Third World Country Status?

[deronmoped]

Has anyone noticed that we are a Third World Country? Well, fast becoming one anyways.

I just put two and two together. Looking around and noticing all the people here in San Diego now riding bikes, most are the next generation. They have had to turn to bikes to survive, once they have kids, their finances will be stretched even further. I wonder if they will have to share flats with other families.

Pretty soon the US cities will look like China, everyone riding bikes loaded down with all their groceries, products, kids...

Deron.

 

[TPA]

...and the people of China will be driving SUVs and living in nice houses in nice neighborhoods, because they will have learned that socialism and communism were very bad ideas.

 

[deronmoped]

...and the people of China will be driving SUVs and living in nice houses in nice neighborhoods, because they will have learned that socialism and communism were very bad ideas.

Yeah, are they not a lot more prosperous lately? They have turned into the country that supplies the world with goods.

I think energy is one deciding factor, cheap and plentiful and people prosper, expensive and hard to come by and people are going to struggle more. What is it, China is building a coal fired plant every two weeks. Probably a good place to invest your money, in a economy that is moving up.

Deron.

 

[swbluto]

I think energy is one deciding factor, cheap and plentiful and people prosper, expensive and hard to come by and people are going to struggle more.
Deron.

That effect is especially amplified by a growing population, so the amount of energy per person goes down as well.

Anyways, I think in the long term, you'll see convergence between the average chinese's wealth and the average american's wealth (And global wealth in general). Information technology is making education much more accessible to everyone so it's only a matter of time before intellectual equals become much closer to educational equals and resulting economic equals. However, America has a lot of economic inertia, so it's probably not going to be a "rapid" convergence.

 

[deronmoped]

I think energy is one deciding factor, cheap and plentiful and people prosper, expensive and hard to come by and people are going to struggle more.
Deron.

That effect is especially amplified by a growing population, so the amount of energy per person goes down as well.

Anyways, I think in the long term, you'll see convergence between the average chinese's wealth and the average american's wealth (And global wealth in general). Information technology is making education much more accessible to everyone so it's only a matter of time before intellectual equals become much closer to educational equals and resulting economic equals. However, America has a lot of economic inertia, so it's probably not going to be a "rapid" convergence.

I would prefer to bring everyone up to our level of living standards, it can be done, America can be very productive if we eliminate the welfare state.

Deron.

 

[swbluto]

I think energy is one deciding factor, cheap and plentiful and people prosper, expensive and hard to come by and people are going to struggle more.
Deron.

That effect is especially amplified by a growing population, so the amount of energy per person goes down as well.

Anyways, I think in the long term, you'll see convergence between the average chinese's wealth and the average american's wealth (And global wealth in general). Information technology is making education much more accessible to everyone so it's only a matter of time before intellectual equals become much closer to educational equals and resulting economic equals. However, America has a lot of economic inertia, so it's probably not going to be a "rapid" convergence.

I would prefer to bring everyone up to our level of living standards, it can be done, America can be very productive if we eliminate the welfare state.

Deron.

I really hope you don't imply everyone should be brought up to have a 1 to 2 ton personal vehicle. With a population 6 times larger than America, I'm sure the increase in energy consumption wouldn't be exactly kind to the per capita energy supply. But, among elements that define living standards that aren't *so* heavily abusably dependent of energy usage, that would be nice. I'd like to think our livings standard are generally going up, through increasing efficiency - sure, there may be less energy being consumed, but there's more useful work being squeezed from less amounts of energy. The gasoline engine has hit an efficiency dead-end, sure, but more computational power is being produced from less energy which would result in an increasing amount of solutions are being generated from less energy. We're working more productively than ever meaning our output per capita is also going up. So, yes, it may seem there's less energy to go around, but there might just be more output going around meaning the living standards are generally going up. During this gradual increase, the majority of the population will catch up and we'll become more in parity.

However, this is a long term trend I'm talking about, not a short-sighted "Oh but the GDP went down 2% this year" type of prediction.

 

[dogman dan]

Actually, just California. Most of the rest of the US doesn't have quite such ridiculously high housing costs. Without the ocean, living is much cheaper.

 

[swbluto]

Actually, just California. Most of the rest of the US doesn't have quite such ridiculously high housing costs. Without the ocean, living is much cheaper.

Oh yeah, real estate values in California are much higher than elsewhere, that's for sure. You also tend to have a greater percentage of the population forgo a car when they're locationally less car dependent, i.e., closer to the stores. I say this because 19% of Seattle uses public transportation in some form whereas 2% of Spokane does, but the per capita income of Seattle is higher than Spokane (And, there are also a greater percentage who use their bikes.). But the real estate values are much higher as well...

 

[deronmoped]

Actually, just California. Most of the rest of the US doesn't have quite such ridiculously high housing costs. Without the ocean, living is much cheaper.

That is right, lot of it is the location, by the beaches and parks the cost goes up. The weather is a big draw too, where can you live and be "comfortable" in a tee shirt and shorts all year round? Something that is also really driving up housing cost is fees, permits and building requirements. There are areas in town now that require fire sprinklers in all the rooms, that alone probably bumped the price up by several thousand for a small house. Title 24 requiring all kinds of energy saving measures is a newer one. As a electrician I go in and install stuff to meet the requirements, then rip it out after all the inspections are done and install what the homeowner wants installed.

Deron.