2 Speed Xiongda hubmotor

[menvert]

Seems I am having some bad luck :? the 48v KT controller seems defective, getting only .5v instead of about 5/4.5 on the low voltage lines anyone know circuits enough to know if this might be an easy solder fix or something? (seems odd to be a 10th of what it should be, like wrong resister or something)

It's normally a sign that you've got a short on your 5v somewhere outside the controller. Check to see that your throttle, brake and PAS connectors are the same wires on each side. The new controller might have a different sequence.

Yeah unfortunately it's not that, I measured with only the LCD and battery plugged in and same issue (and if I hold on the down key for 6kmh walking throttle it shows icon but doesn't give hall sensor error like it should/does on the other controller)

Okay 3rd bad luck thing, so hope it's done now; after soldering and wiring for too long yesterday to reorganize all the wires I musta been so tired... I wired 50v into the 5v PAS rail of my 36v controller when it was turned off something fried, I heard it... main functions still work including accelerator & HAL, but not brake cut off or PAS
Interestingly I now only have Speed display when I am accelerating instead of always (I think you have that issue docnoj?)

So anyway the new gears seemed to work great 18k and all seems nice and quiet.

 

[d8veh]

There's another hall sensor in the motor. When you connected 50v, you must have fried that too, so that's where your 5v short is. Your controller has defaulted to using the motor hall sensors to show the speed, which is why the speed goes to zero when freewheeling. The speed sensor shares the same 5v supply as the motor halls, so they wouldn't normally work either. It seems weird that your motor is still working unless it's switched to sensorless operation.

 

[menvert]

well here's the 48v KT controller, complete with not soldered resister, that just dropped out when opened, looks to be from the bottom right.
Any advice how to resolder it, especially regarding dislodging the FETS and getting them back on?

 

[d8veh]

It goes in the bottom left of your photo. It sits on the path between the red battery wire and the 12v regulator which is the flat three legged component at the bottom left of your photo.

It's not a big deal to take the pcb out. Remove the three screws in the side, which hold the clamp-plates for the mosfets. When you put them back, make sure that the plates are horizontal so that they don't touch the pcb.

 

[menvert]

Thanks, got it sorted, was able to get my iron in there and it now works, yay 63v capacitors.
The 36v is 50v capacitors, and incedentally it doesn't look damaged, which is a bit dissapointing, had hoped I 'd damaged the controller and not the hall sensors in the motor itself
PAS & Accelerator work, but speedo is still power-only and my external cruise unit isn't working.

More tests : Assuming red is constant power, the phase hall sensors are Black + YGB they all read okay (range from 0 to 5 depending on motor position) but the Black + W which I assume is speed, stays on 5v, so I guess that is fried, or is white the temp sensor?

Oh well, could be worse, new brake sensors are easy enough, new Xlyte cruise unit can deal with, and one day may try to replace speed sensor

 

[d8veh]

White is the speed sensor. You can use an external speed sensor from a normal cheap cycle computer. Connect one wire to a 5v and the other to the white on the controller.

 

[docnjoj]

Yep what he said. I'm still waiting for a new Cute 100 from Florida so I can get the bike running. Then I'll go attack the 2 speed. The flu has really gotten my wife and I and we are just coming out of it. Yuk.
otherDoc

 

[menvert]

Another 36k riding and still seems to be going well, got pretty warm on ride home, almost too warm to hold my hand on the motor (the 24 degree reading on motor seems too low, but that's normal)
I think I'll just get some hall sensors and make my own brake cut-offs as I can only find $40 cut-offs locally, the cheap speedo is a good idea too

 

[docnjoj]

So is the verdict that you can use 2X 6S Lithium (Hobbyking) batts as 12S on the 36 volt controller? Maybe only charge them up to 4.1 volts?
otherDoc

 

[menvert]

So is the verdict that you can use 2X 6S Lithium (Hobbyking) batts as 12S on the 36 volt controller? Maybe only charge them up to 4.1 volts?
otherDoc

Yeah they work great and very little load-sag @ my 50v full charge I suspect they were a bit too high voltage because in some instances (usually cresting a hill) the controller went weird - powering for a second then no power for a second and repeating until I turn off and on, which put it back to normal, once resting voltage was down to about 48-49v all was good again.
On the 48v controller that issue hasn't happened, which makes sense as the capacitors were 63v compared to 50v on the 36v controller.

