Bicycle Locks

[Matador]

I am wondering if there is something that is resistant to an angle grinder disc. Maybe concrete is ...

Nyet .. put a diamond blade in the angle grinder and it cuts like butter. The best deterrent is still a double barrel 12 gauge with heavy slugs.

If carbide is brittle and steel in too soft, why not use the japanese technique that was used to make katana : very hard outer shell (in this cas from carbon enriched steel by multiple foldings) and soft steel core.... So the sword would be very hard and keep its edge (outer shell) but the softer inner core would keep the sword from being too brittle and braking.

I'm thinking thick carbide-metal alloy (titanium?) for the outer shell and steel for the inner core of the U-lock shackle.

 

[tiny_n_terrible]

I have locked the back wheel up.
The have locked front wheel up.
I have locked the frame up.
Shopping in broad daylight . First some one stole one at Wallmart They could not go very far after bending the rims freeing the bike. Then Smart and final the wheels were missing . I quess they wanted to come back with the proper tools to free the frame later. The wheels wer behind the store in the dumpster.
I have returned from shopping at Smiths to find a bunch of school girls Stripping my bicycle. One had the handlebars cutting the cables, she wanted the cupholder . One had the seat in hand. One was trying to steal the hub by cutting the spokes. I was standing behind them waiting for the police. LOL.
For me make it as ugly as possible is the way to go. No one wants an ugly bike. Two years NO theft. I even have random Insulated wires glued to the motor UGLY!!
Thick chains do not work thick u locks are a joke.

 

[Chalo]

If carbide is brittle and steel in too soft, why not use the japanese technique that was used to make katana : very hard outer shell (in this cas from carbon enriched steel by multiple foldings) and soft steel core.... So the sword would be very hard and keep its edge (outer shell) but the softer inner core would keep the sword from being too brittle and braking.

I'm thinking thick carbide-metal alloy (titanium?) for the outer shell and steel for the inner core of the U-lock shackle.

The modern industrial version of what you're talking about is called "case hardening", and it's a fine way to reduce wear and surface damage, but won't offer any significant resistance to a grinder.

All so-called tungsten carbide industrial materials are in fact composites of fine carbide particles dispersed In a metallic matrix. Metal cutting tools usually use a cobalt matrix. I doubt titanium would be good for that job, but who knows? Maybe.

Tungsten carbide metal matrix composites can only be formed by sintering or grinding. Putting a tungsten carbide shell over a steel shackle might be technically possible, but would almost certainly cost more than any bike you're trying to protect. The carbide would also be likely to spall away from the steel core, I imagine, when crushed by a hydraulic cutter or whacked with a hammer.

If I were trying to make a "strongest ever" bike lock, I'd probably use a maraging steel like Carpenter Aermet for the shackle. But it wouldn't be dramatically more resistant to grinding attacks than normal hardened steel. It would only be extremely difficult to cut or force open.

I doubt that it's possible to make a cost-effective metal shackle that resists being cut with a grinder. The best technical approach is probably to jacket the shackle in some material that fouls the grinder blade and reduces its effectiveness-- I'm thinking something like a mixture of PTFE and powdered tin alloy, that would tenaciously fill in and smooth off the cutting surface. That surface layer would have to be firmly adhered to the shackle and very difficult to remove by other means. Again, an effective implementation of this idea would not be cheap.

 

[macribs]

Seems the thieving bastards are clever ones today, and has little fear of being seen in public with bolt cutters or angle grinders.
For those kind of thieves I don't think you got much luck with locks, if they are hell bent on getting your bike they will. Even if you lock up your bike using multiple various high priced locks what would stop them to simply hang around until bike owners return, when the biker owner unlock the bike them thieves pry /jack then bike out of your "cold dead hands"?

I think a more useful approach is to have multiple bikes. Build you dream machine and use it only when you know you will keep it the bike within eyesight or to places where you know you can bring the bike inside with you.

If you go to the store or know you will park it while going to a movie, for an ale or dinner use a cheaper, stealthier bike. With cheaper components, small battery just enough to get you around town and back and with stealthier motor. Like small cheap hub or even dual small hubs. Or make your shopping/around town bike look ugly and well worn with scuffs and scratches so nobody will bother stealing it.

