Suzuki RF400E, now with Enertrac MHM602

Put the motor phase current on 90-100% and the batterie current on 58%, than it should work.
Had the same problems with KHB14601. If both currents are standing on 100% and I go on full throttle position the controller cut out at speed of 65kph.
You will also state that if you go back a little bit with your throttle position (when the cut out starts) and than go back to full position slowly the acceleration begins again.
Check out my threat and you will see it.

On no load conditions (rear wheel in air, away from bottom) you will have no problems during acceleration phase.
But on load conditions (high current flow) you will get it.
Maybe also your battery can not feed the controller fast enough and therefore the capacitors inside the controller will get a voltage drop down or the cabeling is not big enough to get the high current from battery to controller.

I also split hall cables from power cables of motor because I got the information that due to the reason of high current the magnetic field can influence the signal cables.

Have you readouted red-led-blinking code?
Do you have problems with the throttle setup?

Now I changed to KLS controller, this one should work better and also motor noise is history!
If you want I can send you my KHB601 setup parameters. Than you can compare it.

BTW: Nice build, nice movie!

And if you are interested in KHB14601C, I want to sell it, so you can PM me (waterproof version)!
 
Danke, that's encouraging :)

Preliminary to-do list:
- reroute sensor cable away from phase wires
- re-terminate phase wires with hydraulic crimper
- add CA to wiring to show voltage at least

- sink screws "behind" brake disk on torque arm
 
OK, did the above, minus the CA and spent the afternoon fiddling with the settings:
- 95% phase & 68% battery current
- wider throttle active range (1.2V-3.8V now) & smaller delay (0.3s)
- combined mode

One finding about the Kelly 24V requirement - I couldn't find any difference between 4 and 6S, so I left it at 4 :wink:
140mA idle, 250 when running. Idle drops to 110 on 6S

Also picked another of the 4 promising Hall/phase combinations from doing "the spreadsheet" - the methodical work paid off, have it attached for convenience.

The result: [youtube]tcYQuYan9WM[/youtube]

Then I changed the brake fluid for the front (it should better be roadworthy for the next test drive :)).
The controller wiring is back on the workbench now to add another relay for the brake (remember that I have 2 4S packs for the LV circuits) plus some mounting.
Thanks again Rovii!
 
You are welcome!
Fine, when everything works now.
But did you test it already on load conditions?
Look for a straight long street and go in full throttle position. Then you will find out it works correctly.
On no load conditions it's always no problem because of less current flow!
As I wrote if you want to have more acceleration, you can get my 14601C.
 
OK, some more tinkering with the settings tonight.
I couldn't get the "conking out" away with either "Combined" or "Torque" mode, even though I went down to 60% battery and 80% phase amps :cry:
I was able to carefully accelerate bit by bit, but that's not workable - too distracting.
On the "Speed" mode I have it now to 85/100% without issues. Acceleration from startup is "meh", once she's rolling it's OK. Top speed for tonight 80km/h, not an issue getting there even on the local hill (about 6% incline).

Performance is good enough IMO for the commute, I will focus on other things now, like:
- Find a spot on the wiring loom to connect the "brake" relay on the controller, should be black/white. This is essential for safety, I got the occasional "shove" while maneuvering on the driveway - Done, see below.
- Get the seat re-covered. There's a local shop around the corner.
- Mirrors. They come in handy in traffic. I have the polygonal ones with LEDs, maybe I'll swap at some point.
- BMS. One wire from the ATX connector came loose. Some balancing left to do after I had a creeping current/short on the OEM connector due to moisture. - fixed, need to mount BMS
- 12V /4S charging x2 - not sure yet, packs should last for more time than the main pack.
- CA, will have to steal connector from broken controller :), any idea how to avoid a shunt and use the Kelly Ammeter output? - Installed. I still need to calibrate as I just used a length of cable for the shunt (but have believable readings already :)). Need to find the magnet for the pickup.
- LED H4 headlight, already ordered, should be brighter
- front forks need new seals & oil, standing too long, feel squishy
- fairings, need adaption due to front battery box, needed for efficiency and weather protection - In progress
- making everything shiny and fitting well, maybe save some weight - tank re fitted for narrower gap, expect it to be fine against some 1mm Neoprene self-adhesive tape for sealing.

I also put her on the scale: 94kg front / 84kg rear - 178kg is not too bad without fairing, rear foot pegs, BMS and charger. Original dry weight was 186kg, or around 207kg wet.
 
