GNG, 1000W 48V BB-drive, $400

Hi Wishes

Although I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for even mentioning parallel charging, many peeps are way tooo paranoid.
Click to expand...
Ever had a fire? :shock: I had a coffee pot start my kitchen a blaze. :evil:

Two of my bricks were way out of balance at the first few charges. They are staying perfect now that I discharged them and re-balanced them a few more times. I would not be too keen on parallel charging new packs unless I had a few cycles on them to gauge how they were keeping balance. Not where I keep my stuff. Just too much to loose if something were to go wrong.

"And something always goes wrong".
Vincent+Gardenia+Moonstruck.PNG


Maybe if i had a fireproof tarp to throw over it.
 
speedmd said:
Hi Wishes

Although I'm sure I'm going to get flamed for even mentioning parallel charging, many peeps are way tooo paranoid.
Click to expand...
Ever had a fire? :shock: I had a coffee pot start my kitchen a blaze. :evil:

Two of my bricks were way out of balance at the first few charges. They are staying perfect now that I discharged them and re-balanced them a few more times. I would not be too keen on parallel charging new packs unless I had a few cycles on them to gauge how they were keeping balance. Not where I keep my stuff. Just too much to loose if something were to go wrong.

"And something always goes wrong".
Vincent+Gardenia+Moonstruck.PNG


Maybe if i had a fireproof tarp to throw over it.
Click to expand...

Anytime you are dealing with Lipo's you have to be careful. You should never charge your batteries unattended, parallel or single charging. If you follow that simple rule, you will avoid burning down your place. And yes, i charge my batteries in a fire proof box, or in a lipo charging pouch that is also fireproof. The idea is to be able to carry it outside should one of them catch fire. It happened to me once that a lipo started to smoke during a charge. I interrupted the charging, drop the battery in salt diluted water and let is discharge completely before i threw it out. People think Lipo's explode like a grenade. They do not.

Wishes
 
I've posted this before but its worth saying again, I am very happy with the Hyperion EOS 1420i net3, it will ballance charge 14 s - 20 amps and runs on 12 to 24 volts , in my opinion its worth the money. It does require a good power source for optimum performance. I've bought two from ALLERC, great service from those guys.
"D"
 
That bolt and washer look overpowered :!: What happened? You lose your original threads? :lol:
 
Tried a side hole first, but could not snug it up quite enough, without going to a custom strap and it was a bitch to assemble. Corner hole was a good quick solution and I can file off a bit more of it if I ever need more clamping force. Washer adds a bit of stress relief. Solves the twisting of the front end of the motor assembly much better than I expected. Only bad thing is that you need to match the diameter of the down tube, so a universal block is most likely not in the cards.
 
Question for gng builders,ive been trying to upload a pic of the frame i want to put a gng kit on... im using a felt bandit frame and the bottom bracket is well a bit different.im thinking i can mount inside the frame and flip components? make a block for frame dwntube space..if anyone has a few mins to google felt bandit bottom bracket pics and get some feedback before i grab one would be helpful.thanks mark.


now off to figure out mac pic downloads :oops:
 
Thanks rodgah,that will do it,but outta stock right now.im hopin i can get a gng inside the frame or fit some how in the frame bottom bracket.
 
You could use pipe clamps to grip the tube
Click to expand...

Hi rodgah

The pipe clamps are great on heavy steel tubes. Was a bit reluctant to use anything like them to clamp tightly on the soft aluminum down tube of the cdale. I may not keep the bike and did not want to mark it up if I could prevent that. You also need to shim / machine center block to match the opening between the tabs to prevent side motion. The simple nest for the down tube in the face of the block works much better than I expected it would with just a small amount of strap pressure. I see much improvement over the stock hose clamp to a flat face setup.
 
Take a look at this install - it has the GNG in the triangle.
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=51985

and the image that won't display (link to dropbox)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/etrz7p6r1upuz7m/20130722_235356.jpg
 
beast775 said:
outta stock right now
Click to expand...

actually I think the silver one is in stock.

speedmd said:
great on heavy steel tubes
Click to expand...

That was around a Aluminum Dh frame, didnt mark it where the clamps were, but yes correct you will need to space it with washers or tubes cut to size. Luckily for you most of the force involved is pushing the mount into the downtube, and a little bit of twisting, only the drives weight would be pulling on the clamp.
 
rodgah said:
Looks like a 1 piece crank set. You could get away with an adaptor like this......http://www.choppersus.com/store/product/836/Bottom-Bracket-Conv-Set-Black/
Click to expand...
I was thinking about using an adapter like this one on my frame with a spanish BB, but it looks like it's designed for the BB to screw into the recess and sit below the outer lip of the adapter. Might need LightningRods 73mm adjustable bottom bracket to make it all fit. Keep us updated on what you end up doing, I'd like to put a GNG kit on the other frame too :)
 
That was around a Aluminum Dh frame, didnt mark it where the clamps were, but yes correct you will need to space it with washers or tubes cut to size. Luckily for you most of the force involved is pushing the mount into the downtube, and a little bit of twisting, only the drives weight would be pulling on the clamp.
Click to expand...

