Zippy Flightmax / Turnigy lipo testing

[Hyena]

Good man Luke, I was about to take one for the team but you've saved me the trouble

 

[Ypedal]

anyone know of HK sells the proper solder for lipo's ? i need to buy some and can't find it on their site..

I finally gave up waiting and swapped my zippy's for turnigy packs, my orders ship today ! and i'm ordering yet some more stuff.. :lol:

 

[El_Steak]

Looking through the comments on HK, the charger was identified as a rebadged "Maxpro X3 Quint".

A quick google search yields more information, even a quick youtube review.

As you mentionned, the unit probably puts the 3 cells in series and then charges them at 12.6V while "precision balancing". I would have prefered independent 4.2V chargers with a voltage pot adjustment inside for each (like the Turnigy 420).

As for charging your 15S pack with one unit, since no main leads are involved, I think you can still do it. You would need to come up with a clever connector contraption that would take 3 x 5S inputs and convert them in 5 x 3S outputs. i.e., cell 1, 2 and 3 on pack 1 would get their own connector while cells 4 and 5 would charge alongside cell 1 of the second pack (pin #6 on pack 1 would be connected to pin #1 on pack 2) and so on and so forth.

 

[vanilla ice]

I fried some of those individual ones thinking they were isolated.. Thats great if the five-by charger is isolated. I doubt it is though.

 

[liveforphysics]

anyone know of HK sells the proper solder for lipo's ? i need to buy some and can't find it on their site..

I finally gave up waiting and swapped my zippy's for turnigy packs, my orders ship today ! and i'm ordering yet some more stuff.. :lol:

No lipo solder sold there.

If you like working with solder paste (my favorite way to do it), buy "solder-it" brand aluminum solder paste. Comes in a white syringe in a blister pack. Solders aluminum as easy as normal solder on copper.

 

[liveforphysics]

I fried some of those individual ones thinking they were isolated.. Thats great if the five-by charger is isolated.

That's so lame those 3s modules aren't isolated like the older style. Its unlikely these 5x3s modules are isolated, but it would sure be great.

 

[mwkeefer]

Hello all,

I know Methods and Luke and guys all have me beat for LiPo whore status but... I was just auditing the expenses YTD for my various projects and I tallied the HobbyKing orders... $3442.40 so far this year on LiPo and other misc. bits and pieces...

Where is everyone else at with YTD HK totals? Just curious if were keeping them in business as a community or not?

-Mike

 

[number1cruncher]

They got at least a grand from me last year for batteries, balancers, monitors. My total e-bike expenses for 2009 were just under $3500. My wife gets our deductions ready for taxes, so there's no hiding the habit...

 

[methods]

HC only got $2.2K from me this year but that does not include the $5k I spent on the 2,650 Emoli cells. I would have preferred HC cells but for only $0.18/wh it was not really a choice.

I am still trying to figure out what to do with the other 1,500 cells..... I am thinking I want to expand my 20S 48P pack into a 32S 48P pack. That will eat up about 500 of them. I guess I can just recycle the rest ( )

-methods

 

[mwkeefer]

Anyone seen this one yet?

10S 4500 mah 30/40C 10S Zippy @ 99.00 ea (3lbs per)

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=11037

Looks promising for both 10S2P packs @ 9ah, 30C and 6lbs in a nice size to sit along the downtube or... 20S2P for us higher powered guys 12lbs and 400.00.

Still for the 36v crowd combined with a meanwell or iCharger this could be a nice entry into LiPo @ about 350 (or near the cost of 9ah LiFePo4 solutions).

-Mike

 

[amberwolf]

I guess I can just recycle the rest ( )

I can help with that recycling....

 

[methods]

I guess I can just recycle the rest ( )

I can help with that recycling....

