No foot pedal start - SOLVED

[2 self-build ecars later]

I am converting a lawn tractor to electric. I have installed a 48v 1000W brushless Chinese rear transaxle. It has Hall effect wires which connect with like wires from a compatible 48v 1000W motor controller.
With learning wires connected, and wheels off the ground, the motor works and the rear wheels spin forward at full rpm.
I also installed a foot throttle said to be Hall effect. The controller has red, green and black wires labelled accelograph. The foot throttle has 3 like wires, red, green and black which I joined to their like controller wires.
With learning wires disconnected, and wheels on the ground, there is no motor start and no wheel movement. Everything I've read says those wires should be disconnected once you have forward wheel movement, which I have.
I have not installed a display so have no error codes.
No use asking the Chinese supplier - either doesn't know, hazards a guess, or says it should work!
Today I tried another foot throttle but no success. Voltage readings on both foot throttles are appropriate according to TC with whom I've already been in touch.
The motor, controller and both foot throttles come from the same supplier.
Grateful for any advice. No shorting of any wires, no touching of the throttle wires with hv wires.
I assume the black ground wires do not have to be separately grounded say to the chassis, but joined as I have done, with grounding provided by the controller from where its black wire comes.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Good to know that you have indeed used the reversing feature of the “learning wire”. Evidence that it is working properly…



This to me would be an indication of a type of “limited slip differential” and of no concern.
One could always unbolt the motor from the gearbox if desired to eliminate any possibility of interference of operation.
But at this time I can’t see it.

Yes, apologies. I should have done my research on stationary wheel spin before sending my latest message. Effect of differential. I am about to bring up motor supplier details, to try to send to you.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Good to know that you have indeed used the reversing feature of the “learning wire”. Evidence that it is working properly…



This to me would be an indication of a type of “limited slip differential” and of no concern.
One could always unbolt the motor from the gearbox if desired to eliminate any possibility of interference of operation.
But at this time I can’t see it.

TC, do you use eBay? My motor, controller and foot throttle supplier is tdpro99 (71959). Motor is described as 48v 1000W brushless electric differential motor rear axle. The controller they supplied is the blue one from JsBull (Two-mode) with a several pages pamphlet. If you have trouble accessing any of this, please let me know and I'll see if I can get the details to you in another way.
As to other matters, no change in operation or sound; tried manual rotation but no start. I do not presently know the degree to which the Hall sensors are set at.
I haven't yet back-probed on the controller side of the throttle signal wire but will soon.

 

[TommyCat]

Sorry, I do not. How about a link to the product page?
Do you have a max rpm for ether controller?

Thank you for the updates.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Sorry, I do not. How about a link to the product page?
Do you have a max rpm for ether controller?

Thank you for the updates.

No success so far with product page. Shenzhen controller states phase angle 60/120: auto identification. Js Bull controller states motor phase angle: auto identification. Will search for max rpm.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

No success so far with product page. Shenzhen controller states phase angle 60/120: auto identification. Js Bull controller states motor phase angle: auto identification. Will search for max rpm.

No specification I could find for max rpm for either controller. Now trying for product pages to send to you.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

No specification I could find for max rpm for either controller. Now trying for product pages to send to you.

e-Bay appears to have a block on copying of product pages which is not helpful. However, the Amazon link you supplied me looks to be of the same motor as mine.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

TC, photos of both controllers. Their instructions are in Chinglish, hard to follow, and focussed mainly on use of learning wires to reverse the reverse wheel spin, which as you know I've done.
Tomorrow I plan to take the covers off both controllers, to check on whether voltage is actually getting to signal wire PCB points.

 

[TommyCat]

If the Blue controller came with your other parts, and I have seen some information on it. I would concentrate on making it work first. You'd think the supplier would be certain they would work together. Wow, what a bunch of voltage input possibilities. :-/

Be aware that it appears to have a PAS connector...

Blue controller reference…
https://www.amazon.com/Kemblawolf-Differential-Brushless-Controller-Hydraulic/dp/B0DPMST34Z?th=1

Keep that information coming if possible. Always nice to know for sure what one is working on.

 

[TommyCat]

However, the Amazon link you supplied me looks to be of the same motor as mine.

to check on whether voltage is actually getting to signal wire PCB points.

Full battery voltage and throttle signal voltage…

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

TC, cover off silver controller. Full battery voltage to PCB positive connection. No voltage to signal wire PCB connection, either at throttle rest or WOT!! 4.2v to throttle power wire PCB connection. So...maybe the culprit has been unmasked. What to do? Is it worth putting more solder on signal wire PCB connection, or unlikely to solve it? I haven't yet taken the cover off the blue controller.

Full battery voltage and throttle signal voltage…

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

TC, someone just mentioned these controllers to me - VESC-based Flipsky. Out of interest, do you know them? The 75100 Pro V2, and a power key switch button, read well.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

TC, someone just mentioned these controllers to me - VESC-based Flipsky. Out of interest, do you know them? The 75100 Pro V2, and a power key switch button, read well.

TC, while no voltage at signal wire PCB connection, I was still getting .82 volts at rest, and 3.07 volts at WOT, where the controller signal wire joins the throttle signal wire. Can't say I understand that!! Maybe I ought to change the signal wire connections between controller and throttle?

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

TC, while no voltage at signal wire PCB connection, I was still getting .82 volts at rest, and 3.07 volts at WOT, where the controller signal wire joins the throttle signal wire. Can't say I understand that!! Maybe I ought to change the signal wire connections between controller and throttle?

