BikeE Build

[Fjp]

I’ve received helpful input from other members, to whom I say thank you again, but have never had anything to contribute until now. I’m converting a BikeE to a gravel grinding electric! I’m 73 and have the typical back and body part problems that age brings. Currently riding a Manhattan Smoothie packed with as many creature comforts as possible. I’ve looked all the full suspension recumbents but can’t get my head around the cost. Then I found a BikeE and started on the mods. So far, I’ve replaced the front fork with a 20” SuntourJr and a 2.8” fatty tire. That increased the wheel base by 2”. I’m not sure what I’ve done to the handling characteristics by changing the offset as wheelbase... just hoping for the best! I’ll add wider handlebars later.

Wrestled with the head tube reduction and new headset but finally got it. Happy to share the parts list and problems if anyone is interested. Pic’s of the Smoothie and the current state of the BikeE are below. I’m hoping to create a nice soft ride over the beautiful but potholed gravel roads we have in Michigan.

Next step is to complete the steering tube attachment.... need to find an adapter to go from the new 1-1/8” steering tube to the old 1-1/4” stem. Then, bend the crank arms to clear the new fork.

With so much weight rear of the horizontal center of gravity, I’m concerned about wheelies. So my plan is to peddle ride it on some inclines using my 20ah battery (tempted to location near the front wheel) as ballast. If it seems viable/safe I intend to move the 2000 watt Crystalite rear hub motor over from the Smoothy. I’ll follow up with my progress.

 

[e-beach]

Subscribed. I am interested in how you are going to do it.

 

[amberwolf]

need to find an adapter to go from the new 1-1/8” steering tube to the old 1-1/4” stem.

dunno if its rhe rihgt one but:
https://www.amazon.com/Fouriers-Aluminium-Reducer-31-8mm-28-6mm/dp/B07H4JZYR6


or

https://www.google.com/search?q=adapter+to+go+from+the+new+1-1%2F8%E2%80%9D+steering+tube+to+the+old+1-1%2F4%E2%80%9D+stem

 

[Fjp]

Thanks for the links Amberwolf. Fournier makes one that I believe will work perfectly, but I can’t find a source that can ship within a reasonable time frame..... some are quoting July. I’m going to pursue local metal suppliers for an aluminum tube with a 1-1/4 OD and an ID of 1-1/8”. I can cut one slit along the length and it should work.

 

[thundercamel]

Right on! My friend has a BikeE that clued me in to recumbents. I was lucky to find this affordable Optima Lynx, and likewise swapped the front fork to get full suspension. I thought the 20x2.4" Super Moto-X tire would be enough for the mix of gravel and pavement trails around me, but now have a 20x2.35" Smart Sam to swap in once I wear these through (which can't come soon enough). Great job on the swap, and keep us updated!

 

[neptronix]

Looks like a monster in the making.. subscribed

FYI, this bike wheelies in stock form on pedal power. You're going to want as much of the weight up front as you can get. That's the challenge of a bike like this.

 

[Fjp]

Thundercamel, the Optima looks REALY comfortable! Nice job with the battery location too. :thumb: As Neptroonix warned about the wheelie issue, I am struggling with the idea of using the rear hub motor in lieu of a front. Yesterday, I was able to get the left side crank arm bent enough to clear the suspension fork. I’m Buliding a jig today to attempt the more difficult right side. If that goes well, I need to cut the steering tube and install the shim to bring the steering tube up to the 1x1/4” dimension that will accommodate the existing stem (Not sure of the nomenclature- the thing that camps the long tube to the steering tube). Perhaps a test ride this afternoon? Thanks to all your comments.

 

[Fjp]

Update: I used a seat post adapter (1-1/8” to 30.9mm). It worked reasonably well. Then I bent the crank arms so they clear the new fork (pics below on how I did that). I should let anyone interested in doing this, that my method worked but the result was not optimal (more pics below). I will need to revisit this as I think they may have twisted a little causing a noticeable wobble in the peddle motion.

I am attempting to improve low speed handling and stability, and at the same time reduce the wheelie tendency. So, I tempted the battery to the top of the frame as far forward as possible, and installed wider handle bars. My hope is that the wider tire and increased wheelbase will result in an acceptable outcome. I’ve take 3 test rides so far and am not completely satisfied. Hence, I have moved the battery under the frame, thereby providing a lower center of gravity and moving the weight a little farther forward. I’m somewhat confident that will get the wheelie issue solved. I’ll be testing for stability later today.

Here’s where I could use some advice: I want to add as wide a tire as possible to the rear. But, I appears there will be a clearance issue with the chain and the tire, thereby limiting access to the lower gears. Any ideas on this? Anyone tried this before? Thanks, Frank

 

[thundercamel]

Nice progress! A lot of my questions will probably be things you've already considered.

Could you just get a wider bottom bracket, such as one meant for a fat tire bike?
I'm kinda surprised that a wide rear tire would hit the chain before hitting the frame. I can only think of dishing the spokes left to avoid the chain.

