Process of making silver fish battery pictures

As a high quality battery, it should pass though water proof test.

Put a battery in water half day, and then pick it out from water, then charge and discharge it,battery should work well.
water proof test.jpg
 
Never subject a battery to a test the manufacturer won't spec as survivable. The quality of the water alone will give you a myriad of results too, even if all else is equal. This is a bad idea.
 
I think it have to pass that test ALSO with vibration and temp change during that test to really be waterproof :wink:

Various coefficient of dilatation of various material in movement will tend to create acces for water if not engineered properly.

Static test is easy.. but now shake it with real environnment simulation and also change the temp with ramp up and down and THEN if it pass that test it will be waterproof :wink:
 
wb9k said:
Never subject a battery to a test the manufacturer won't spec as survivable.
Click to expand...
If you mean the pack's manufacturer, I'm pretty sure the OP *is* the pack manufacturer, and is posting this stuff here as a prequel to advertising and/or spamming their stuff here.
 
Maybe for a diving scooter or other marine use?

In all the 1000's of threads I've read over the years I've yet to read one about a battery damaged due to it not being waterproof. If there were truly a "need" for such a thing I think we would have heard about it by now.

Of course, some attention must be paid to "weatherproof" eBike battery pack, throttle, controller, wiring harness, etc. but "waterproof" battery pack? Everybody with something to sell has gotta have a gimmick, I suppose....
 
First of all,I respect everyone experience in e-bike,e-scooter,battery etc products,and i respect Forums regulation,I do not advertising and/or spamming my stuff here.

Water proof is one test, because for some e-bike and e-scooter,the design and using condition is different, so it's better battery can be water proof,but for an excellent quality battery,it also should pass following tests:
1.Discharge rate performance test
2.Cycle life test
3.High-Low temperature discharge performance test
4.Storage performance test
5.Vibration test
6.Mechanical shock test
7.Temperature Cycling Test
8.Overcharge test
9.130℃ hot oven test
10.Over discharge test
11.Crush test
12.Short circuit test
13.Impact test
 
Thank you for sharing your photos. I think it adds value when vendors participate and share pictures of the internal parts. A battery is a transportation investment for many folks, and it's neat to get to see what you're getting.
 
ecyclebattery said:
i respect Forums regulation,I do not advertising and/or spamming my stuff here.
Click to expand...
And we thank you for that; unfortunately many (maybe even most) of the members that join starting with posts like yours with names of companies, products, etc., begin with threads like this but turn them into advertisements and/or spam. This leads at least some of us to expect that sort of behavior, and we may get ahead of ourselves.

If you're only here presenting information and not advertising or linking to a company or products, you're very welcome to post that information in the discussion areas.

If you are part of a company, and wish to advertise, please make sure you do so only within the Online Market subforums, according to the guidelines there.
 
That sounds like a comprehensive test program. However, I think you will have trouble with a 130°C oven test! The weak link will be the cells inside and the cell manufacturer will have high (~50°C) temperature test data.
 
I have had many batteries get dunked in RC boats that were fine at first, but shorted out days/weeks/months later. I am going to agree with the others in that you are going to impress the esurfboard/eboat crowd a lot more than the ebike crowd with fully waterproofed batteries.
 
This smacks of a solution in search of a problem....

Battery packs are just components of a battery system. If waterproofing is required in certain situations it can be afforded by the inevitable outer packaging.

Normal mounting consideration in bags, boxes, panniers, or within a vehicle compartment may generally render many of your tests unnecessary since the end requirements (whatever they may be) are typically fulfilled by other aspects of the entire battery mounting design. In short, some of these test requirements might fall in the category of over-specification because of a component rather than system perspective.
 
I'll just add that if the water is pure (like distilled water), any battery will pass this test--even if it has no covering over the cells of any kind. Pure water does not conduct electricity.
 
wb9k said:
I'll just add that if the water is pure (like distilled water), any battery will pass this test--even if it has no covering over the cells of any kind. Pure water does not conduct electricity.
Click to expand...


Not true at all, try it.

