Factory Longtail Cargobikes (17 so far)

What are the tangible advantages of 4.0
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The 30-degree angled braces that rises back from the BB have been removed on the V4. That frees up the space where the Stoke-Monkey can be installed. That space can also be used to put any motor that powers the BB, or a motor that drives the left side or right side of the rear wheel. If you already own a V1-V3, you can cut out the braces with a hacksaw, but V1-V3 frames are usually used with a hub-motor.

I am certain the V4 frame has rear disc brake flanges, but I don't know about the V3 or earlier models.
 
This is a longtail beach cruiser. I made it with the motor and controller of a vespa like electric scooter called the suncom.
 

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spinningmagnets said:
The 30-degree angled braces that rises back from the BB have been removed on the V4. That frees up the space where the Stoke-Monkey can be installed. That space can also be used to put any motor that powers the BB, or a motor that drives the left side or right side of the rear wheel. If you already own a V1-V3, you can cut out the braces with a hacksaw, but V1-V3 frames are usually used with a hub-motor.
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I see it now. That really opens up the storage area for battery.
I still don't understand/see the benefit of the Stoke-Monkey. Looks to me that a rear hub motor is a better choice functionally and aesthetically. The newly found space can be used to hold at least 1Kwh of lithium and the controller.
 
SamTexas said:
I see it now. That really opens up the storage area for battery.
I still don't understand/see the benefit of the Stoke-Monkey. Looks to me that a rear hub motor is a better choice functionally and aesthetically. The newly found space can be used to hold at least 1Kwh of lithium and the controller.
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I have both a Stokemonkey setup and a hub motor setup. While they are not equivalent in price and a comparison is not exactly fair, my opinion is that it depends on how you plan to use the cargo bike. If you are going to put 100+ lbs of cargo on the bike and climb 20% grades, in my opinion, you might want to think about the Stokemonkey. If you do not live in a hilly area, the hub motor would (again, in my opinion) be the way to go. I like both bikes for different reasons, but one is a cargo bike and the other a Mtn bike and so I can't fairly address the question of the same bike with just different motor system. I think for really serious hills and a big load, the Stokemonkey is pretty much unstoppable. I just put it in a low gear and up I go at less than 600 watts (albeit pretty slowly). On a hub motor set up, I'd be sucking down 1000s of watts. For the way I use the bikes, the Stokemonkey is toward the tractor end of the spectrum while the hub motor is toward the Ferrari end, or at least that is my take. That said, I ride my Stokemonkey to work everyday as well as for hauling loads, so it is pretty versatile. However, I think if I was not going to haul large loads up hills, I'd at least try a well-designed hub motor system. The Stokemonkey is a killer system, but it does pumps lot more torque into the bike drive system which it is not, I think, designed to handle. I have 4000 miles on mine (as of today. Just rolled over on the way in to work.) and I have had to replace the BB bearings, the chain, and the rear sprocket due to wear. Actually, the BB bracket was sounding "crunchy" before I put on the Stokemonkey so maybe that was just a bad bearing from the git-go.

All these observations are my own and it all amounts to anecdotal evidence, at best.
 
Thanks for sharing your experience pdf.

Sounds like you're saying that the Stokemonkey is more energy efficient at comparable speed on hilly terrain and/or carrying heavy load, correct. If so how much more efficient? 10%, 20% or what? Based on your personal experience of course.

pdf said:
I think for really serious hills and a big load, the Stokemonkey is pretty much unstoppable. I just put it in a low gear and up I go at less than 600 watts (albeit pretty slowly). On a hub motor set up, I'd be sucking down 1000s of watts.
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What if the hub motor had a very slow winding for torque? Would that make a difference?
 
SamTexas said:
Thanks for sharing your experience pdf.

pdf said:
I think for really serious hills and a big load, the Stokemonkey is pretty much unstoppable. I just put it in a low gear and up I go at less than 600 watts (albeit pretty slowly). On a hub motor set up, I'd be sucking down 1000s of watts.
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What if the hub motor had a very slow winding for torque? Would that make a difference?
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Yes it would. My wife's BMC torque motor outclimbs my BMC V1 motor, but the top speed is quite a bit lower. It won't go as low as a stokemonkey though, or it would be not versatile enough for general purposes. I'll love to do a cargo bike mid drive with that nuvinci developer kit.
 
SamTexas said:
What if the hub motor had very slow winding for torque? Would that make a difference?
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Well, I'll have to let the physics/EE crowd discuss torque vs. winding count but my hub motor is a 6 x 10, which is a pretty slow winding. I use it with 18s LiPo, so around 75v hot off the charger. It freakin' kicks butt when you push down the throttle but to go up a substantial hill (20% grade) on it if you are carrying any load, you need to be doing around 12 mph or the motor starts to bog. 18 mph is even better. So you can go up a big hill with a hub motor for sure, but because you have to go up more quickly to keep from bogging the motor, you will use quite a bit more power, so you need a motor/wiring/battery system that can take it. On the Stokemonkey, I can gear down and go up at 4-5 mph, and hardly use any amps at all. If you had something wound like a 5 x 12 but maybe with more capability to shed heat and handle power, it would probably climb pretty well around 8-10 or so mph and would have a reasonable top speed (maybe around 25 mph?) The numbers are just a guessimate, extrapolating from my 6 x 10. I think my situation is not typical; I have to climb a 15-20% grade coming into my subdivision every day. My conclusion would be that you can solve the big hill-big load problem with off-the shelf stuff if you either throw money at a through-the-cranks system or throw money at a big motor, big battery system. If you are an experimenter, there are other options also.