For reference I have the 16Ah 12s MultiStar 10c batteries

Also Auto setting works a LOT better on this controller I use it often for taking off now, it's no longer swapping the gears back and forth and also it will not down-shift when under load unless it gets below about 18kmh (it's max is 21-22) though this could be related to lack of dedicated speed sensor too

 

[ktmede]

Question about front disc motor fitting.

I converted two older hybrid bikes (steel frames) with the front V-brake motor.
Spreading the steel fork a bit and use spacers worked well to fit the motor.
Now I would like to build one with a disc front brake, and know that the motor is 10 mm wider (110 total).
I would like to hear about your experience in putting this motor in fork with disk brakes (shock or not).
Are there after market forks with 110m spacing available (shock or not) for disk brakes which are affordable (hopefully < $200)?

Thanks

 

[d8veh]

If you use steel non-suspension forks, you can easily stretch them to whatever you want. Aluminium non-suspension ones would probably be OK. You can't stretch suspension forks to 110mm.

 

[turbo1889]

Some Downhill bikes use 110mm wide front (suspension) forks but they are usually built for either 15mm or 20mm through axles. Might be worth looking into if any of of them are modifiable to use this motor in front disk brake configuration.

If you are handy enough you can always do a chopper springer type DIY front fork to fit it. There are several how-to articles posted online for building up DIY chopper springer type front forks.

I built one using an old junked out department store full suspension bikes rear shock strut as the spring which is better then just a generic spring because the pre-load is adjustable and they have rubber bushings as well as the spring which act as end of travel bumpers and also act as a crude damper (not as good as a true oil damped true shock of course).

You just basically need, 2 non-suspension rigid forks, some plate or flat bar stock, assorted bolts & washers & nuts, ability to cut & drill & grind & maybe weld (not absolutely necessary), plus a large dose of creativity and mechanical ability.

I integrated my disk brake caliper mount into the left side bottom pivot bar (you use two pivot bars with three holes drilled along their length to connect the wheel and the two forks together to get the suspension travel) which has the effect of keeping the front suspension from compressing and the nose from diving under heavy braking because the reaction torque on the caliper mount acts against suspension compression. But you can just weld the mount to either of the forks as well.

If front suspension isn't a concern for you and you don't mind a rigid front fork then just spreading a cheap rigid steel fork and using a disk brake mount adapter that hooks to the axle bolt and is a no-weld install is probably the simplest solution.

 

[ktmede]

I probably avoid building a "chopper type" suspension for myself.
If I see it correctly, no one in this group as done a conversion with this motor using suspension forks and disk brake in the front.
Is there anyone out there who has put it in a rigid fork with disk brakes?
Thanks

 

[craiggor]

I think I might have a go at making a set of springer forks for this.

 

[craiggor]

Tell me now.Bolt on front disc brake hangers ! Here's my homemade welded ones.

 

[ktmede]

Has anyone put this motor in a front fork with disc brake? If yes, can you let me know what fork and if possible post a picture.
Thanks

 

[menvert]

A week off has been nice, I managed to get some of my bike sorted;
-Opened motor again and removed LOTS of grease, I had way too much, it was getting sluggish and even clogging up the clutch springs somewhat.
-Put in replacement Cruise module from Lyen
-Knocked together some brake cut-offs - Unfortunately the shop mis-labelled them as NC, when they are really NO, so I had to make the magnet engage the reed-switch when pulled as opposed to disengage when pulled, quite annoying, but I'll replace with better gear later, works pretty good actually. You can just see the little magnet glued to the silver cable holder thing


Only thing left to repair is the speedo sensor

 

[nw01]

Do 2 xd's run as functional save on motor wear ? Gear change issues ? Controller setup ?
The volcanic 'hills of byron' hand me 30 klm run to supermarket, 15 klm downhill. Would this 15 klm motor uphill, 15 klm to milkbar(7.5 rolling), be better with front and rear motors. The new NSW laws on petrol bicycles have me retiring the HS. Many trusty years of supplies. Well anyway sobsob i shall find out when 48v xd arrives & 25 ah.

