Regarding responding violently...i am sorry guys i tend to do that when blatantly provoked...there has only been one poster that had really gotten under my skin...
Hi Matt,
Just as i was thinking we were becoming friends
....you want to continue to argue.
Your posts really befuddle me. I dont know where to start. For one thing i feel i was attacked by you and others by just doing a riders report in which i reported both big pluses and big minuses to the optibike. Its obvious from this thread that people are interested in optibike so why not just let me have my fun. I am spending big time on these posts just to share info on a bike i am excited about...no reason to belittle me. You in particular were like kindergarden cop in your tone...but thanks for still allowing me to post.
There are so many wrongs in your posts...let me just focus on the most critical because it will bring my argument full circle on why the opti is costly compared to a boutique es build. ALso it might end up saving a life or two and saving you a ton of legal hassle...maybe even jail time.
You can thank me later.
You said in your last post this: "And I truly take issue with people who post incorrect data whether it is regarding battery technology, motors, controllers, or complete bikes."
I take particular issue with hypocrisy and i am assuming you are taking issue when i called charging 48 volt lipo batteries at 800 watts "insane".
You retored with this
"Geeze, Dude, you are really a piece of work. For one thing, 800 watts is a 1C charge rate of a 800wh pack. That would be a 44 volt nominal (12s) 20 ah pack. Most Lipo packs are good for at least 2C charge rate."
I let all this go in the name of peace......but i still think your totally insane for selling this stuff...
Even running a real lipo pack designed for ebike applications with a bms and lower discharge cells is considered risky. These packs are expensive like this one 800 bucks for 10ah pack: http://www.batteryspace.com/highpowerpolymerli-ionbattery518v10ah518wh40adrainrate.aspx
To strap together big rc packs and make one giant pack is dangerous....to sale them with a 800 watt charger to the public is absolutely wreckless, negligent, and insane.
Have you ever noticed that rc chargers for big packs do not have a 110 outlet only 12 volt terminals? You ever wonder why? They are too dangerous to be charged indoors even in a garage. So when you sale one if you provide a rc charger like the rc packs were designed for...your customer is going to be charging his 8k bike leaned against his car with the motor idling so that rc charger doesnt drain his car battery...what a picture. But you are suggesting something even more ludicrous and dangerous. You are selling to your customers a Zivan charger $575 designed to charge an electric car battery..with a 110 outlet...so inside the house or inside the garage.
The few bike companies who dare to sale lipo in there bikes like optibike use very high quality batteries contained in metal encasing, and do not provide the bike with larger than a 150 watt charger...charging the pack at 3amps (48 volts x 3 amps = 150 watts .3c). They do this for fire safety. For you to offer customers a virtual fire bomb of a pack and charge it at 14amps with no bms and a charger designed for electric cars is insane. I cant even imagine what precautions you would have to take to sale such a thing. With the law of averages my (generous) guess is for every 100 packs you sell you burn down a house...for every 500 packs you burn down an apartment building. My guess is you would average one death by fire for every 100 packs you sale with that charger. If i were you i would talk to an attorney and see what exactly your liability is selling something so dangerous.
I would think 3rd degree murder and wreckless endangerment would be included in losing everything you own in the event of an aparment fire started by one of your products. Not to mention the embarrasment to your sphere peers. I think that this thread might be used ad evidence against you since you pretend to be such a know it all. Its hard to play dumb when you have threads like this warning you blatantly and you choose to ignore.
IT is one thing to play it on the cheap for products your build for yourself..but even then i would have a big problem if you lived in the same apartment complex with my family knowing you are taking that kind of risk...but unleashing something like jankey lipo packs on the public and making "a pretty penny" i would consider extremely negligent. Imagine how pissed someone would be if they spent 7k on one of your boutique builds and they lost there house because of it. Lithium technology is nothing to mess around with. Its fine for experimenting here on the sphere...but selling to the public god help you.
You have to get together with a liability specialist to help you imagine all the possibilies of what can go wrong. For example i would suggest you build for all your customers a giant gun safe if they have teenage kids in the house. Lets say you play it on the cheap es style and just supply every customer with a giant bike sized fireproof bag and a kryptonite lock. A teenage boy is capable of copying your krypto key down at the hardware store while you are in the shower and next time your at work take your lipo powered tadpole on a joyride...but wait its not charged...let me plug it into dads 575 dollar 800 watt charger... this pack will be DONE in a jiffy. Oh how do you set this thing so many buttons..ok think i got it...now while i am waiting i will go back upstairs and smoke a bowl, drink a beer, watch some tv...have a nap on the couch...pow...popcorn. those kind of scenarios...you need to build a giant gun safe and call it a childproof fire locker and make sure you fit it with an electronic combination lock you can change once in a while...or better yet...i think you should just stop selling rc lipo packs to the public right now before you kill somebody and wreck it for all of us.
In fact Matt, i think its time you stop hanging around your computer and get in your rolodex...and do what they call in the business a "boutique recall". I would not want a single rc pack build out in the public hands that you built if i were you. The risks are tremendous...despite what you think you read on the sphere. Let your customers buy their own packs from hobby city, and pay with their own credit cards, and have them illegally shipped from china (illegal to ship lipo packs to US from china) to their addresses. I really hope your listening matt...because when you order lipo packs and have them shipped to your house you are breaking the law and there is a permanent record of that....if someone dies...if a child dies in a fire...you broke the law and someone else paid the price...i guarantee it will come back to haunt you...especially if you made a "pretty penny" in the process.
After you get done with your recall you should spend some more time reading here on the sphere instead of flaming...and read up on lifepo4 technology...and even then...with the negligence you have just shown i think you should be demoted to lead acid for a while until you truly understand what selling a 8 thousand dollar 40mph fire hazard to the public implies. If your vehicle is not bicycle legal...then in most states it would just be considered an unlicensed motor vehicle. Seriously I would stay away from complete bikes and just sale parts for a while until you talk to a good liability lawyer so atleast you know exactly what you are risking. Sounds like a lot to me.
Maybe after you have read a bit you will appreciate the safety precautions companies like Tesla take. Each cell is in its own fireproof resin so that if one cell blows it wont start a chain reaction. Maybe you will finally understand why optibikes cost 10k....and how they got away with using one of the most dangerous chemistries in a battery...and still build a bike that is perfectly safe to charge inside a house.
Maybe you will understand how a 450 dollar 20ah 48 volt lightweight and safe battery is an impossibility...and if it were possible you would see small electric vehicles everywhere...
Sorry dude..no offense...but you need to get busy on your boutique recall RIGHT NOW.
