teslanv
1 MW
I will have a 3T test unit in my hands in a few weeks, as will e4bike.ru. You can bet there will be some good videos coming soon. :wink:Allex said:
MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3
- Thread starter Allex
- Start date
diggler
1 kW
Allex
This video is V2 4 turn right?
So not 15x4 but 16x4. + more efficient stator laminations right?
This video is V2 4 turn right?
So not 15x4 but 16x4. + more efficient stator laminations right?
diggler
1 kW
edventure
I'd look at the prestone yellow coolant, premixed 50/50. It's the most versatile, sais it works in all makes and models.
Also there is some blue coolant that Honda uses sometimes. I don't know much about this one though.
Just don't use dexcool from gm its the worst and has been known to gum up and turn cooling systems into batteries.
If you don't mind me asking... How much was your cooling kit. Then how much were the bigger bearings and the machining cost of the side covers.
Linukas
Is this cooling not possible with the V2 because of the aluminum and copper, or is it just a concern with where they are touching?
Is there a cooling kit in the works for the V2? Maybe something like you did with the crowmo?
I'd look at the prestone yellow coolant, premixed 50/50. It's the most versatile, sais it works in all makes and models.
Also there is some blue coolant that Honda uses sometimes. I don't know much about this one though.
Just don't use dexcool from gm its the worst and has been known to gum up and turn cooling systems into batteries.
If you don't mind me asking... How much was your cooling kit. Then how much were the bigger bearings and the machining cost of the side covers.
Linukas
Is this cooling not possible with the V2 because of the aluminum and copper, or is it just a concern with where they are touching?
Is there a cooling kit in the works for the V2? Maybe something like you did with the crowmo?
Linukas
10 W
diggler said:
yes, for V2 is impossible to make copper because it will have corrosion with aluminum, I have couple ideas how to make it cooled also have idea to make different axle to fit standard DH bike through axle, but for now my whole time goes to new prototype of frame kits and bikes, and cann't spent time for V2 modification, also after a >30pcs bikes assembles and tests with hubmotors and mid drive, I see just mid drive for high-end offroad bikes. For example this bike have just 30mm stator motor (modified hubmotor) but fast winding and it nicely handles 350A phase current. I can easily "eat" hubzila in <5min ride (hubzila simply overheats), and also performance is better because of lighter weight, much less unsprung mass.
little video of last mid drive bike (it was first test ride so sorry for bad wheely):
[youtube]KHtvmY3_q68[/youtube]
sorry for little offtopick
In the vid they have V1 motor and quite sure high flux weakening levels which adds additional heat. Also big 26" wheel. This is worst case scenario..
I will lace my V2 3T motor in 17" MMP rim and run 20s battery. I believe this setup will do 90 kmh without the need of OVS and therefore hopefully stay cooler than my Cro with flux weakening.
The axle i want to upgrade for more strength and that i'm able to install larger phase wires - no watercooling (first). IMO M14 thread is to small if you going to push this motor hard and i would always be afraid that it could brake under hard acceleration..
@ arkmundi: its 33% more current and 75% voltage for the 3T not 40% :wink:
Linas you have absolutely right that mid drive / low unsprung weight is what you want on high powerd ebikes. you cannot use the power if you have no traction in corners or on bumpy road and offroad.. looking forward to see your bike
I will lace my V2 3T motor in 17" MMP rim and run 20s battery. I believe this setup will do 90 kmh without the need of OVS and therefore hopefully stay cooler than my Cro with flux weakening.
The axle i want to upgrade for more strength and that i'm able to install larger phase wires - no watercooling (first). IMO M14 thread is to small if you going to push this motor hard and i would always be afraid that it could brake under hard acceleration..