TC, I replaced the signal wire between controller and throttle, and bingo, motor start and throttle-controlled wheel spin. I'm in a state of shock!! Your advice has been invaluable and I'm most grateful for all the help you have so generously given me. Can I record your role somewhere on this site?

 

[TommyCat]

Wow, what a quick and exciting change of status!
Great to hear you decisively tracked down the missing throttle signal and quickly rectified the wiring problem. Job well done!

Thank you for your kind words, much appreciated. It's been a pleasure working with you, being able to offer advice and suggestions and have them effectively acted on.

You are hereby deemed a certifiable true electrical troubleshooter!

TC, someone just mentioned these controllers to me - VESC-based Flipsky. Out of interest, do you know them? The 75100 Pro V2, and a power key switch button, read well.

I have been following these a bit. They seem to be very programmable via software and able to fulfill a wide variety of service applications.
And for that "programming learning curve" reason, probably would not recommend for everyone.

I would encourage you to edit your original post title to include "SOLVED". And perhaps add a summery at the bottom of it, as to what you found and how you corrected the problem for those in a hurry.

Hoping to see a picture someday of your completed project.

Cheers and best regards,
T.C.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Wow, what a quick and exciting change of status!
Great to hear you decisively tracked down the missing throttle signal and quickly rectified the wiring problem. Job well done!

Thank you for your kind words, much appreciated. It's been a pleasure working with you, being able to offer advice and suggestions and have them effectively acted on.

You are hereby deemed a certifiable true electrical troubleshooter!




I have been following these a bit. They seem to be very programmable via software and able to fulfill a wide variety of service applications.
And for that "programming learning curve" reason, probably would not recommend for everyone.

I would encourage you to edit your original post title to include "SOLVED". And perhaps add a summery at the bottom of it, as to what you found and how you corrected the problem for those in a hurry.

Hoping to see a picture someday of your completed project.

Cheers and best regards,
T.C.

Will edit as you suggest. And add a summary. Also, you will see a picture or two of the completed project I expect this weekend. Plan then is to add 'superstructure' to mower (skeleton at present), secure batteries front and aft, add cutter blades, and actually take it for a spin to see how it performs!

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Wow, what a quick and exciting change of status!
Great to hear you decisively tracked down the missing throttle signal and quickly rectified the wiring problem. Job well done!

Thank you for your kind words, much appreciated. It's been a pleasure working with you, being able to offer advice and suggestions and have them effectively acted on.

You are hereby deemed a certifiable true electrical troubleshooter!




I have been following these a bit. They seem to be very programmable via software and able to fulfill a wide variety of service applications.
And for that "programming learning curve" reason, probably would not recommend for everyone.

I would encourage you to edit your original post title to include "SOLVED". And perhaps add a summery at the bottom of it, as to what you found and how you corrected the problem for those in a hurry.

Hoping to see a picture someday of your completed project.

Cheers and best regards,
T.C.

Hi TC. How do I edit please? Mower had first run on weekend and went well!

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Hi TC. How do I edit please? Mower had first run on weekend and went well!

TC, exExternal and under hood shots of mower.

 

[TommyCat]

In the last line in the lower left corner of a post that you authored. Located just under your “signature” space.
Click on “EDIT”
This opens the post to editing, including the name of the thread in your original post.
Make the changes you desire, and then click the blue save action box below the text box.
This will add your changes, and add a time stamp as to when it occurred.

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

In the last line in the lower left corner of a post that you authored. Located just under your “signature” space.
Click on “EDIT”
This opens the post to editing, including the name of the thread in your original post.
Make the changes you desire, and then click the blue save action box below the text box.
This will add your changes, and add a time stamp as to when it occurred.

Great, thanks, I've added SOLVED.
I assume if I add detail now, anyone who is interested, can access?
In my first post, I mentioned my lawn tractor conversion. It was originally a 17HP MTD. I have used a 48 volt transaxle, powered by 4 x 12 volt deep cycle lead acid batteries. Its transaxle, forward/reverse switch, key switch, foot throttle and controller are all Chinese.
I originally posted because activation of the throttle was not starting the motor, with no wheel spin.
Fortunately, TC provided expert guidance, including a range of tests which I carried out. I was getting correct voltage at the throttle but still no start. I accessed the controller's pcb to find no voltage going out from the throttle's signal wire. I replaced that wire, turned the key on, pressed the throttle and all worked!

 

[2 self-build ecars later]

Great, thanks, I've added SOLVED.
I assume if I add detail now, anyone who is interested, can access?
In my first post, I mentioned my lawn tractor conversion. It was originally a 17HP MTD. I have used a 48 volt transaxle, powered by 4 x 12 volt deep cycle lead acid batteries. Its transaxle, forward/reverse switch, key switch, foot throttle and controller are all Chinese.
I originally posted because activation of the throttle was not starting the motor, with no wheel spin.
Fortunately, TC provided expert guidance, including a range of tests which I carried out. I was getting correct voltage at the throttle but still no start. I accessed the controller's pcb to find no voltage going out from the throttle's signal wire. I replaced that wire, turned the key on, pressed the throttle and all worked!

I should have mentioned two 48 volt 500W motors, which are attached to centre spindles on the cutter deck by pulleys, operate the 2 cutter blades. Each has its own relay. Both are powered by a toggle switch on the 'dash'.
I also have a kill switch designed to cut power to the 4 in series 12 volt batteries.