I never seen those thieving bastards in action, the ones that target high priced bikes and walk around with needed tools. But I've seen several times junkies, or kids steal "low hanging fruits" like expensive seats, lights or even wheels if not locked down tight. But those are opportunists, they don't carry the tools to break things open. But those who specializes in up market bikes I don't think anything will stop them or slow em down enough to not get what they got their wondering eyes on.

 

[LewTwo]

I doubt that it's possible to make a cost-effective metal shackle that resists being cut with a grinder.

You know how it is dangerous to use a grinding wheel for both aluminum and steel? I wonder about layers of Stainless Steel, Aluminum, Iron and Magnesium

 

[1JohnFoster]

I doubt that it's possible to make a cost-effective metal shackle that resists being cut with a grinder.

You know how it is dangerous to use a grinding wheel for both aluminum and steel? I wonder about layers of Stainless Steel, Aluminum, Iron and Magnesium

Maybe the magnesium could be sintered or just powder and impregnated with gasoline just in case the magnesium doesn't get burning on its own.

 

[markz]

ball bearings might work, so when the grinder hits them the bearings just spin.

 

[Lost]

So there is no answer to this conundrum. Just buy one that looks strong, and hope my new two thousand dollar investment survives? I guess where and when you leave it is everything. So the question is what looks like the hardest one to defeat.

 

[2old]

A decent lock will deter an opportunistic or petty thief. Right now no lock will stop a professional who wants what you have.

 

[Chalo]

Where I live, only low level no-account street criminals cut locks. Most probably don't even know the value of what they steal. Professionals figure out where the good stuff lives, then break in at an opportune time and take it from home.

http://keyetv.com/news/local/austin-police-arrest-man-connected-to-97-high-end-bike-thefts

http://www.austinchronicle.com/news/2009-04-10/764582/

Do you use you best locking techniques at home? I sure don't.

 

[1JohnFoster]

Do you use you best locking techniques at home? I sure don't.

I've had 3 bikes stolen "at home", all completely unlocked. 2 were outside in our courtyard. Doh.

THe one that was inside was a build in progress, mostly just cheap junk I was kludging together, but they also got my brand new CA... in the box! They got access to the room it was in by sawing a neat square hole thru the drywall and reached inside to open the door handle. I had to laugh, I never thought of that. I really doubt it was a "high level professional criminal", but the guy wasn't dumb either. I checked on Craigs for the CA, but it didn't turn up there, not right away anyway. A lot of street people here are proficient e-bike mechanics & choppers.

 

[1JohnFoster]

ball bearings might work, so when the grinder hits them the bearings just spin.

Good idea! Maybe they could be all stuck in a sort of matrix of sockets, sort of like a bearing cage, but 3D, and flexible. It's sort of like the MC cables that have steel rings on the outside of the cable, but better.

I've long had this idea of very fine wires impregnated with high friction goo. THe idea is the wires get grabbed by the grinding wheel, pulled out and wrap around the shaft. I've tried a few experiments, but didn't get it to work.

Anywayz, no thread on bike locks is complete without mention of ... IGOR KENK! http://www.transmopolis.com/2010/05/igor_kenk/
I wonder if LockH has met the legend of TO.

 

[markz]

What about voltage running through the lock, give the thief a shock he'd never expect.

The bearing idea is alright, but then they'd just cut the outter wall all the way around the circumferance. Then you'd need regular hardened steel core. Its worth a try if you want something to do.

 

[ewinters]

What about something like this? (chainsaw protective clothing)

https://youtu.be/r5VSivQe760

Enviado de meu XT1580 usando Tapatalk

 

[markz]

Problem with that video is that when he touched the chainsaw to the garmet, it was as close to the motor as he could. If he would have done that with the tip of the chainsaw it woulda been different I'd guess.

It could work with grinders. Easier to test that I guess.

 

[cal3thousand]

What about something like this? (chainsaw protective clothing)

https://youtu.be/r5VSivQe760

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Holy crap... I've been having this idea for some time now and never thought much into how to do it. Looks like Aramid fibers would be a great start to the rest of my idea. Thanks!!

 

[1JohnFoster]

Holy crap... I've been having this idea for some time now and never thought much into how to do it. Looks like Aramid fibers would be a great start to the rest of my idea. Thanks!!