I might be able to send my dumpster-diving buddy a taste of the good stuff
I already have you in mind for my spring cleaning. As soon as I have a minute to breath I am going to sell off all the last of my "extra" ebike stuff and anything that does not sell is going in a big parcel-post box to you :wink:

-methods

 

[Hyena]

The mind boggles at the sort of treasures you'll find in a mixed bag of goodies from methods! It's like the fish that John West rejects :lol:
(I'm not sure if that joke applies outside Australia...)

I just checked my HK history, dammit who's idea was that
$2500 USD this financial yeah. *gulp*

I just noticed they're now selling 80w soldering irons for under $5 too. The next logical step is to start stocking cheap solder too.

 

[amberwolf]

I might be able to send my dumpster-diving buddy a taste of the good stuff
I already have you in mind for my spring cleaning. As soon as I have a minute to breath I am going to sell off all the last of my "extra" ebike stuff and anything that does not sell is going in a big parcel-post box to you :wink:

Really? Cuz I was mostly joking around (since I figure you were as well--that's a lot of cells to just "recycle" :lol. Of course, I could certainly use almost anything sent, if not immediately then eventually. Though, if you're like me, that "spring" cleaning will be more like late summer....

I am still working on charging/sorting the LiCo cells I have now, and then on a F/G v2.6 BMS for them, since thanks to AndyH I have most of the parts.

Too many projects, not enough time. I know how that works. The more time I think I have, the more projects I start, which makes the whole thing even worse.

 

[GCinDC]

Anyone seen this one yet? 10S 4500 mah 30/40C 10S Zippy @ 99.00 ea (3lbs per)

Sweet!! esp for those of us w/ 10S iChargers. But I got the impression that charging 10A 10S might blow the iCharger and I've been glad I'm only charging 10A 5S. BTW, anyone seen any 10S extensions?

 

[Hyena]

Yeah these were posted a few days back, but there's already been a few pages of posts since!
If you look at the picture they actually bring out 2 lots of 5S balance taps, so you can use any old charger + 5S extensions

 

[El_Steak]

Yeah these were posted a few days back, but there's already been a few pages of posts since!
If you look at the picture they actually bring out 2 lots of 5S balance taps, so you can use any old charger + 5S extensions

Since the 10 cells are "hard wired" in series, I don't see how you can charge the pack using anything less than a 10S charger (unless you charge the cells individually only through the balance taps)

Those 2 x 5S balance taps sound like an easy way to get crisp KFF for us that are used to rewire our packs from series for discharge to parallel for charge.

If you try to parallel the 2 x 5S balance taps into a single one (like you would do if you had 2 separate 5S1P packs) you're gonna get some fire works!

 

[number1cruncher]

Yeah these were posted a few days back, but there's already been a few pages of posts since!
If you look at the picture they actually bring out 2 lots of 5S balance taps, so you can use any old charger + 5S extensions

Since the 10 cells are "hard wired" in series, I don't see how you can charge the pack using anything less than a 10S charger (unless you charge the cells individually only through the balance taps)

Those 2 x 5S balance taps sound like an easy way to get crisp KFF for us that are used to rewire our packs from series for discharge to parallel for charge.

If you try to parallel the 2 x 5S balance taps into a single one (like you would do if you had 2 separate 5S1P packs) you're gonna get some fire works!

Good point! It would make more sense to buy the separate 5s packs, so you can trouble shoot and repair easier as well. I guess one could use a MW 350-48 turned down to 41.5V and two balancers, but then again, this is no different than with individual 5s packs in series.

Actually, now that I think of it, this setup is not good for us. Since the individual packs are series'd first, one would need to be very careful when pack building not to parallel the wrong balance taps. For example, each 10s is 2 series'd 5s packs. Side1 = balance plug1 and Side2 = balance plug2. If you have 2 10s packs, you have 4 sides. If you connect side1 of pack 1 with side2 of pack 2, KFF, right? You might need 3 10s packs and mix up 4 of the 6 sides. But the point is they are double series'd before being paralleled.

