Alan B
100 GW
Did a Ride Map on the web and got almost exactly 3 miles, so perhaps this CA is very close to accurate already. Shows about 250 feet of total altitude variation, probably done about twice over the run for 500 feet of vertical.
Peugeot Canyon Express Commuter
- Thread starter Alan B
- Start date
Alan B
100 GW
Just thought I'd add a comment to my old thread here, and report that this bike is still in service, pretty much exactly the way it was in 2011. Not getting daily use right now due to son being between jobs, but he uses it fairly often. Biggest problem he had was leaving the controller connected and running the pack down, but not far enough to damage it. It could use a master switch of some kind that really cut out the pack. When I get some time I need to finish my master switch project...
darth_elevator
100 W
I came across this thread when I was searching for solutions to a derailer scraping the hub motor when in the lowest gear. How did you resolve yours? Do you just not use that gear, or did you put in a spacer on the cassette....or something else? I just moved a rear hub motor to a different bike and am getting scraping. I was also thinking of either looking for a thinner derailer or else one that sits out a little farther so as not to scrape the hub. But I'd prefer not to buy a new derailer if possible, so I'm curious whether you fixed yours and, if so, what you did to fix it. Thanks!
Drunkskunk
100 GW
Believe it or not, a freewheel was never meant to be simply put onto a bike used as is. They have to be properly spaced to align the chain line and set the clearances.
And that is done with shims. They come in widths from 1mm to 3mm with half sizes as well, and you can stack them if needed. They go between the motor and the freewheel. Any bike shop that does repair work should have them in stock, but mail order is less effort. Random eBay Shim Link
The chain spacing from hub to gear should be 5mm for a 7 speed, however the derailleurs will more room, so fitting is a little bit of trial and error. buy more shims than you need in several sizes, so you can get the fit perfect.
And that is done with shims. They come in widths from 1mm to 3mm with half sizes as well, and you can stack them if needed. They go between the motor and the freewheel. Any bike shop that does repair work should have them in stock, but mail order is less effort. Random eBay Shim Link
The chain spacing from hub to gear should be 5mm for a 7 speed, however the derailleurs will more room, so fitting is a little bit of trial and error. buy more shims than you need in several sizes, so you can get the fit perfect.
Alan B
100 GW
Thanks for the shim tip. I did get a shim for the earlier Novara, but didn't end up using it, I should put one on this motor, the steel frame won't be stressed by any needed spreading of the rear wheel stays. I was thinking about this recently, and now I see you suggested it as well, somehow I missed that earlier. My son is a "non shifter", he just torques (and motors) along, so he doesn't really miss the low gear.
Another thing I notice is that the LVC is set at 36V for a 10 cell pack, which is probably a little high. He occasionally gets a cutout of the motor when climbing a hill, I suspect the LVC needs to be lower for the dynamic load condition. The Anderson connectors are fairly pitted from connection surge sparks, so we probably need an anti-spark setup as well. But this bike is still in service for occasional use, with the original battery pack, controller, and motor.
Another thing I notice is that the LVC is set at 36V for a 10 cell pack, which is probably a little high. He occasionally gets a cutout of the motor when climbing a hill, I suspect the LVC needs to be lower for the dynamic load condition. The Anderson connectors are fairly pitted from connection surge sparks, so we probably need an anti-spark setup as well. But this bike is still in service for occasional use, with the original battery pack, controller, and motor.
Alan B
100 GW
Don't you just hate it when you feel the tire run over something you didn't really see, and then notice something is making a clicking sound once per tire revolution? Then you start to feel the wandering looseness of the low tire pressure. Well, that punctuated our lunch/shopping trip yesterday and today I snapped this pic of the skewered tire. And this is a Schwalbe Marathon tire with kevlar and that didn't seem to help at all.
Four patches later, two for the inside of the tire and two for the tube, and we are back in business. At the same time we replaced the pushbutton switch on the old Cycle Analyst which had snapped off, allowing the display to randomly change modes.