 

[nw01]

Round trip is 60 klm.
Low range rules i suppose, well theres a mini mart 20k's, one hill up one hill down, flat 12k

 

[menvert]

Round trip is 60 klm.
Low range rules i suppose, well theres a mini mart 20k's, one hill up one hill down, flat 12k

I haven't ever tried 2 motors, some of my unqualified thoughts;

If you don't mind getting about 10-15kmh up steeper hills in low range then I think you should be fine with 1, I get 15kmh on steep hill in low (22 on flat), but mine is a faster winding (24" in 700c)

2 motors kinda complicate things (and if you're going for legal, I don't know where that stands), what scenario were you thinking? one for higher speeds one for lower? or full 2WD?
then I guess you'll need 2 controllers, 2 screens somehow synchronize their gear changes (if you get the model with gear change switch, you could maybe wire 1 into 2 controllers)...
Not sure a 25Ah will power 2 motors for 60k range, assuming the battery can handle 2*15A output too (I estimate 12Ah is about what I use to go 36km on 1 motor, some hills but not Byron hills, and me and my bike weigh 80kg)

So depends on the your/rigs total weight, are you using PAS mostly? My motor is under a lot of stress compared to some others as I run it at full accelerator mostly and with a bigger wheel than it's design

If I was going 2 Motors I'd get 2 single speeds, rear for low range, front for high range, not sure how people switch between though? maybe there are purpose-built controllers for dual motors (with the XD you are limited in controller choice as you need on that can reverse) though it looks like most people use 2 everything, and wire a single accelerator

Have you considered the BBS mid-drive? it would probably make more sense?

 

[craiggor]

Fitted mine and done 51 miles.It has not auto shifted once.I'am I doing something wrong ? Shifts manually,makes a noise when it does it under load.Throttle off and no noise.I will shut the throttle when changing gear from now on.Not bothered about auto shift.

 

[d8veh]

Do you have the HAL switch or the one one that goes to L above level 5? The latter only changes gear on level 5.

 

[nw01]

Round trip is 60 klm.
Low range rules i suppose, well theres a mini mart 20k's, one hill up one hill down, flat 12k

I haven't ever tried 2 motors, some of my unqualified thoughts;

If you don't mind getting about 10-15kmh up steeper hills in low range then I think you should be fine with 1, I get 15kmh on steep hill in low (22 on flat), but mine is a faster winding (24" in 700c)

2 motors kinda complicate things (and if you're going for legal, I don't know where that stands), what scenario were you thinking? one for higher speeds one for lower? or full 2WD?
then I guess you'll need 2 controllers, 2 screens somehow synchronize their gear changes (if you get the model with gear change switch, you could maybe wire 1 into 2 controllers)...
Not sure a 25Ah will power 2 motors for 60k range, assuming the battery can handle 2*15A output too (I estimate 12Ah is about what I use to go 36km on 1 motor, some hills but not Byron hills, and me and my bike weigh 80kg)

So depends on the your/rigs total weight, are you using PAS mostly? My motor is under a lot of stress compared to some others as I run it at full accelerator mostly and with a bigger wheel than it's design

If I was going 2 Motors I'd get 2 single speeds, rear for low range, front for high range, not sure how people switch between though? maybe there are purpose-built controllers for dual motors (with the XD you are limited in controller choice as you need on that can reverse) though it looks like most people use 2 everything, and wire a single accelerator

Have you considered the BBS mid-drive? it would probably make more sense?

Your probably right on the mid drive if i have problems. Interesting thoughts on having one motor setup for my hills then one for the flat. On my big run i may try asking the garage if i can topup my battery while shopping.

 

[knutselmaaster]

Post removed, I had some communication problems switching from Yona to Bonnie.