 

[mwkeefer]

The advantage is 10 cells in series impedance matched for < 10mohm

The balance taps are obviously in series so you would need either a 10S charger or a set of balancers for the taps and a decent brick / sla / meanwell charger.

The advantage in my eyes is the impedance match for 10S upfront... no need to worry about compounding issues with multiple 5S subpacks.

-Mike

 

[dequinox]

I might be able to send my dumpster-diving buddy a taste of the good stuff
I already have you in mind for my spring cleaning. As soon as I have a minute to breath I am going to sell off all the last of my "extra" ebike stuff and anything that does not sell is going in a big parcel-post box to you :wink:

-methods

Keep me posted on THAT yard sale How do you like the Emoli cells and about what is the capacity on a single cell? I've been keeping a weather eye out for a used-cell source for lithium...even if it's not lipo. Anything is better than lead to me at this point!

 

[mdd0127]

I'm mad at HobbyKing. I went through hell trying to order 8 6s 5000mah 25c packs, waited a long time for them to get here and one pack has a bad cell. No big deal. I know their quality control blows. I'll just order a couple more and return the bad one. Well, the packs I decided to use, spent hours designing a battery compartment around, AREN'T EVEN LISTED ON THE SITE ANYMORE!!!!!!! Everything else close is completely sold out. I'm soooo uber pissed.

So, it's blatantly obvious that Hobby King is not a worthy distributor for these batteries. Sorry Luke, they just don't have their crap together. Who makes these batteries for them? How can they sell them so cheap? Is everyone else in the battery world price gouging? WE NEED A RELIABLE SOURCE FOR THESE BATTERIES.

Sorry for the capital letters. In this case, it's not yelling, it's just accenting to make sure people see. This is a serious issue that it seems a lot of people are complaining about. I want to get off the computer and have a nice evening sooo bad, but now, thanks to the total incompetence of this company, I'll be probably be online all night trying to find a decent lipo supplier. Between finding a new supplier, getting things ordered and shipped and completely redesigning the battery box, this will set my project back at least three weeks, best case scenario. HobbyKing's negligence has cost me money, not just incredibly inconvenienced me. I'm going to dispute the charge at my bank tomorrow and if HK wants the good batteries back, they can pay to ship them back. I certainly don't need them because I'll be getting batteries somewhere else and I shouldn't have to pay to get garbage shipped to me and pay again to ship it back. I would like to speak with Mr. Anthony James Hand if anyone knows how to contact him.

I know that Luke has spoken up for HK in the past and knows the owner. If that's the case, get him to get on here and on his own companies forums and see what's going on. I'm going to have to find a different supplier. What a freaking joke!

Sorry about the rant. It's the truth. People should know what they're in for when dealing with this company....no matter how good and cheap most of their batteries are.

 

[methods]

Keep me posted on THAT yard sale How do you like the Emoli cells and about what is the capacity on a single cell? I've been keeping a weather eye out for a used-cell source for lithium...even if it's not lipo. Anything is better than lead to me at this point!

My yard-sale is going to be kick-ass. I am selling off all the last of my stuff including all that I picked up in group buys. I am moving my focus over to full size EV's.

I am happy with my Emoli pack but they suck ass compared to HobbyKing cells. Big, heavy, difficult to build into packs, "ok" C rating.... I will take a prismatic 20C cells any day.

The emoli cells are 2.9Ah each btw.

-methods

 

[liveforphysics]

I'm mad at HobbyKing. I went through hell trying to order 8 6s 5000mah 25c packs, waited a long time for them to get here and one pack has a bad cell. No big deal. I know their quality control blows. I'll just order a couple more and return the bad one. Well, the packs I decided to use, spent hours designing a battery compartment around, AREN'T EVEN LISTED ON THE SITE ANYMORE!!!!!!! Everything else close is completely sold out. I'm soooo uber pissed.