All my opinion, your mileage will vary, etc.
 
The 2810 winding is not a bad thing at all. I have two rears and a front. And one rear 2812 for dirt riding.

Even on lame 48v 20 amps, the 2810 performs very well in every category except haul ass. Got the 2810 on my full suspension frankenlongtail bike. Perfect for me since I really only need to carry weight up 5% to get home from town. And 20 mph is fast enough on welding I did :lol: .
 
mr.electric, I love the stretch beach cruiser you put together. I've seen that frame a few places before, and it has the same posture as my full-suspension longtail (link in my sig). Its really nice having my feet flat on the ground when I come to a stop... Thanks for posting!
 
Not sure if this homemade long tail belongs here. But it sure is elegant and practical.
http://www.steves-workshop.co.uk/vehicles/cargobike/cargobikeindex.htm
bikefinished.jpg
 
SamTexas said:
Not sure if this homemade long tail belongs here. But it sure is elegant and practical.
http://www.steves-workshop.co.uk/vehicles/cargobike/cargobikeindex.htm
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Elegant for sure, but I'm not sold on the rear brake cable going through the carry platform as being totally practical? It might get damage in short order, if the bike is used as intended.
 
I did not notice that. But if they can do perform a surgery to elongate the bike, I'm sure they can take care of the brake too if someone pointed out the deficiency.
 
A much better bike to copy. No way the bike before that could be called elegant when it had the weight distribution all wrong.

Gary could use a week of removing the saddle in exchange for a pad on the front of the cargo platform and exchange the stem for a short one, but install it facing backwards. I say a week, because it takes some time to become accustomed to the bit of tiller in the steering to appreciate the advantages. It would be light in the nose for a front hubbie, but the wind cutting advantage of lowering the pilot by about a foot is tremendous. Getting your fart cutting butt out of the face of a loved one and arms around you instead of on handlbars is priceless. Imagine how many motorcycles would get sold in the configuration pictured...none. The only reason anyone gets on the back of that willingly is because they have no other choice. Come on people, THESE ARE NOT BICYCLES, THEY ARE EBIKES. Compromises necessary for bikes can be tossed out with the garbage.
 
John in CR said:
A much better bike to copy. No way the bike before that could be called elegant when it had the weight distribution all wrong.
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I was interpreting elegant to mean as in a piece of art. The brake cable through the platform renders it useless for much else. It forces any load to be carried too far back.
The placement of my battery on the rear rack has had enough negative effect on me to make me want to move it to the triangle. And I mostly ride straight ahead.
 
http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/2011/10/msc-truck-very-rideable-cargo-bike.html
Maderna (MSC) Truck. Not my style, but it sure looks tough. I do like the kickstand. Might be a solution for those of us with problems with normal ones. :)

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For serious cargo hauling, that looks like a great design Amberwolf. A person could do a small delivery business with a bike like that.
 
That low deck one would be good for even very heavy items. You could easily carry bags of cement on it. The one thing about a cargo bike, it needs to carry really heavy stuff lower. That's where my frankenbike needs improvement. I need to find the right found objects, to make my low pannier cargo racks.

On the other frankenbike, I thought it turned out very well, but I would have routed the cable different too. the cargo weight should come more forward as well I think. As far forward as possible.
 
Not to sound like an idiot, but I don't understand "cargo bikes"...I need some enlightenment as to their benefits. It doesn't seem like they can haul all that much, at any great speed, and at any great economic savings. I'm thinking along the lines of economies of scale to put things in context, in case I'm not being clear. Again, not trying to start a flame war, just interested in hearing what you guys actually use them for and your justification for it! :)
 
I use my Mundo for taking my son to the park, (near the beach).

We take loads of stuff, flying toys, throwing toys, base ball stuff, a small kids bike, skate board, scooter, long thin ice chest (for daddy's medicine) etc, etc.

For me, it is not about speed, it's about getting the stuff there.

Most people drive their cars to the park and bring 1 or 2 toys for there child. I bring enough for a bunch of kids to have a blast, one example, a collection of stomp rockets.
After I setup the stomp rockets, we will have a line of kids that want to try it, it's allot a fun to watch them.

Other times, I'll setup "T" Ball or fly some kites, or pull out a soccer ball, make hot dogs on a camp stove.........

Try doing this on a regular bike, near impossible...

Once again, it's not about speed, it's about carrying cargo
 
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