Grin Phaserunner Suite - Regen Settings

[SnowRocker88]

Hello all. I'm new to the forum (and to eBikes) so I apologize in advance if this has been covered. I have tried searching but I haven't really found a good answer to my question but I do feel like it's an easy one...

What does the "Regen Brake Speed Minimum" setting actually do? I haven't seen a Grin YouTube video that talks about it (or other actual Regen settings in the Phaserunner Suite software). I have changed it some and I can't discern what it is actually changing. I think I understand the "Regen Torque Engage Ramp" and "Regen Torque Release Ramp" just based on the Throttle versions of those two settings, but I can't for the life of me figure out what the Brake Speed Minimum is.

 

[Epithemeus]

Above that speed, trigger regen, you get regen. Below that speed, trigger regen, you get nothing. If you have regen on and you slow down below that speed, regen will stop. How you want to set it will be a combo of your motor and your personal preferences. All motors create less regen force at lower rpm but how much lower is dependent on things like motor winding, wheel size, etc.

 

[SnowRocker88]

Interesting. Maybe I'm getting tripped up by it being in kmh and not mph. That was what I assumed and bumped it up to test the theory and it seems like it still regen brakes all the way down to standstill (which feels rather aggressive). I'll do some more messing with it and see if I just need to set it higher or what.

Thanks for the quick reply!

 

[amberwolf]

The braking on the PR *increases* suddenly and dramatically below some certain speed; I don't know exactly what it is or if it is relative to some other parameter in a system.

I wish it did not do this, as it should be higher at faster speeds to decelerate more quickly.

You can decrease the Max Regen Phase Current, and ensure Enable Plug Braking is disabled (unchecked), to decrease the braking forces created during the higher-deceleration speed range (it shouldn't decrease them during the lower-deceleration speed range, since you shouldn't be hitting the max in those cases).


Since I want the braking down to zero, I have not tried to use the RBSMin setting, so I don't know if or how well it is honored, or if there are conditions to meet to honor it.

 

[Epithemeus]

One thing I just noticed while riding with my phaserunner. The cutoff only happens when I do backpedal regen. Not when I use the levers. Perhaps you are not noticing it working because you aren't using any form of proportional regen.

 

[SnowRocker88]

One thing I just noticed while riding with my phaserunner. The cutoff only happens when I do backpedal regen. Not when I use the levers. Perhaps you are not noticing it working because you aren't using any form of proportional regen.

Is there a write-up somewhere that walks through the Regen settings? I know of the setup where you use the throttle while braking to increase braking force, which I am not running, but how would I know what other ways I can configure the Regen settings?

 

[amberwolf]

Depends--are you using it with a cycle analyst or smartcable from grin? Or by itself?

I use a switching brake lever to trigger relays that tell the CA to switch to braking mode, but that lever actually pulls a cableoperated throttle that the relays switch to from the regular thorttle, so the brake lever controls braking force.

afaik the manual covers wiring up the *runner and configuring it to use a separate analog input for regen control from the throttle, so the complexity of the switching isn't needed, as long as you are not arleady using that second analog input for a torque sensor.

 

[SnowRocker88]

Depends--are you using it with a cycle analyst or smartcable from grin? Or by itself?

I use a switching brake lever to trigger relays that tell the CA to switch to braking mode, but that lever actually pulls a cableoperated throttle that the relays switch to from the regular thorttle, so the brake lever controls braking force.

afaik the manual covers wiring up the *runner and configuring it to use a separate analog input for regen control from the throttle, so the complexity of the switching isn't needed, as long as you are not arleady using that second analog input for a torque sensor.

I'm running a Phaserunner V6 L10 with a Superharness and Grin SW102 display. I bought a 3-pin hydraulic brake setup hoping it would output an analog signal but it appears to just go Lo/Hi on the voltage output. I also have a thumb throttle and an ERider T17 torque-sensing bottom bracket. Do I need to just source a true analog brake setup? I don't really mind it being digital as long as it makes some sense but, as you mentioned, it feels like it aggressively increases braking force at low speed which I'd love to be able to program out or figure out how to operate differently so that it doesn't do that or does it less.

 

[amberwolf]

I'm running a Phaserunner V6 L10 with a Superharness and Grin SW102 display. I bought a 3-pin hydraulic brake setup hoping it would output an analog signal but it appears to just go Lo/Hi on the voltage output. I also have a thumb throttle and an ERider T17 torque-sensing bottom bracket. Do I need to just source a true analog brake setup?

if you are using the ts i think that you then only have one analog input on the pr available, used for the throttle. so if you want an independent analog control for the brake you'll also need a systme like i used on my sb cruiser to switch between the throttle and the brake control, that also tells the pr yo'ure braking.

if the superharness has it's own analog brake input then you don't need that, but if it doesn't then you do. i've never used one so i don't know it's details.


tjhat said, there are many ways to make an analog brake control. cable-operated throttles, magnet on lever and hall sensor on body or an extneded bit of something, modifying an hwbs hidden wire brake sensor taking the digintal sensor out and putting analog one inside, using a regular th rottle on hte analog brake input, using digital brake lever swithc to trigger braking and control via your throttle, etc.

so, firs tdecide how you mehcanically wnat to interact with the brake control. what physical kind of control do you want, and how do you want it to do what it does for you, how do you want the braking action to happen?

with that, a system can be thought of to do that job, though it may require significant diy on your part to maek that happen.

I don't really mind it being digital as long as it makes some sense but, as you mentioned, it feels like it aggressively increases braking force at low speed which I'd love to be able to program out or figure out how to operate differently so that it doesn't do that or does it less.

If you don't have control over the braking force, and just use on/off control, then you're stuck with whatever the controller is designed / setup to do.

If there's a setting for the braking force (current) curve, I've yet to find it. :/ There are "advanced" settings but Grin provides no data on them. In one of my PR threads around here, there is at least a list of them, and some data someone else linked to, if you want to explore those. (I have not yet done so because everty8ing "works" and i don't want tos crew up anyting since it's my daily ride and only transportation until i someday get to build the new trike)

 

[SnowRocker88]

If the superharness has it's own analog brake input then you don't need that, but if it doesn't then you do. i've never used one so i don't know it's details.

So, this is the case from what I understand. It has a 4-pin brake covnnector and, as I understand it, it will convert an analog brake and throttle sensor into a single sweeping output voltage where 0v-0.85v is sent to the PR when you're using the brake and 1.10v-3.80v is sent when you're on the throttle. I could be mistaken but I'm pretty sure that's how they've settled it. I'm guessing, based off of the voltage I'm seeing in the diagnostic screen, that my "analog" signal is just digital.