Change to KLS 8080i 14401 or another controller!
That's my personally view.
The big problem is KHB type!!!
In every run I got power cut out but by knowing to go back a little bit with acceleration and then continue I know it's working but that is not solving the problem to get a smooth and powerful acceleration!
Check out my threat (https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=82155)
same problems and really frustrated!
With KLS controller I did the first run (100% phase / 100% battery current @ 175V) without any interruption from 0-200 kph!
But if you go higher than 144VDC battery voltage you have to switch off regen!
Ok 400A are under current for my motor, therefore the acceleration could be better and that's the reason I will change controller again to Emsiso emDrive500 (The costs are a little bit higher than Kelly, Sevcon and Co. And you need watercooling system)
My GSXR 1000 weight is 167kg but I only have 20Ah and no lighting system.
Regards Andre
 
Thanks mate.
I'll need the bike for commuting (as my VFR got stolen - decided not to buy a petrol bike again :)).
Thus the "cleanup" jobs as above. Maybe some sine wave controller in the future, but as they say here, it needs to be "used in anger" :mrgreen:

I wanted to expand on the brake wiring as I decided only to activate regen through the rear brake.
Cable colour codes should be the same on most (at least Japanese) bikes:
- both front and back switches get power from an orange/green cable
- when pressed a the black/white cable goes high to light up the brake lights
- for rear-brake only regen I cut the BK/WH from the rear switch, put in a Schottky Diode and pulled a cable to the front to connect to my now 3 pole "controller relay connector"

Works a treat, but made me realize I still have a lot of cabling to tidy up/remove. :(
 
Made some crucial progress here.
20170924_141802.jpg20170924_141607.jpg
Fairings were fixed in place around the front box, thanks to some IKEA PE (Legitim cutting boards :))
20170924_141727.jpg20170924_141643.jpg20170924_141623.jpg20170924_141615.jpg
will have to rework them somewhat, they are a bit low on cornering.
20170924_141713.jpg
20170925_214034.jpg
I did a "shakedown" test ride last night - 9.5km @8.5Ah
Assuming 86.4V (24S), that's ~77Wh/km, not too bad I think. Top speed was 90km/h, feels like it's voltage limited.
20170925_221034.jpg
I'm calling V1.0 - will take her to work later this week :D.
Edit: pictures added
 
A quick update after 2 weeks of commuting:
- Failed on the first day :( - forgot to charge the 4S aux battery for the controller. I got home just fine after "jump starting" from the big 4S for the lights... :mrgreen:
It's doubled up now to 2P, ~4Ah should be plenty
- Uphill starts ( I have a hilly commute) from a dead stop are a bit slow, the amps are ramping up slowly. Red lights are thus becoming fun - I stay behind the first car if I judge them to go quickly (single/young/hot hatch/BMW driver) :lol:
I still have to go from 90 to 100% battery amps
- Fairings need more work to allow for cornering at higher speeds, bike feels pretty nice, though

Best of all, the CA shows 950Wh for the 16km round trip, which would give me a range of 100km! :D
 
Yep, 2 actually :D. I blew the DC/DC on the one board I had working :(.

That's the long-term plan (and why I passed on the bigger Kelly above). At the moment I am getting the secondary functions on the bike sorted as it's my daily driver - weather protection, heated grips & other conveniences, put the chargers and BMS on board, tidy up the wiring etc.
 
I spent some time replacing the insert that's plugging the hole the filler cap left (with PP/"corruboard") and spent some time sanding/de-rusting the inner part of the tank:
View attachment 120171013_212452.jpg
Maybe I'll add a LED to illuminate the "boot" :D
 
I got a semi-cheap H4 LED headlight, fitting was a breeze - no tools required ;).
US$ 7 on Banggood

The light pattern is more than OK, there's a clear cutoff, no glare, just an area that's not lighted directly in front of the bike. I'm not sure if that's good or bad, will report if I ever ride outside of the city light's :D.

Measured the current on 4S (~16.0V):
0: "ignition" on, essentially just the contactor, pre-charge and controller power relays: 0.2A
1: 0 + tail lights & instrument ligting 0.7A
2: 1+ low beam: 1.6A
3: 1+ high beam (switches over on high and pass): 1.9A

Altogether I'm quite happy, money well spent as far my needs go.

Also started stripping back the wiring loom, lots of stuff not needed any more....
 
marcexec said:
...
The light pattern is more than OK, there's a clear cutoff, no glare, just an area that's not lighted directly in front of the bike. I'm not sure if that's good or bad, will report if I ever ride outside of the city light's :D.
...
Click to expand...
Looking at the "bulb" how does the cutoff change when you switch to high beam, do you get more light spread and also forward and up?
 
Well guys, I have completed around 900km more or less successfully so far and presented the bike at the Hackaday Dublin Unconference last night (#HackadayUnconference). The slides are here: https://www.slideshare.net/MarcAurelEvers/hackaday-unconference-dublin-2018.

