Saga of the Crystalyte X5303 with CT4840

StevenR

100 W
Joined
Jul 27, 2008
Messages
175
Location
Milwaukee, Wisconsin
After substantial on-line research, I purchased a Crystalyte Phoenix Racer system; an X5303 front hub with a CT4840 48 volt, 40 amp controller. It included chromed steel baskets, a rack trunk with integral panniers, thumb throttle, cruise control and four BB 12-12T2 SLA batteries.

I got my old Bianchi Alante mild steel frame and fork that had been hanging in the workshop at mom's house. It seemed to be a better choice than my full suspension Jamus or Cannondale M750 with (recalled) pepperoni aluminum fork and turned out to be just the ticket. I filed the fork dropouts to take the X5's axle, mounted the wheel and attached the torque arm. I didn't really mount the baskets but just laid them over my existing rack. The throttle and cruise wouldn't fit on the Scott AT-4 handlebars (the curve is too tight - I also had this problem with gripshifts) so I put an old riser bar on and mounted everything up. I ran the wires back to the controller in the rack truck and was ready to go!

Time for the first test ride. I hauled the 80 pound rig down three flights and set off. The accelleration was quite impressive and it handled well, even with the slightly sloppy baskets. It was late so I hauled the whole thing back upstairs and put it on charge.

After work the next day I decided the baskets had to go. The panniers didn't seem like they would handle the weight so I tried putting them in the rack trunk and it turns out they would fit. The entire package was (is) quite top heavy but, once underway, seemed fine. I put the charger in a pannier and headed off across town. Running through traffic was a blast. I could keep up and even pass people from light to light. Maximum speed was 35+ MPH and as it turned out I got 10 miles to a friends house at nearly top speed. Only as I was about to arrive did the controller start to cut out and I had to back off. Actually, I didn't know what was happening so I checked out the connections and everything seemed OK. I ran slow and made it the last half mile and put it on charge. After about four hours of playing with ceramics (clay night) the battery was charged and I made it home without getting to low voltage cutoff. Trip average was 25.5 MPH for a total of 19.7 miles (recharge halfway through). The next week I forgot my charger and took it easy both ways. I made the same trip (19.5 miles on the same route - go figure) without recharging with an average speed of 19.7 MPH.

Since then I had an accident and a rack/bag malfunction. Some woman backed out in front of me while talking on her cell phone and I hit her. I bent the rear wheel and broke off the tab on the thumb throttle. The motor didn't run so I pedalled home. Two blocks away the rear tire went flat and I pushed it the rest of the way. On closer inspection it turned out the fuse block had just pulled out and I plugged it back in. Back in action! I could turn the throttle without the tab and then just set the cruise control. The rack was cracked so I got a super light weight rack from my brother and replaced my heavy duty Blackburn. Bad move. The lame seat mounting system failed and I dropped the bag to the pavement at 30+. I couldn't get it to go and peddaled back to my bro's house. Off to the bike store to purchase a Topeak rack and bag. This works great. Unfortunately the system seemed broke. The cruise control connector pulled off and I couldn't make the motor go. After much putzing still no joy. I ordered a throttle, cruise control and controller. They arrived and I wired them up. Success! back on the road again!

Just a word about the cruise control. This is WAY better than sliced bread. I would not even consider a system without it. My thumb would go numb it I had to push the throttle all the time (I got a half twist throttle but haven't tried it). It seems to extend my range by keeping the throttle constant. The up/down buttons change speed smoothly.

Since I got it I've added Schwalbe 2.1 Big Apple semi-slicks, fenders, a center stand and various wiring cleanups. I bought a Nashbar cargo trailer and have gone out to open mics on the ebike hauling my euphonium in the trailer. I just got the original controller working again and enabled regenerative braking. I'm about to take it out for a test spin. More on that and a picture to follow. I reminded myself about the regen and can't wait to give it a try...
 
...back from regen the test ride. I haven't riden other rigs but I must say this setup really works. After 600+ miles, other than the stuff I broke due to accident or equipment (non-C'lyte) failures, everything works great. There is a HUGE amount of information on Endless-sphere and other forums (this one is the best I've found) for a non-technical person or a geek like me. I am very impressed with the depth and breadth of the engineering data that has been put up about the controller and motor. There was some negative stuff about the initial release of the v2 controller but the ones I have both work great.

Regen (a non-standard feature that I found out about here) really kicks - I can't wait to get a longer ride in on one of my well known routes to see how it effects range. I have had some trouble keeping the nuts on the front wheel tight. The weakest link in the C'lyte system may be the torque arm. It works fine if it is just in tension but I'm getting some working back and forth as the axle goes from acceleration to braking. I have two torque arms now - one each in either direction and it still seems to work back and forth enough to loosen up a bit. I have an aftermarket arm coming that may help.

Overall, I give at least a nine out of ten to Crystalyte. In standard configuration it seems relatively bulletproof. The early v2 concerns seem to have been addressed and, despite other posts to the contrary, it seems to be weatherproof as well.

Now, the only concern seems to be that they are all sold out everywhere...
 
Oh yeah, here's a picture...
 
Steven:

Nice work - used to live in Milwaukee. Thinking of upgrading to Phoenix, and one worry is
the torque arms. Your feedback there is much appreciated. Good luck.... :wink:
 
No one gave this guy the courtesy of telling him that he installed his motor backwards? Oh dear. The black torque arm is supposed to be on the left side, not right.

