TSDZ2 with broken motor shell casing

[Zambam]

I was given this box of parts from a TSDZ2 kit where the motor die casting shell snapped in half during setup. A replacement casting is available for $50 shipped TONGSHENG TSDZ2 electric bicycle Mid Motor die casting shell motor case or motor cover

Before I order the casing, I'd like to power it up to see if the controller works and motor spins. Is it ok to power it up with the torque sensor connector disconnected (2 pin white connector with red/ blk wires)?

I've been reading up on the TSZD2 and found these helpful links to take it apart. Please post if you have other useful ones.

tsdz2 torque sensor broken

I am really dissatisfyed with this torque sensor.It is really weak, I have broken it in two different bikes in about 1000 km.And I never forced them.In really normal use.So or tongsheng make torque sensors with more resistent materil or is not a good purchase this motor.

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TSDZ2 speed sensing or torque sensing issue?

Hi guys, I've had a TSDZ2 (48V) installed on my wife's bike for over 6 months now, and so far I've had mixed results: 1 month after installing it, the torque sensor crapped out, so I had to send the motor back for diagnostic and repair. Took 1 month + but the motor was fixed and we've enjoyed...

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TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Shattered

Hi everyone, long time lurker of the site. Looks like the torque sensor cracked and shattered into a million pieces. Looking for some advice to see if this is repairable. Is it just a matter of ordering another torque sensor and installing it? Should there be anything I should look at to be...

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[Zambam]

I got the motor cover off and connected the torque sensor connectors. Anything else I should check before I hook up a 48 V battery to the XT90 connector?

 

[Zambam]

Well she runs!

I bench tested it with 48V battery and she runs. I need to find a replacement casing (new or used) before I can install this kit in my Raleigh Seneca Mountain Tour. This will be my first conversion. My main objective is to see if I like pedaling with torque sensing. I hated pedaling with PAS because of the delay in the assist and not being able to fine tune the amount of assist (too much even on the lowest setting), such that I ride my ebikes throttle only. I am not against pedaling. Maybe torque sensing on a mid drive will get me back to pedaling.

 

[docw009]

I see you have a throttle. It's good for testing a pile of parts, but in actual ebiking you will find it very disappointing compared to a cadence bike hub motor kit. None of the traditional kick you expect from a throttle. Oh well, you'll find out.

 

[Zambam]

I see you have a throttle. It's good for testing a pile of parts, but in actual ebiking you will find it very disappointing compared to a cadence bike hub motor kit. None of the traditional kick you expect from a throttle. Oh well, you'll find out.

Is it only disappointing using a throttle on a mid drive? What if I do not use the throttle and pedal the mid drive like an unassisted bike?

 

[scianiac]

He's just saying the unimpressive power of the TSDZ2 means the throttle isn't like the throttle on a more powerful hub motor. That being said I often ride my TSDZ2 bike with the throttle only and torque sensing only and they are both quite nice but you do have to be in just the right gear the motor wants to really get moving. Also the OSF firmware and a 52V battery helps but for pedaling it's very nice at reasonable power levels, at higher power levels the pedal assist still works assuming you have the torque sensor calibrated well but it's less natural since it's a bit more power than you're putting in.

Since I'm assuming you're using this bike for faster road use I'll give you my experience with that. I mostly ride the bike off road but did use it a bit on the road and I was able to get up a little bit above 20mph with it using higher pressure faster XC tires so you'll do better with road tires. I was never able to get it to not skip on the smallest cassette cog but I expect it might be possible with some tweaks to the derailleur for more chain wrap but a big front chainring helps so you can use the middle cogs more. While you've got the motor open some temp mods would be a wise idea, plugging my own stuff but a heatsink shim (link below) goes a long way to preventing overheating.

 

[Zambam]

He's just saying the unimpressive power of the TSDZ2 means the throttle isn't like the throttle on a more powerful hub motor. That being said I often ride my TSDZ2 bike with the throttle only and torque sensing only and they are both quite nice but you do have to be in just the right gear the motor wants to really get moving. Also the OSF firmware and a 52V battery helps but for pedaling it's very nice at reasonable power levels, at higher power levels the pedal assist still works assuming you have the torque sensor calibrated well but it's less natural since it's a bit more power than you're putting in.

Since I'm assuming you're using this bike for faster road use I'll give you my experience with that. I mostly ride the bike off road but did use it a bit on the road and I was able to get up a little bit above 20mph with it using higher pressure faster XC tires so you'll do better with road tires. I was never able to get it to not skip on the smallest cassette cog but I expect it might be possible with some tweaks to the derailleur for more chain wrap but a big front chainring helps so you can use the middle cogs more. While you've got the motor open some temp mods would be a wise idea, plugging my own stuff but a heatsink shim (link below) goes a long way to preventing overheating.

If I am pedaling (torque sensing), does the throttle still work if I want to gain speed quickly? It will only be used on city roads with speeds between 10 to 25 mph. There are no steep hills around here. Do you think I will need your heatsink shim?

Do the casing fail like mine often? The new case half that I need is $75 shipped, not $50. If I can't find a good used one at a reasonable price, I may consider buying a new motor (around $230) and use my motor as spare parts.