The old Steel mountain bike and 9C hubmotor may not be flashy, but it eats up the miles and doesn't complain. My adult son doesn't baby it, he just rides. Not for fun, but to get somewhere, this is a transportation machine.
Ride On!
edit - I just retrieved the nail and checked, it looks like aluminum, but it is steel. We need a good magnetic nail catcher.
Alan B
100 GW
I forgot to mention that we did surgery to repair the Cycle Analyst pushbutton on this bike. It had been snapped off on a random impact from something, and the display was randomly changing modes. We found almost exactly the same pushbutton in our collection of parts and replaced it, now the display is working as before.
Alan B
100 GW
Today we went for a lunchtime bike ride and I grabbed a current pic of the bike featured in this thread, which my adult son uses for his basic transportation.
In the background is the CroBorg, my ride for the day. Nice day for a ride.
He didn't want to give up the bottle holders, so he carries the DIY 10S4P 20AH 0.88KWh Turnigy battery in the trunk bag. It is tail heavy but says he doesn't mind. Peugeot Canyon Express triple butted CroMoly frame with lugs, Cycle9 9C 2807 rear DD motor and 12 FET controller, thumb throttle, Old Cycle Analyst. Schwalbe Marathons, Cloud9 saddle, ToPeak Trunk, BioPace Chainrings, but he doesn't pedal much.
In the background is the CroBorg, my ride for the day. Nice day for a ride.
He didn't want to give up the bottle holders, so he carries the DIY 10S4P 20AH 0.88KWh Turnigy battery in the trunk bag. It is tail heavy but says he doesn't mind. Peugeot Canyon Express triple butted CroMoly frame with lugs, Cycle9 9C 2807 rear DD motor and 12 FET controller, thumb throttle, Old Cycle Analyst. Schwalbe Marathons, Cloud9 saddle, ToPeak Trunk, BioPace Chainrings, but he doesn't pedal much.
Alan B
100 GW
We're doing some upgrades on the Canyon Express. This bike is like the Eveready Bunny, it just keeps on going and going.
Son has a new job with 31+ miles of round-trip commute. Some of the old Lipos failed from age or overdischarge. First we tried an old triangle battery 52V 20AH but he wasn't happy losing the triangle. It was heavy and the range was marginal. Despite being fully charged one day he ran out a mile or so from home at the end of his day, he was not a happy camper.
We had an old, hardly used 52V 13AH Shark battery on hand, but the mount only caught one bottle mount screw. That's not adequate. So I designed some mounts and 3D printed them. They clamp on the conveniently round tubes (using four drywall screws with holes designed into the plastic) and provide support for the battery mounting plate. The middle mount allows a machine screw to pass through and grab the bottle mount threaded hole in the steel frame. The upper mount has a brass threaded insert melted into it to catch a second screw from the battery mount plate. The bottom clamp provides a platform to support the base of the battery mount. All three have slots for the three bike cables along the downtube, as well as four slots for electrical wiring. The tops of the middle and top clamps have oval recesses designed to fit the battery mount base bosses with minimal play, so the system is very firmly constrained. There's plenty of room to slide the battery upward and remove it when unlocked.
With this setup he will have to charge both at home and at work which should provide adequate range for his commute. The gradients on his route are modest. If I can convince him to pedal more that would help as well.
Son has a new job with 31+ miles of round-trip commute. Some of the old Lipos failed from age or overdischarge. First we tried an old triangle battery 52V 20AH but he wasn't happy losing the triangle. It was heavy and the range was marginal. Despite being fully charged one day he ran out a mile or so from home at the end of his day, he was not a happy camper.
We had an old, hardly used 52V 13AH Shark battery on hand, but the mount only caught one bottle mount screw. That's not adequate. So I designed some mounts and 3D printed them. They clamp on the conveniently round tubes (using four drywall screws with holes designed into the plastic) and provide support for the battery mounting plate. The middle mount allows a machine screw to pass through and grab the bottle mount threaded hole in the steel frame. The upper mount has a brass threaded insert melted into it to catch a second screw from the battery mount plate. The bottom clamp provides a platform to support the base of the battery mount. All three have slots for the three bike cables along the downtube, as well as four slots for electrical wiring. The tops of the middle and top clamps have oval recesses designed to fit the battery mount base bosses with minimal play, so the system is very firmly constrained. There's plenty of room to slide the battery upward and remove it when unlocked.