So, it's blatantly obvious that Hobby King is not a worthy distributor for these batteries. Sorry Luke, they just don't have their crap together. Who makes these batteries for them? How can they sell them so cheap? Is everyone else in the battery world price gouging? WE NEED A RELIABLE SOURCE FOR THESE BATTERIES.

Sorry for the capital letters. In this case, it's not yelling, it's just accenting to make sure people see. This is a serious issue that it seems a lot of people are complaining about. I want to get off the computer and have a nice evening sooo bad, but now, thanks to the total incompetence of this company, I'll be probably be online all night trying to find a decent lipo supplier. Between finding a new supplier, getting things ordered and shipped and completely redesigning the battery box, this will set my project back at least three weeks, best case scenario. HobbyKing's negligence has cost me money, not just incredibly inconvenienced me. I'm going to dispute the charge at my bank tomorrow and if HK wants the good batteries back, they can pay to ship them back. I certainly don't need them because I'll be getting batteries somewhere else and I shouldn't have to pay to get garbage shipped to me and pay again to ship it back. I would like to speak with Mr. Anthony James Hand if anyone knows how to contact him.

I know that Luke has spoken up for HK in the past and knows the owner. If that's the case, get him to get on here and on his own companies forums and see what's going on. I'm going to have to find a different supplier. What a freaking joke!

Sorry about the rant. It's the truth. People should know what they're in for when dealing with this company....no matter how good and cheap most of their batteries are.

If you find somebody with a better quality product for less money, you let us know. If you don't like paying $60-80 each for batteries, and getting one with a bad cell once in a while, feel free to pay $250-300 each for lower performance batteries from german or US based suppliers.

You take some bad with the good, or you pay 3x the money for all good. Your choice.

**edit** Also, it's werid that Methods and I never have been sent a bad cell from HK, and we've both ordered loads and loads of batteries. Some folks have multiple packs in the same order come with dead cells. It does seem weird that they don't take 2 seconds to poke a cell checker into the balance taps before shipping out a pack. 2-3years ago, before HK really exploded with sales, you could just email them and tell them you got a bad cell, or your ESC exploded, or whatever, and they would send you new gear at entirely their own cost, and offered full free-replacement waranty on every item. After people started exploiting this to get free gear, they now require sending the dead parts back as proof.

 

[mdd0127]

I might have found a US based importer of very similar packs that seems to have at least one friendly, informed employee working for them. Their 6S 5000mAh 25c pack is $119 retail, equivalent Turnigy, when it was available, was $59. I'm fine paying a little more, maybe even double, but I'm hoping to work out a better deal. Kokam wants $2300 for enough cells to build the 48V 20Ah pack so $950 for 8 6S packs at full retail doesn't look too bad. The company I'm in contact with now also has 50C continuous packs available-lots of fun for guys like you with Colossus motors to play with! I just contacted them today and am waiting on a response. I'd like to get some packs, test them and make sure they're good, then maybe we can organize a group buy price or something. I'll definitely share the source once I get some packs reserved. There is hope.

 

[liveforphysics]

I might have found a US based importer of very similar packs that seems to have at least one friendly, informed employee working for them. Their 6S 5000mAh 25c pack is $119 retail, equivalent Turnigy, when it was available, was $59. I'm fine paying a little more, maybe even double, but I'm hoping to work out a better deal. Kokam wants $2300 for enough cells to build the 48V 20Ah pack so $950 for 8 6S packs at full retail doesn't look too bad. The company I'm in contact with now also has 50C continuous packs available-lots of fun for guys like you with Colossus motors to play with! I just contacted them today and am waiting on a response. I'd like to get some packs, test them and make sure they're good, then maybe we can organize a group buy price or something. I'll definitely share the source once I get some packs reserved. There is hope.

Getting a US based importer would be great if the cell quality is close to HK's. Most folks aren't going to want to pay 1$/w-hr for batteries when they can get them for $0.40/w-hr from HK though, even if they have to order an extra pack once in a while. If these guys will deal with prices, and the cells perform well, getting a US based importer would be fantastic.