I'm interested to see how the front fork performs and survives at such an angle. The angle combined with the small amount of weight on the front, the kids spring is probably just right. Not relating to your BikeE, do you know if SR Suntour offered different spring rates or a 1" steerer tube on their "kids" forks?

 

[Fjp]

Thundercamel, I like the idea of a wider bb. If I can make that work it, and it would clear the fork and the tire it would be the best solution! That will be the first thing I attempt once it’s up and running. Suntour has a better/stronger 20” fork, but it has a through axel and I if I end up with a front hub motor, in lieu of my rear, I don’t think it would work. I believe that Suntour only had two options for a 1-1/8” 20”. I’ll keep you posted on how it holds up. I talked to Suntour and they said it’s rated for 250 lbs. We’ll see..... I’ll be watching it closely. Pardon my ignorance, but I don’t know what “ dishing the spokes left” means. Thanks very much for the tips.
Frank

 

[thundercamel]

Dishing the spokes would be tightening all of the spokes on the left side while loosening all of the spokes on the right side. The trick would be to keep the wheel round and true while doing it. I've built four wheels now, and use zip ties on the frame as my guides to see where the wheel rubs or not.

 

[Fjp]

Perfectly understandable. Could make the difference in getting the tire size I want. Today I mounted the battery in a semi-permanent fashion. Not real happy with it, but it should suffice for proof of concept. I’m very happy with my Allcell battery, but the bike is much better suited to a frame mounted bottle battery. Batteries seem to have long lead times.... more to ponder. Thanks for the help.

 

[Fjp]

For the sake of expedience, I have decided to change course. I’m going to move my big motor conversion equipment over to a Schwinn tandem relic I’ve had laying around for years. That will get me and the wife riding again soon and allow me time to finish the BikeE. I am thinking that if I go with a front wheel hub motor that the extra weight will help with the inherent instability. Seems like gyroscope effect should also help? I’m no engineer, so I’d appreciate some feedback on the stability question?
Thanks to all,
Frank

 

[wineboyrider]

I always wanted a bike e. :thumb:

 

[Fjp]

I finished the tandem build.... almost. It ran fine for a few short test rides then developed a horrible noise and vibration. My first thought was the axel shifted and the tire was rubbing. That was not the case. Then the noise changed to what is in the video below.

The motor is a Crysalyte H3540 with 2600 miles on it. It has been absolutely flawless until now.

Anyone with an idea of what this could be? Heading for a National Paris tour in two weeks and really want something to ride!

https://youtu.be/vU1TO4Bg8fo

Thanks,
Frank

 

[thundercamel]

That sounds angry! Is it only making that noise on throttle?

 

[Fjp]

Hi Thundercamel,
It also does it when using pedal assist too.
Thank you,
Frank

 

[amberwolf]

If the system works "better" off ground than under load, then it could be a phase connection between motor and controller.

Culd be hall sensors, t is possible one fo the them or more likely the connection to the controller, is not working properly.

 

[thundercamel]

On throttle or pedal assist, thanks. I should have said "under power" instead
In that case, I second the second half of what Amberwolf said, and was going to suggest something with the hall sensor connections. I had an intermittent connection earlier this year that I repaired, but it sounded somewhat different. Yours sounds like a steady state problem, like one hall signal wire disconnected or something.

Put a meter on each hall signal wire, one at a time, and spin the wheel by hand slowly. Each should toggle between 0 and 5 volts.

 

[Fjp]

Thanks to all for the advice, but I got lucky and found a wire on the throttle, that had been previously wrapped in tape, it was cut about half way through the conductor. I soldered it together and everything is back to normal.

Shark battery is on the way to replace the current goofy looking setup!

Regards,
Frank

 

[thundercamel]

Awesome!

 

[thundercamel]

Fjp, I just saw in another thread that you've been holding out on us! The Bike-E looks to be operational, and you've been using it in the gravel I take it. How do you like it, and what kind of trips have you been on?

I do now have two 20" front wheels for my recumbent, and I swapped them mid ride on one trip where the trail switches from asphalt to gravel. My original Moto-X tire is now on a 29mm inside width wheel, and the new Smart Sam tire is on the 24mm inside width wheel. My recumbent has most of the weight on the front tire, and any slippage on that tire is not appreciated by the rider :lol:

The Smart Sam was definitely better on the gravel trails around here, but rolled to the side on the first road I had to cross. Bringing up the pressure helped, but I can't decide which tire I want to settle with, or keep swapping. Which 20" wheel/rim did you get, and where from? Do you know what the inside width is, for your 2.8" tire? Thank you!

 

[Cowardlyduck]

Missed this till now. Thanks for sharing Fjp. I plan on installing suspension forks on a BikeE also soon, but going a slightly different route and trying out these:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32990032195.html

If you want to get the weight forward check out my build thread and video of the internal frame battery I built. Still using it almost every day to get to work with over 400 cycles and 20000km on it now.
https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57751&start=175#p1127108

Cheers

 

[Fjp]

Your fork selection looks like a better set up than mine. Perhaps you won’t need to bend the crank arms to get clearance! I’m going to sell mine in the spring. I just built a trike .... my old body said it was time. I’ll be posting pics soon and thanking all who offered advise).
Regards,
F