With this setup he will have to charge both at home and at work which should provide adequate range for his commute. The gradients on his route are modest. If I can convince him to pedal more that would help as well.
markz
100 TW
^ Love the battery mounting system!
Alan B
100 GW
Thanks, here's a cutaway view of the front mount showing the drywall screw hole. This mount takes the melted-in brass insert from the bottom. It would take a LOT to tear that insert out through the top. The middle mount is the same but has a larger central hole to clear the threaded bottle mount in the frame.
The side slots in the top are to clear the battery locking fingers. The cable and wiring slots were discussed above.
It makes a solid mount without crushing the thin triple-butted steel frame downtube. Note the lugged frame. This was Peugeot's early mountain bike and they used a lot of road bike tech on it.
We took this ebike and the CroBorg out for a shakedown and lunch run today. The setup worked well. I've got two battery chargers set up, one 3 amp portable for work and a Satiator for the home end to give us some data to cross check the Cycle Analyst.
The side slots in the top are to clear the battery locking fingers. The cable and wiring slots were discussed above.
It makes a solid mount without crushing the thin triple-butted steel frame downtube. Note the lugged frame. This was Peugeot's early mountain bike and they used a lot of road bike tech on it.
We took this ebike and the CroBorg out for a shakedown and lunch run today. The setup worked well. I've got two battery chargers set up, one 3 amp portable for work and a Satiator for the home end to give us some data to cross check the Cycle Analyst.
Alan B
100 GW
First Commute Run with New Battery
My son completed his first commute run with the new setup. He noted that it bogged down a bit a mile from home on the last moderate hill. I suppose that's normal for an old pack at about 1/3 capacity, based on the ending voltage. It is recharging now. I'm limiting the charging current to 3 amps due to the coaxial type charging connector.
He used the portable charger for the first time at work, and apparently that worked well. He had a full 8 hour shift so it had plenty of time to get to fully charged before his return trip. It charges to 58.9V so a tiny bit higher than the Satiator, assuming the Satiator is more accurately calibrated.
Pack Data
14S 4P Panasonic GA 3400 mAH (best guess)
58.8V 13.6AH 30A BMS
Trip Data
49.7 end of home leg voltage (Cycle Analyst) (approx 1/3 capacity remains)
20.47 total trip amp hours
33.51 total trip miles
58.9V charged at work to voltage (full charge w/ portable charger)
58.8V charged at home (Satiator)
9.03 amp hours integrated charge at home
My son completed his first commute run with the new setup. He noted that it bogged down a bit a mile from home on the last moderate hill. I suppose that's normal for an old pack at about 1/3 capacity, based on the ending voltage. It is recharging now. I'm limiting the charging current to 3 amps due to the coaxial type charging connector.
He used the portable charger for the first time at work, and apparently that worked well. He had a full 8 hour shift so it had plenty of time to get to fully charged before his return trip. It charges to 58.9V so a tiny bit higher than the Satiator, assuming the Satiator is more accurately calibrated.
Pack Data
14S 4P Panasonic GA 3400 mAH (best guess)
58.8V 13.6AH 30A BMS
Trip Data
49.7 end of home leg voltage (Cycle Analyst) (approx 1/3 capacity remains)
20.47 total trip amp hours
33.51 total trip miles
58.9V charged at work to voltage (full charge w/ portable charger)
58.8V charged at home (Satiator)
9.03 amp hours integrated charge at home
Alan B
100 GW
Today I celebrate nine years on ES. Thanks to all who interacted with me (in a positive way) and helped out with my projects.