@ arkmundi: its 33% more current and 75% voltage for the 3T not 40% :wink:
Linas you have absolutely right that mid drive / low unsprung weight is what you want on high powerd ebikes. you cannot use the power if you have no traction in corners or on bumpy road and offroad.. looking forward to see your bike
Linukas
10 W
striker54 said:
little miss understanding: I meant hubmotor, just as I know there was 3 stator versions, 1v was with stamped steel stator, 2v and 3v with aluminum, here is how looked v2:
and this is v3:
to make liquid cooling quite easy for V2 is possible (but need to mill stator, so to offer kit without having motor stator is too difficult), but to V3 is impossible or cost too much.
John in CR
100 TW
Guys, the place to start for conversations about current limits is phase-to-phase resistance. It's quite easy to measure. Get the other measurements for Miles' motor spreadsheet while you're at it.
Also, I think it's a waste of the advantages of a speed wind motor to lower the voltage and raise the current in the proportions needed to make the 3T perform the same as the 4T. To me your goal should be better performance and better efficiency (less heat).
Also, I think it's a waste of the advantages of a speed wind motor to lower the voltage and raise the current in the proportions needed to make the 3T perform the same as the 4T. To me your goal should be better performance and better efficiency (less heat).
John in CR said:
i will measure phase to phase resistance on my 3T motor once i have an accurate constant current source. hopefully its lower than 4T cromotor.
and who says that voltage will be lower? i want not only fast acceleration from 0 to 50kmh but also above
John in CR
100 TW
madin88 said:John in CR said:
i will measure phase to phase resistance on my 3T motor once i have an accurate constant current source. hopefully its lower than 4T cromotor.
and who says that voltage will be lower? i want not only fast acceleration from 0 to 50kmh but also above
3 extra strands and more than 25% shorter, so it should be significantly lower phase-to-phase resistance. It's difficult to gauge just from pics, but it looks like the Cromotor has stator steel with longer teeth, so it fits more total copper, but do they even sell a 3T? I saw your plan on using the 3T MXUS and it made sense to me, though I can't comment on the relative high speed efficiency since I've never used field weakening...never even boosted an Infineon above 100% speed...never needed too.
For a current source I use an 18W LED light good for 12V and a 12V battery, and it provides about 1.5A, which works nicely.
yep, cromotor seems to have a bit longer teeth and more copper. also we do not know if the strands have similar cross section. any infos?
John, if phase to phase resistance of MXUS 3T is lower than cromotor, it means it will produce less heat at same current but also 33% less torque, right? also the stator of cro is about 3-4mm wider which means more torque at same current..
John, if phase to phase resistance of MXUS 3T is lower than cromotor, it means it will produce less heat at same current but also 33% less torque, right? also the stator of cro is about 3-4mm wider which means more torque at same current..
999zip999
100 TW
Hook up my 3,000 with a 12fet 40a cellman controller rshunt 2009. The C.A. shows 1.70 amps no load is this right or to high ?
teslanv
1 MW
That's about what I got with my 18X4110 Lyen controller.999zip999 said:
markz
100 TW
how do you like the 18X4110 Lyen controller?
Just right or should you have gone bigger/better?
Just right or should you have gone bigger/better?
arkmundi
10 MW
999zip999
100 TW
96v may be in the upper limits of a 72v controller.
teslanv
1 MW
Actually the Sabvoton 96V controller is good for up to 120V Max., IIRC.999zip999 said:
999zip999
100 TW
That sounds safer.
macribs
10 MW
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2014
- Messages
- 3,702
This might have been covered already and if so I am sorry - bit in a rush and my search didn't find answer.
So this is for a 17" moto wheel.
When getting a mxus 3000 what would be the real world differences between a 3T version and a 4T version of mxus 3000 motor?
I remember John in CR said something in the line of "a rule of thumb if choice go with the lower T or something like that". But I couldn't find back to that post. I do remember he explained it too. But I guess I am having a "senior moment"
3T has more copper and can take more abuse before overheating?
Will there be any noticeable differences in performance between the 3T and the 4T? Acceleration and top speed?
What about current and voltage? Any difference in what they can take?
So this is for a 17" moto wheel.