Oh nevermind, looks like he had a problem doing that because of the fenders.
 
There is a torque on BOTH sides in this picture. Regen was enabled. I have since added another stainless one on the side you see and left the normal one on the other side - if you notice there are no wires coming out of this side.

Updating the saga...
The SLA's got to be a pain and started to get weak after about 1000 miles. I got a Ping v2 that I destroyed through high output and bad balancing. Check your cell voltages regularly and anything over 0.1V difference after 25 shallow discharges and long balancing sessions indicates a problem, IMHO. I got 2500 miles on the v2 before it got really skunky. It turns out the charger was set to too low a voltage and the battery never properly balanced. The charger must dwell at at least 58.5V in CV, again, IMHO. The v2 probably would have handled the 35A controller if it was properly balanced. I also went through several early 48V40A digital Crystalyte controllers because the caps vibrated until the leads failed. I learned this and opened the new controller to strap down the caps with zip ties to discover they came to the same conclusion. Now I am running a 48V35A controller with twelve IFRB4110. As the v2 was dying, I decided to get a v3, not the 2.5. The v3 is rated at 60A continuous and seems to deliver it. I have about 1500 miles on it and it balances such that the max and min voltages are within 0.05V - sweet. The front drive rig on the Bianci frame has over 5000 miles on it. The 5303 is still running great and I think the bugs are out of the rest of it. I have gone 1500 miles without any electrical issues. eBike v2 (see below) is now on-line so I can tear down the controller and solder the shunt to deliver 45-50A continuous. I also need to bring out the serial port or replace the CA with one running v2.11.

I picked one of Methods Monster controllers - 18 IFRB4110's rated for 100V@100A, a C'lyte 5303 disk rear and mounted them to a Motobecane HT400 with a Headway 48V10aH from evcomponents.com. I still haven't gotten around to flashing the controller but it pulls 3kW+ continuous until the speed limit kicks in at 40MPH. Maximum amps on the CA read about 250A - that HAS to be an instantaneous peak - that's about 12.5kW. It just got on the road so there's still lots to do...
 
Wow, you sure pack on the mileage, good to see. I use my ebike daily, including grocery chores etc, but you got me beat on distance traveled.

What started happening (symtoms) when your second controler was acting-up?

Thanks for the review.
 
It is supposed to be on backwards! It is taking the torque from regen - this arm pushes against the fork. The torque are on the other side handles the drive torque. I have torque arms on BOTH sides. Both drive into the fork - the strap just holds it in position. They have been bulletproof running up to 60A continuous. The only issue is that the flats on the axle seems to be rounding a bit but so far so good. I have replaced this one (the "backwards" one) with one from ampedbikes. The C'lyte torque arms are sloppy and are just a thin piece of metal - the ampedbikes arms or the ones from ebikes.ca are thicker. I use two of the ebikes arms on ebike v2.

THe new battery is a Ping v3. This battery, last time I looked, is not yet advertised on Ping's site. You need to email him and ask for a price.

Yeah, I am honking on mileage. 65 miles today and 20 or so on weekdays - I walk to work but I am taking care of my mom 10 miles each way. It seems to add up to 200-250 miles per week.
 
StevenR said:
There is a torque on BOTH sides in this picture. Regen was enabled. I have since added another stainless one on the side you see and left the normal one on the other side - if you notice there are no wires coming out of this side.

Updating the saga...
The SLA's got to be a pain and started to get weak after about 1000 miles. I got a Ping v2 that I destroyed through high output and bad balancing. Check your cell voltages regularly and anything over 0.1V difference after 25 shallow discharges and long balancing sessions indicates a problem, IMHO. I got 2500 miles on the v2 before it got really skunky. It turns out the charger was set to too low a voltage and the battery never properly balanced. The charger must dwell at at least 58.5V in CV, again, IMHO. The v2 probably would have handled the 35A controller if it was properly balanced. I also went through several early 48V40A digital Crystalyte controllers because the caps vibrated until the leads failed. I learned this and opened the new controller to strap down the caps with zip ties to discover they came to the same conclusion. Now I am running a 48V35A controller with twelve IFRB4110. As the v2 was dying, I decided to get a v3, not the 2.5. The v3 is rated at 60A continuous and seems to deliver it. I have about 1500 miles on it and it balances such that the max and min voltages are within 0.05V - sweet. The front drive rig on the Bianci frame has over 5000 miles on it. The 5303 is still running great and I think the bugs are out of the rest of it. I have gone 1500 miles without any electrical issues. eBike v2 (see below) is now on-line so I can tear down the controller and solder the shunt to deliver 45-50A continuous. I also need to bring out the serial port or replace the CA with one running v2.11.

I picked one of Methods Monster controllers - 18 IFRB4110's rated for 100V@100A, a C'lyte 5303 disk rear and mounted them to a Motobecane HT400 with a Headway 48V10aH from evcomponents.com. I still haven't gotten around to flashing the controller but it pulls 3kW+ continuous until the speed limit kicks in at 40MPH. Maximum amps on the CA read about 250A - that HAS to be an instantaneous peak - that's about 12.5kW. It just got on the road so there's still lots to do...

How does one test the individual cell voltages without ripping the duct-tape pack apart???
 
So I have virtually the same configuration, but never saw anything regarding regen capability on the CT4840. Do you have a link? Thanks!
 
Back
Top