Lessss
1 MW
deardancer3
"ALL cells read exactly 3.33v at end of ride"
aounds good, charge them and go....
"ALL cells read exactly 3.33v at end of ride"
aounds good, charge them and go....
Headway Group Purchase
- Thread starter julesa
- Start date
Ypedal
100 TW
the resting voltage won't tell you much with LFP cells.. even when fully discharged down to 2.1v cutoff under load, they will drift back to 3.x Volts once the load is removed very quickly.
dnmun
1 PW
connect the positive lead from your charger to the positive of the battery. connect the C- (charger negative) lead from the BMS to the charger negative wire.
can you post up pictures of your battery and BMS if you have the lego version?
can you post up pictures of your battery and BMS if you have the lego version?
Lessss
1 MW
Due to Joshuas delay in getting the batteries he has incurred a financial loss to the tune of 5 grand.
Could everyone that got a battery please send him a couple bucks to reduce the sting of that?
Could everyone that got a battery please send him a couple bucks to reduce the sting of that?
jimw1960
10 kW
deardancer3 said:
I'm guessing the problem is that they made your 24v battery with a 36v BMS. That would explain why there are two empty slots for FETs and also why the BMS cuts out as soon as any load is applied -- because the LVC is set to where a 36v battery should cut out, not where a 24v battery should cut out. Any thoughts on this theory? If true it should be a simple fix if you can figure out where the LVC circuit is getting its signal.
bikeelectric
100 W
Is it really critical to make sure that the first three runs of my 48 volt Headway pack are only used at about 30% of capacity to break in new cells ?
Larry
Larry
jimw1960
10 kW
So, after a few months, how is everyone's Headway batteries holding up? I'm planning to build a some packs this summer with headway cells and am anxious to hear some feedback on reliability and initial defect rates. From reading this thread, it looks like at least one person had to send a couple of cells and a BMS back and someone else had a bad charger. Anyone else had any problems? I'm sure the folks in on the current group buy would like to hear some reliability stats as well.
bikeelectric
100 W
I have been running my 48 volt 10 ah pack with a ebikekit nine continent rear motor and it has been working fine. I don't have any meters to watch the volts or amps but have been watching the cumulated input kw hours with a P3 Kilawatt meter. It takes about .15 to .19 kwh input 120v to charge it back to full after about a 6 mile ride. The longest ride I have done was about 15 to 20 miles and peddled some but never ran out of battery. That took .54 kwh input. I know the six miles I do with no peddling if it was .15 kwh would be 150 watts input.
I am planning on getting a cycle analyst at some point so I can know what is going on but for now just riding wise it all works great - batteries and bms.
Larry
I am planning on getting a cycle analyst at some point so I can know what is going on but for now just riding wise it all works great - batteries and bms.
Larry
jimw1960 said:
mrgarci1
100 W
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2008
- Messages
- 239
Didn't participate in the group buy, but got my pack around the same time direct from Victoria. My pack is holding up well, after having a problem with the BMS (partially my fault, partially due to a loose sense wire that was disconnected inside the pack - lucky I opened it or I would have killed those cells!). I rec'd a new BMS in a very timely fashion after contacting Victoria. I have yet to get a working charger from Headway (they've sent me two and neither works), so I've been using an SLA charger and am planning to buy a third-party charger. The pack seems to be holding up well, however, and all things considered, I'd buy from Headway again.
Kurt
10 kW
my pack wasn't part of the group buy. I did have a short in my bms and that was the only reason for the two dead cells. I wouldn't be to concerned about it as I am almost certain its a isolated insentient.They sent me a new model BMS and two new cells. They were very professional about it and very fast to respond with the replacements and back up there product.
I have purchased two more headway packs and all 3 of them are performing great and giving out full capacity.I am looking forward to there new cells and how they perform.
Kurt.
I have purchased two more headway packs and all 3 of them are performing great and giving out full capacity.I am looking forward to there new cells and how they perform.
Kurt.
Lessss
1 MW
Well at least you got your batteries.
5 of the 6 Canadians still haven't got their's. There has been one refund apparently.
I talked to Victoria, JG hasn't even sent in the order to Headway yet. Likely cause JG doesn't have the money to pay for it. It seems JG's unilateral decision to split off the Canadian order and his unilateral decision to delay the order till after winter have bit us(the Canadians) on the ass. Essentially we Canadians paid for the Americans to get their batteries due to the CDN to USD monetary conversion due to Paypal putting the cash into JG account in CDN funds. JG doesn't have an income generating job and doesn't file taxes. This is the reason JG has gone silent or he sends an obscure mesage about we'll know after next week or the next distributorship deal, or after next week or after he sells a few more motor kits, or next week or after the next deal or next week or after the next.......
5 of the 6 Canadians still haven't got their's. There has been one refund apparently.
