will involve a hardtail frame and a swingarm from another source, I'll just be sliding in the swingarm with the kingpin right where the axle would go. Then there's a shock to be mounted. There's your longer wheelbase. all depends on the particular hardtail frame.
gogo said:Sorry, I got carried away with my own brain child.EVTodd said:I think something in between a bicycle and a motorcycle (a moped
I would still like to know if anyone out there has an opinion on how much stress is on a swingarm pivot.
The swingarm of a double shock system is mainly experiences tension, so you can think of it as a string pulling in a line from the the mounting pivot to the axle. When the moped is on the center stand and the back wheel is off the ground, the force is in the opposite direction.
When your'e leaned over in a turn the swingarm can experience a twisting force which results in an upward force on the 'high-side' of the pivot and a downward force on the 'low-side'.
No, you're fine. Thanks for the information. What is interesting is that other than the Motoped I'm not finding any other bikes that have a bolt on swing arm mount. Maybe it's not a great idea. It's just that the stock mounts on a typical moped are so flimsy looking. Oh well, it's something I still have in the back of my head but I may stick with the hardtail.
@ Dauntless : The swing arm is really the only thing I'm asking about at this point. I'm not expecting people to come up with ideas for my projects. Everything else on this bike is already in process including the motor.
I couldn't find pictures of the unmounted Motoped swingarm mounting bracket to confirm, but I'd guess that it has recesses where it bolts to the frame so that the majority of the forces are transferred directly from the bracket to the frame.
Your diagram seems to put all the forces on the heads of the bolts and that should be avoided. You might try copying the other frame for the swingarm mount. I vote for swapping VIN tags.
Your diagram seems to put all the forces on the heads of the bolts and that should be avoided. You might try copying the other frame for the swingarm mount. I vote for swapping VIN tags.
gogo said:I couldn't find pictures of the unmounted Motoped swingarm mounting bracket to confirm, but I'd guess that it has recesses where it bolts to the frame so that the majority of the forces are transferred directly from the bracket to the frame.
Your diagram seems to put all the forces on the heads of the bolts and that should be avoided. You might try copying the other frame for the swingarm mount. I vote for swapping VIN tags.
Good points and yup, the Motoped mounts bolt on the sides of the frame to welded points. Using a copy of the normal Garelli swing arm mount wouldn't be that hard. Like I mentioned, it's just a hole in the motor mount with a tube that's welded to hold it in place. I used to know a very good race car fabricator that did any welding work I needed when I raced karts. Unfortunately he moved out of state and I don't know anyone I would trust with that kind of work now. Hmmm. Well, more to consider for sure. I think I'll work on getting the drive and everything else done first before tackling how to lengthen the frame.
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