Even if you started with 100% pure RODI water, the instant it's exposed to air, CO2 from the atmosphere absorbs into the water forming Carbonic acid which is an ion source to begin conduction. The instant it has any current, the + terminal forms a local concentration of OH- ions at the terminal, as the negative terminal locally accumulates H+ ions right at the surface. H+ ions are a potent acid, OH- ions are a potent base, these easily rip metal ions off the surface creating a positive feed-back loop that the current flow continues to increase as the solution's concentration of salts rapidly increases as the corrosion continues.

Pouch cells corrode with an unstoppable mechanism starting from edge of the laminate pouch foil edge if you leave them wet long enough for it to get started.

It is impressive to me if it survives without internal damage that leads to failures from corrosion long term. However, something so much harder to protect against is humidity intrusion in sealed pack designs. As the cells heat and cool during use, even the space between the strands of the cable is more than enough space to flow humid air in an out of a sealed case. The humidity condenses as the temp drops on the pack, and then doesn't evaporate out again due to no continued evaporation occurring once the internal pack humidity saturates.

This is why most sealed battery attempts become little water filled aquariums over time, UNLESS you actually get a vapor tight hermetic sealed enclosure which requires ceramic potted solid copper pass-throughs to accomplish, or alternatively having all air void space potted completely.

Methods proven to function long term are either a full hermetic seal, a completely potted assembly with no air voids, or an open design that can drain and dry with every component coated in something robust enough to protect it (not just conformal coat which does almost nothing).
 
Well, dammit, now I'm gonna have to try it. I made this statement based on other experiences with electricity and distilled water (try performing electrolysis with pure water--nothing happens), but you're saying there is more to it than that. I had to open my mouth....
 
wb9k said:
Well, dammit, now I'm gonna have to try it. I made this statement based on other experiences with electricity and distilled water (try performing electrolysis with pure water--nothing happens), but you're saying there is more to it than that. I had to open my mouth....
Click to expand...


My suspicion is that even in an inert gas environment like Argon with no CO2 exposure and actually pure water (which is impossible to achieve of course), the moment you put any conductive surfaces of a battery into it, you will have provided an ion source to begin conduction (from the water wetting any metal surfaces of your battery). It will likely begin drawing only pA, then nA, then uA, and rapidly progress into corrosion and eventually start to have visible bubbling from electrolysis.

Keep in mind, even pure copper or nickel or tin or even titanium is still soluble in water to some extent, and the more pure the water, the more aggressively it's ripping ions off the surface. Think of water not as 'neutral', but as a balanced mix of the most powerful base and the most powerful acid, and it takes nothing more than a bit of electrostatic field to polarize them into exposing a surface to a ton of H+ ions or OH- ions, which have no trouble ripping up the surfaces of most anything that can conduct electricity.
 
ecyclebattery said:
First of all,I respect everyone experience in e-bike,e-scooter,battery etc products,and i respect Forums regulation,I do not advertising and/or spamming my stuff here.

Water proof is one test, because for some e-bike and e-scooter,the design and using condition is different, so it's better battery can be water proof,but for an excellent quality battery,it also should pass following tests:
1.Discharge rate performance test
2.Cycle life test
3.High-Low temperature discharge performance test
4.Storage performance test
5.Vibration test
6.Mechanical shock test
7.Temperature Cycling Test
8.Overcharge test
9.130℃ hot oven test
10.Over discharge test
11.Crush test
12.Short circuit test
13.Impact test
Click to expand...


I thank you kindly for sharing your test with us, and would love to see more. There is much ignorance around what it takes to make a battery survive long term in harsh environments (like being mounted to a vehicle).

One can create enough vibration to destroy anything.
One can enough salt-fog to destroy anything.
One can create enough temperature shock to destroy anything.
One can create enough corrosive vapor to destroy anything.

There is no such thing as "water-proof" or "vibration-proof" or "temperature-proof" etc, things can only be more or less resistant to these things, but enough of any of them destroys anything, even a solid block of Titanium or Tool steel has a limit.
 
Yes which is why we have standards and ratings. Sadly no ATSM standard for ebikes, just those power ride on toys. Europe has EN standard and their ebike market has greatly benefited
 
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