Issues I had during the time were all due to water ingress in the connectors, resulting in a "creeping" voltage that put the throttle signal too high, hopefully now resolved with cover, gasket, spray shielding and Vaseline...
Also switched from the Meanwell USPs to a pair of Meanwell HLG-240H-48A, set to 48.5V & 4A last week, lovely tech to use.
 
Lebowski said:
Looking at the slides your speed is voltage limited to 100kmh. I assume the Kelly controller does not have field weakening ?
Click to expand...

Correct, it's a fairly "stupid" old thing.
 
2000km update. Life (house purchase) gets in the way but the bike's been fine as a commuter. Consumption is less than 10 kWh/100km at the plug since switchting to the HLGs. Lifetime consumption now 10.81 kWh/100km. Spent €30... :)
Details on my Spritmonitor page.

niggles I had:
- had to re-solder charge plugs twice, they aren't in the best locations. Need to order Schottkys to install the chargers permanently on the bike
- broke down once to figure out the fuse for the 4S "Controller" pack was dodgy - controller acted very weird under intermittent logic power... will be sorted for good with some reorg and a sealed fuse holder
- HV cabling run could be shorter - will move contactor as part of the reorg
- LV cabling is still a mess, and in the way especially in the storage compartment - long term project
- cheapo mirrors were wobbly and prone to break - bought a pair of Magazi Lucifers, love the quality. Still need to wire the indicators and side lights(!) in them.
- Kelly still craps out under regen occasionally. I'll live with it until I replace the controller.

Also tried to wrap the bike's tank, didn't go too well. A least I know that I don't like the "carbon" look on her.
 
Long time no post. Bike wasn't in use during the Pandemic, when I relocated the secondary 4S wiring for the controller.
Also started on the redundant 12V wiring and moved it to the same side (left). Built some ebikes instead, though :)

20220421_191648.jpg

With offices reopening I wanted to do a balance charge and found odd readings. Long story short I learned a hard lesson about making battery boxes waterpoof. Seriously, learn from my mistake...
- all busbars are affected
- some bolts were seized on the nuts (captive by way of a plastic spacer, so they spin, not shear...)
- balance wires corroded through in some places
20220421_192336.jpg20220421_192349.jpg
- most importantly, I lost the two modules most affected by spray from the front wheel:
20220421_191914.jpg20220421_191958.jpg
(note the swelling at the bottom)

The front pack was mostly unaffected apart from the bolts and balance wire issues. I gave the contact surfaces a sanding - before/after:
20220421_192415.jpg20220421_193644.jpg

The oddest one was the fuse holder. Consider the cavities under the bolts:
20220421_193904.jpg
They were filled with corroded aluminium to the point where it was lifted a mm from the box surface!
So that got cleaned up and filled with silicone. For good measure I cut a piece of acrylic to cover it off.
20220421_194400.jpg20220421_195049.jpg20220421_195414.jpg
Gotta love the new workshop - more enclosed space is the greatest gift to the DIYer. The drill press is handy, too.
 
Tidied up the balance wires and labelled them ( Brother label printer is nice 👌).20220426_112955.jpg
Put everything together just so with extra cable protection and cable ties.
20220507_215318.jpg
Additional modules are shipped already so I'll busy myself with the design of the acrylic enclosure.
 
A quick update on the bike:
Main changes since the last post are the acrylic splash guard, LED indicators (front fairing, mirrors and rear) plus electronic flasher relay and replacing the hinge mount.
 
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Hi, found this thread when surfing.... and as far as I can tell you are still using the KELLY KHB-14301 with the Enertrac MHM602 motor? is that correct?
Still 'satisfied' with the throttle/acceleration for a commuter?

Just FYI: I have a build in progress and am also using the MHM602 but with a KHB14401...my system works well on a stand but need to get it into a frame.
 
Sorry I missed this. Yes I was using the setup for the past 6 years. I'm currently switching over to the Honda IMA & Lebowski board, link in signature.
Thus the bike looks like this at the moment:
20230709_134520.jpg20230709_134530.jpg20230717_092927.jpg
Note the new buttons (for Setup & Reset) on the left handle bar & the USB cable sticking out for easier programming.
As the tricky part is under load, speeding each step up helps a lot. If it weren't raining all the time I might take the laptop with me...
Just got FOC working, but still have to test how it actually performs (150A phase for now).
 
Ok, got everything wired up semi-permanently after sealing the unit (see the IMA guide thread).
Some pictures:
20230722_172420.jpg20230722_172444.jpg20230723_201056.jpg20230723_201031.jpg20230723_201022.jpg20230723_190350.jpg
Used another 3l milk bottle container as splash guard as the aluminium tape can's seal the 3 phase bus bars...
Got up to 40°C during the test commute but less on the way back (more downhill).
Settings and tuning also on the other thread.
 
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