When getting a mxus 3000 what would be the real world differences between a 3T version and a 4T version of mxus 3000 motor?
I remember John in CR said something in the line of "a rule of thumb if choice go with the lower T or something like that". But I couldn't find back to that post. I do remember he explained it too. But I guess I am having a "senior moment"
3T has more copper and can take more abuse before overheating?
Will there be any noticeable differences in performance between the 3T and the 4T? Acceleration and top speed?
What about current and voltage? Any difference in what they can take?
teslanv
1 MW
macribs said:This might have been covered already and if so I am sorry - bit in a rush and my search didn't find answer.
So this is for a 17" moto wheel.
When getting a mxus 3000 what would be the real world differences between a 3T version and a 4T version of mxus 3000 motor?
I remember John in CR said something in the line of "a rule of thumb if choice go with the lower T or something like that". But I couldn't find back to that post. I do remember he explained it too. But I guess I am having a "senior moment"
3T has more copper and can take more abuse before overheating?
Will there be any noticeable differences in performance between the 3T and the 4T? Acceleration and top speed?
What about current and voltage? Any difference in what they can take?
The 4T is a 9.0 Kv motor, and the 3T is a 12.0 Kv Motor. The 3T has 21 strands of copper in parallel vs 16 strands for the 4T. This means that the 3T can take (21/16) or 31% more current than the 4T wind. The 3T will need the extra amperage to produce similar torque as the 4T, however, so your controller will need to able to supply enough current.
If you are using a 17" Moto Rim, and you install a 17X2.75" DOT tire on it (22.5" DIAM) you will get the following unloaded speeds with these Motors:
3T at 72V = 57.8 MPH
4T at 72V = 43.4 MPH
3T at 48V = 38.6 MPH
4T at 48V = 28.9 MPH
macribs
10 MW
- Joined
- Jul 22, 2014
- Messages
- 3,702
Thx exactly what I was looking for - bulls eye!
So as the 3T 12Kv will handle/need more current to perform the best, I can at the moment think of two controllers that will be good match. The Adaptto maxi-e and Sabvoton SVMC072150. If you have tried other controllers feel free to let me know.
Will the 4T 9Kv do fine with lesser priced controllers or you recommend those controllers for 4T as well?
So as the 3T 12Kv will handle/need more current to perform the best, I can at the moment think of two controllers that will be good match. The Adaptto maxi-e and Sabvoton SVMC072150. If you have tried other controllers feel free to let me know.
Will the 4T 9Kv do fine with lesser priced controllers or you recommend those controllers for 4T as well?
Allex
100 MW
e4bike.ru will soon sell theirs sine-wave cheap. PM him.
Motobikewheels
100 W
This is some great info
Dammit now i have to get a 3T for myself
My goal is to drop voltage and still have good speed
Dammit now i have to get a 3T for myself
My goal is to drop voltage and still have good speed
Motobikewheels
100 W
teslanv said:macribs said:This might have been covered already and if so I am sorry - bit in a rush and my search didn't find answer.
So this is for a 17" moto wheel.
When getting a mxus 3000 what would be the real world differences between a 3T version and a 4T version of mxus 3000 motor?
I remember John in CR said something in the line of "a rule of thumb if choice go with the lower T or something like that". But I couldn't find back to that post. I do remember he explained it too. But I guess I am having a "senior moment"
3T has more copper and can take more abuse before overheating?
Will there be any noticeable differences in performance between the 3T and the 4T? Acceleration and top speed?
What about current and voltage? Any difference in what they can take?
The 4T is a 9.0 Kv motor, and the 3T is a 12.0 Kv Motor. The 3T has 21 strands of copper in parallel vs 16 strands for the 4T. This means that the 3T can take (21/16) or 31% more current than the 4T wind. The 3T will need the extra amperage to produce similar torque as the 4T, however, so your controller will need to able to supply enough current.
Wouldn't 21 strands be smaller diameter wire vs 16 strands?
Im confused on how they would get more copper in there
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