Dito! But I'm too lazy to do it myself, I keep waiting for someone else to. Closest I've seen is;
http://www.bikeradar.com/commuting/news/article/student-creates-worlds-most-cut-proof-bike-lock-41252/
But this is really lame - it's obvious he could easily cut it with most of these tools if he really tried.

I think it needs to be much fatter. WIth such a light material, you could pack it over an inch in diameter. The only limits are the distance between spokes and the cost.
If the fibers are aggressively zig-zagged they could pull way out to snag any tool. If they are all aligned it makes it easier to clamp and saw.

 

[macribs]

Dito! But I'm too lazy to do it myself, I keep waiting for someone else to. Closest I've seen is;
http://www.bikeradar.com/commuting/news/article/student-creates-worlds-most-cut-proof-bike-lock-41252/
But this is really lame - it's obvious he could easily cut it with most of these tools if he really tried.

I think it needs to be much fatter. WIth such a light material, you could pack it over an inch in diameter. The only limits are the distance between spokes and the cost.
If the fibers are aggressively zig-zagged they could pull way out to snag any tool. If they are all aligned it makes it easier to clamp and saw.

I think the fatter you make it the heavier weight, that internal chain will rapidly increase in weight if size increase. Or if you are strictly talking about more of the fibers, that could easily be added without much of a weight gain. But no matter how strong your fiber wrapped chain is, what lock will you use to secure the wrapped chain to your bike and bike stands? If the wrapped chain is made tough enough your weak spot will be the lock. And as we know most lock are pickable or cutable. With the right tools at least.

But what if you have one tough to pick lock, like the foreverlock or maybe the New York Forgetaboutit by Kryptonite and would wrap the shackles with carbon reinforced fibers, maybe even a harden steel pipe around the shackle first? Possible it would make a tough lock to crack but the weight and size would require a backpack.

 

[markz]

Needs to be something like a NYC U-Lock or them chains thats been talked about, with the fiber, hopefully they can't just cut it with a razor blade. But they wouldnt know whats going on and would have to come back for their second or third try.

 

[1JohnFoster]

... internal chain will rapidly increase in weight if size increase. Or if you are strictly talking about more of the fibers, that could easily be added without much of a weight gain. But no matter how strong your fiber wrapped chain is, what lock will you use ..

Yes, just the fibers. Plus maybe some light foam filler to reduce cost and keep up the thickness and the mystery. It could have multiple very small diameter chains and cables at unpredictable distribution. All squishy and hard to clamp to cut. And ooze a black gooey tar when they cut the outer skin it so they can't easily see or identify what's inside. Maybe they can feel a big thick chain in there, but it's actually light to carry because it's just a plastic chain. And as soon as they cut the skin, the alarm sounds.

As for the lock, doesn't someone have a bluetooth lock for me yet which can be buried completely inside the cable and I can open with my phone yet?

Backpack, aulch, no! I attach locks to the bike. Along the top tube, and down the down tube. I've made crappy ugly versions of cables like this for decades.

 

[markz]

the mystery

can't easily see or identify what's inside

Types of thieves
There is the crackhead on the hunt for quick cash.
There is the teenager who just wants to get home faster then walking when transit isnt running.
There is regular adult thief, looking to pay his rent.
There is the professional thief.

I was thinking you could sandwich the loose fibers and/or tar between the U-lock and your custom outter shell.
Using that really hard chain that can't be cut using bolt cutters, do the fabric over top of it so it looks like its there to protect the chain and the bike, but you have 2 area's seperated, the first being the tar, the second being the fibers. Then wire in a single alarm wire, spiral it around countless times then when its cut the loud alarm goes off and it texts your cell phone. Then you can start breaking skulls.

 

[markz]

[youtube]F5vA3s3S5_A[/youtube]

 

[markz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBnfA_Sj5yo

 

[macribs]

The Alarm-D missed a few key features, like smartphone notification if alarm goes off, and keyless lock/unlock.

 

[markz]

Yeaaa I think that feature is a must, a text when the lock is moved at all. I dont think many people are that far away from their bike when its locked up. The only situations where you may be a little bit far away is a mall, or an office tower, a school/univ/college, the large department stores like walmart, home depot are getting pretty big as well. I'd say 2 minutes is plenty of time to get back to the bike.

False alarms would be an issue, thats why you gotta lock it up out of the way. Then there is no reason for someone to be moving your bike around.