No doubt, that having a bunch of the clamps as you pictured would nicely distribute forces, and I could also widen the strap if needed. What I did /pictured was less than one hours work total, as a experiment. I would have spent much more time than that just searching and driving around town for clamps. The thin steel pipe clamps still rely on the thin tabs to hold side force which are certain to flex / fatigue a bit. Having a solid nest, even if it were in glass filled plastic, closely fitting partly around the down tube and tightly sandwiched between the heavy gauge steel jack shaft bearing supports is killer. The stock lower steel motor to bb mount, with its one piece bent form/ connected center section takes most of the twist out in the lower section. Work very well together. Will use this concept again for certain.

cheers
 
Thanks christerljung

It is simple block but works wonders keeping the front end from moving to the right under power. Still have just a tad more slack developing in the secondary chain and the 13T freewheel has a habit of trying to unscrew its bearing retainer ring which also shows up as a loosening secondary. I tightened it for the second time and will need the acs tool (or make shift ) to take it off the hub and clean it, get some more permanent grease in it and loctite the ring without worry it will migrate where it should not go. Most likely I will need a rub block- chain guard on the secondary chain to get all the slack out as it stretches more than the #25 chain for certain. It is just a minor amount now and no where near loose enough to even think of coming derailed but not perfect. Now that I stabilized the front mounts movement, I will try a few different new secondary chains on it when time allows and see how they mate up with just the eccentric adjustment and go from there.

cheers
 
Hi Guys,

Question.
What is the most watts you put on the gng mid drive gen1?
I just did a ride with 18s1p and with a modded lyen 9 fet 50 amps. That's like 3500watt
How much can it handle? and how much the controller?
 
To explore its limits, it is highly advisable to use a chain on the primary reduction. That being said, the motor seems to shed heat well, and not suffer eddy-current losses at 30A continuous.

When it comes to temporary peak loads, the maximum amps seems to be limited by what will break next. As far as heat soaking because of high amps, I suggest installing a temp sensor on the motor and another on the controllers FET heat-sink. You can keep applying heat until the temps start rising rapidly, instead of shedding as fast as you apply it.
 
spinningmagnets said:
To explore its limits, it is highly advisable to use a chain on the primary reduction. That being said, the motor seems to shed heat well, and not suffer eddy-current losses at 30A continuous.

When it comes to temporary peak loads, the maximum amps seems to be limited by what will break next. As far as heat soaking because of high amps, I suggest installing a temp sensor on the motor and another on the controllers FET heat-sink. You can keep applying heat until the temps start rising rapidly, instead of shedding as fast as you apply it.
Click to expand...

I just did some test runs. I think the 9 fet conroller is holding up. It's getting hot but not that hot, that i can't put my hand on it. Engine the same story.
The only problem is de belt. Just destroyed one in 6 miles.
 
I wonder if a throttle tamer would help with the shredding belts.
Mine only start skipping when accelerating from low speed, rarely if I'm already moving along.

Perhaps damping that initial torque surge is all it needs to let them survive a bit longer.

... But a chain drives gets rid of consumable belts altogether.... That is hard to ignore.
 
Hi Secret1511

I just did some test runs. I think the 9 fet conroller is holding up. It's getting hot but not that hot, that i can't put my hand on it. Engine the same story.
Click to expand...

How are things in the low lands. You have me wondering what top speed I might get with 18s 2p and my 12/72 - 53 /12 - 700x32 setup. May be worth getting a few more bricks and a new controller.
With 12s 2p /stock controller/ soldered shunt, it gets to 36-38 mph (57 - 60 KlH) pretty consistently on the flats when I try to max it out. Nothing ever feels too warm.
 
The website "topsecretev.com" did a write-up on the GNG Gen-1. They kept the belted primary, but added a slipper-clutch similar to what recumpence was using on his very high-powered builds. I think the slip clutch (under $60?) is not a bad idea for a high-powered GNG, but I would still use a chain primary if I was using 48V instead of 36V. You only have to swap-in the chain once, so why not do it in the beginning? (or at least the first month after you get the rest running)

They call it a "torque limiter" and it is integrated into the large pulley of the primary reduction.

I don't know which make or model those guys are using, but here's a sample of generic torque limiter slipper clutches:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#torque-limiters/=nt0d35
https://sdp-si.com/eStore/CoverPg/Brakes.htm

http://topsecretev.com/blog.php?categories=mid drive slipper clutch
mid_drive_ebike_torque_limiter.jpg
 
Hi spinningmagnets

They call it a "torque limiter" and it is integrated into the large pulley of the primary reduction.
Click to expand...

Large pulley/sprocket on the primary side is where I would put the freewheel also if I did it over again. Frees one up for many more sprocket -ratios and chain selections on the secondary and much better at holding chain alignment. Would be nice if the two were both incorporated.
 
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