 

[scianiac]

I've only used the OSF (firmware) but I assume it works the same so yes the throttle works at the same time exactly like that. If you want to cruise around even on level terrain above around 10-15mph some cooling mods would be a good idea, mine got pretty warm even with the heatsink shim at above 20mph. The cooling design of the motor is intentionally terrible.

I've only seen the casing break when hit very hard on something like a rock, so pretty rare. Honestly while I love my TSDZ2 and I've had much better luck than many with it there is no way I would buy one now over a Toseven if I wanted something like it. The Tosevens yes a bit more expensive but still not CYC money and seem to solve all of the numerous problems of the TSDZ2.

 

[Zambam]

I've only used the OSF (firmware) but I assume it works the same so yes the throttle works at the same time exactly like that. If you want to cruise around even on level terrain above around 10-15mph some cooling mods would be a good idea, mine got pretty warm even with the heatsink shim at above 20mph. The cooling design of the motor is intentionally terrible.

I've only seen the casing break when hit very hard on something like a rock, so pretty rare. Honestly while I love my TSDZ2 and I've had much better luck than many with it there is no way I would buy one now over a Toseven if I wanted something like it. The Tosevens yes a bit more expensive but still not CYC money and seem to solve all of the numerous problems of the TSDZ2.

Is OSF firmware not what originally came from Tongsheng? I have to figure out how to get into the KT-LCD3 menu to find out what version firmware is on mine.

Checked out your your site. Some pretty cool stuff! I have no need for high power flashlights. Air rifles are illegal here otherwise I'd be interested in one. I'll buy a heatsink once I procure the casing.

 

[bikes4two]

I see you have a throttle. It's good for testing a pile of parts, but in actual ebiking you will find it very disappointing compared to a cadence bike hub motor kit. None of the traditional kick you expect from a throttle. Oh well, you'll find out.

If from an ebike you are looking for the motor to the majority or a significant amount of the work, then some might find the TSDZ2 lacking.

However, if you have been or were say, a keen cyclist on unassisted bikes and are now looking for some assistance just to replace that lost through illness/age/etc, then the TSDZ2 is likely just the thing especially as the Torque Sensing feature replicates a normal cycling experience much better than a cadence sensing system as found in some hub motors and the BBSxx series of middrives.

Each to their own as they say.

PS - I have two TSDZ2 bikes and three others in my circle of friends and apart from an easily remedied water ingress issue on one of them, we all have had good service from the TSDZ2 and none of has a throttle and we don't use brake sensors either.

 

[bikes4two]

Is OSF firmware not what originally came from Tongsheng? I have to figure out how to get into the KT-LCD3 menu to find out what version firmware is on mine.

Checked out your your site. Some pretty cool stuff! I have no need for high power flashlights. Air rifles are illegal here otherwise I'd be interested in one. I'll buy a heatsink once I procure the casing.

Firstly, well done on your bench testing - clearly you are a person who likes a challenge.

OSF (Open Source Firmware) was developed by group of rather clever people to replace the factory loaded (OEM) firmware to improve the ride options not normally available to the end user.

I am a not a demanding rider and use my 36v 250w motors normally in only the lowest assist levels and even long rides in 30degC or more does NOT see the motor get more than warm to the touch, thus for me any additional cooling would be a waste of time.

If maybe you demand more from your motor such as running at 750w, 48v across the Kalahari desert, then additional cooling is a must I'd have thought.

I'd say just get the motor installed and up and running and if you like the ride experience, then wonder about the cooling side of thingslater.

 

[Zambam]

Firstly, well done on your bench testing - clearly you are a person who likes a challenge.

Thanks and sorry for the late reply. Hey I had to do something with the basketcase.

OSF (Open Source Firmware) was developed by group of rather clever people to replace the factory loaded (OEM) firmware to improve the ride options not normally available to the end user.

I have to thank the group of developers and all who participated, w/o them and their incredible work, I would not have been able to bring the motor back to life: Mbrusa, Casainho, Mspider, stancecoke and more whose name I do not recall atm. What about wapous? I see his name mentioned a lot (he did the TSDZ2 animation which was extremely helpful) but I cannot find any posts by him on ES.

I am a not a demanding rider and use my 36v 250w motors normally in only the lowest assist levels and even long rides in 30degC or more does NOT see the motor get more than warm to the touch, thus for me any additional cooling would be a waste of time.

If maybe you demand more from your motor such as running at 750w, 48v across the Kalahari desert, then additional cooling is a must I'd have thought.

I'd say just get the motor installed and up and running and if you like the ride experience, then wonder about the cooling side of thingslater.

My TSDZ2 now has 664 trouble free miles! First 500 was on an 87 Raleigh Mtn Tour Seneca, chromoly frame, then moved to a 2004 Raleigh M80 hardtail Mtn bike alloy frame which I've put on 164 miles so far. I am not a demanding rider either. I'm light in weight, the bike + motor is also light at 41 lbs. There are no long steep hills around here. Longest is probably 1/4 mile @ 8 % grade? On the first bike, I rode with a thermocouple digital meter (probe in contact with stator). Internal motor temp never exceeded 55 C in the hottest days (35 C). External motor temp never more than warm to the touch. I do not anticipate any temperature issues and left out the thermocouple meter on the second bike (probe is still on the motor, tucked away so I could plug in the meter at any time if I want). No plan to install copper motor cooling plate even though I have all the parts.

 

[Zambam]