Today I start a new ebike project, the first time I have purchased a commercial ebike. This is for my adult son, and I'll mention it first in this thread that covers my son's current ebike, the Canyon Express. I will start a new thread on this bike (link below). It arrived yesterday, missing his birthday by a couple days. I don't think this will entirely replace the Peugeot, but it may in time. It is good to have more than one ebike when commuting is the goal, for those times where something needs repair or upgrading. This bike has some features that are not easy on DIY bikes, such as a good kickstand, fenders, a very solid rack, good cable integration, etc. In fact his aftermarket kickstand on the Peugeot failed yesterday. We're going to have fun today putting this together.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=102321 New RadCity thread
Today I start a new ebike project, the first time I have purchased a commercial ebike. This is for my adult son, and I'll mention it first in this thread that covers my son's current ebike, the Canyon Express. I will start a new thread on this bike (link below). It arrived yesterday, missing his birthday by a couple days. I don't think this will entirely replace the Peugeot, but it may in time. It is good to have more than one ebike when commuting is the goal, for those times where something needs repair or upgrading. This bike has some features that are not easy on DIY bikes, such as a good kickstand, fenders, a very solid rack, good cable integration, etc. In fact his aftermarket kickstand on the Peugeot failed yesterday. We're going to have fun today putting this together.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=102321 New RadCity thread
Alan B
100 GW
interestingly enough, my son is back commuting on this Peugeot instead of his new RadCity. But that is discussed in the RadCity thread so I won't cover it here.
He has had trouble with range on both ebikes. His commute is 16 hilly miles and he doesn't pedal much, and he's run out of juice right at work or just shy of home on a few occasions. The pack is rated at 52V 13.5AH but is a few years old with very little use, so it has probably degraded some.
I've been trying to get him to pedal more. With limited success. However tonite I noticed that he consumed less than 8 amp hours out of his battery on the homeward trip (he's charging at work), a bit over half the capacity (thanks to Satiator charging data). I talked to him to try and figure out what had changed. Seems the most significant thing he is doing is using less "full throttle". So he must be slowing down a bit. I noticed he left a little earlier this morning, so he had more time.
Slowing down makes a huge difference in energy consumption on an ebike. We all know that, but this was quite a significant change in consumption. Enough to increase the range from 16 miles to about 25.
He has had trouble with range on both ebikes. His commute is 16 hilly miles and he doesn't pedal much, and he's run out of juice right at work or just shy of home on a few occasions. The pack is rated at 52V 13.5AH but is a few years old with very little use, so it has probably degraded some.
I've been trying to get him to pedal more. With limited success. However tonite I noticed that he consumed less than 8 amp hours out of his battery on the homeward trip (he's charging at work), a bit over half the capacity (thanks to Satiator charging data). I talked to him to try and figure out what had changed. Seems the most significant thing he is doing is using less "full throttle". So he must be slowing down a bit. I noticed he left a little earlier this morning, so he had more time.
Slowing down makes a huge difference in energy consumption on an ebike. We all know that, but this was quite a significant change in consumption. Enough to increase the range from 16 miles to about 25.
ZeroEm
1 MW
Yes, we all know that but are always surprised at how much difference it makes, I set a speed limit and peddle lightly down the hills too, if I ride slow enough 13 km I use .9 watts per km if I ride over 32 km it goes up to 15w/km. Big difference.
Alan B
100 GW
That's quite a range. Bikes are not very aero, so speed really matters.
Alan B
100 GW
I removed one of the pedals on this bike to help with the stacking. That really helps condense the storage and make it easier to get them in and out. But it is amazing how tight an old bike's pedals get.
I have folding pedals on the folding bikes, and those are convenient but they still stick out quite a bit, so removing pedals is even better. Then we use a piece or two of floor foam between them to stack them tight without damage.
Putting a pedal back on doesn't take much time or effort. It's getting off the ones that haven't been removed for 30 years that's tough.
I have folding pedals on the folding bikes, and those are convenient but they still stick out quite a bit, so removing pedals is even better. Then we use a piece or two of floor foam between them to stack them tight without damage.
Putting a pedal back on doesn't take much time or effort. It's getting off the ones that haven't been removed for 30 years that's tough.
Alan B
100 GW
My son is still commuting some of the time on this ebike. The new RadCity doesn't have quite the hill climbing power of the 9C. So this is still a solid commuter.
Similar threads