I talked to Victoria, JG hasn't even sent in the order to Headway yet. Likely cause JG doesn't have the money to pay for it. It seems JG's unilateral decision to split off the Canadian order and his unilateral decision to delay the order till after winter have bit us(the Canadians) on the ass. Essentially we Canadians paid for the Americans to get their batteries due to the CDN to USD monetary conversion due to Paypal putting the cash into JG account in CDN funds. JG doesn't have an income generating job and doesn't file taxes. This is the reason JG has gone silent or he sends an obscure mesage about we'll know after next week or the next distributorship deal, or after next week or after he sells a few more motor kits, or next week or after the next deal or next week or after the next.......
dnmun
1 PW
JG, can you explain the problem you had with the second charger? is it the same case or manufacturer? this has gotta have been more common if you got 2 bad ones.
mrgarci1
100 W
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2008
- Messages
- 239
I think I need to clear something up - Dennis, not sure where you got JG for me (although I did appropriate Jerry's name for my flickr page - maybe that's it), but if you're referring to me, MG are my initials (my name is Mike). So the JG that Lessss is referring to is not me - I had nothing to do with this group buy (other than purchasing at a similar time and receiving a similar pack).
I have yet to fully test the second charger, but it appears identical to the first in every way. I'm waiting on some more Anderson connectors, so I haven't tested whether it pushes voltage when a battery is connected, but it does not show any voltage with my multimeter when it is plugged into a 220v outlet, and this one has only been connected to 220v, never 110 (unlike the first one, which I mistakenly plugged into 110 before reading it).
Once I get the connectors and determine for sure that it does not work, I'll send one of the two up to you, Dennis, and maybe you could help troubleshoot. Alternately, you could prove once and for all that I'm doing something wrong here
and that the chargers are not defective.
I have yet to fully test the second charger, but it appears identical to the first in every way. I'm waiting on some more Anderson connectors, so I haven't tested whether it pushes voltage when a battery is connected, but it does not show any voltage with my multimeter when it is plugged into a 220v outlet, and this one has only been connected to 220v, never 110 (unlike the first one, which I mistakenly plugged into 110 before reading it).
Once I get the connectors and determine for sure that it does not work, I'll send one of the two up to you, Dennis, and maybe you could help troubleshoot. Alternately, you could prove once and for all that I'm doing something wrong here
and that the chargers are not defective.dnmun
1 PW
are you sure it is supposed to plug into 240V?
Lessss
1 MW
JG is the gropup buy organiser Joshua Goldberg.
dnmun
1 PW
mg is jg, or jg is mg, not jerry garcia. i think i got it. but you were right.
however i seriously wonder about this 220 label. does it have the regular duplex prongs? with no external switch that say 120-240V? this could be part of the problem. we need to see where the input wires go and compare the transformers with one we know works on 120V.
most UL electrically specified parts are 240V rated, but used at 120V, that could be the screw up.
but the wires going fromt he plug and to the transformer will help explain it if we can see pictures of the 2 different chargers.
however i seriously wonder about this 220 label. does it have the regular duplex prongs? with no external switch that say 120-240V? this could be part of the problem. we need to see where the input wires go and compare the transformers with one we know works on 120V.
most UL electrically specified parts are 240V rated, but used at 120V, that could be the screw up.
but the wires going fromt he plug and to the transformer will help explain it if we can see pictures of the 2 different chargers.
jimw1960
10 kW
Seems a lot of the cheap chinese chargers come with the 220v label and don't work. For example: http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=10133&start=0#p156093
In theory, it should not matter as long as the input RMS AC voltage is greater than the DC voltage you need to create from what comes out the bridge rectifier. Mike, does your charge also say 50 hz on the label? I'm wondering if it could matter that we are on a 60 hz system here in the US.
In theory, it should not matter as long as the input RMS AC voltage is greater than the DC voltage you need to create from what comes out the bridge rectifier. Mike, does your charge also say 50 hz on the label? I'm wondering if it could matter that we are on a 60 hz system here in the US.
Lessss
1 MW
Try a 220 converter. It may ONLy work at 220.
Airjnke
1 mW
- Joined
- Apr 26, 2009
- Messages
- 11
jimw1960 said:
Howdy folks;
Although I have been lurking on this group for several years, this is my first post. I really could use some help. I imagine most of you already know this story but I’ll tell it again.
I bought two 36v 20ah packs with the Headway group buy. The deal as it was finally worked out was that these things were to be pretty much a “plug & play‘ unit. The guy in the U.S. that got all the packs from China & shipped them out to everyone was gonna be the US distributor & set up a “Care & feeding of Headway packs†tech support group here on E-S & answer any & all questions. The cells were suppose to be in a nice case with an on-off switch, external jacks, a fuse, & all kinds of neato nifty stuff. Just plug it in for a charge & ride with a range I’ve never dreamed of.
However, the group buy has turned unto the most expensive nightmare I’ve ever known. Looking back, I probably should have known better than to get involved (never buy the A model of anything) but I just hoped I could trust the guy that ran the thing to get it done right. Slinging mud isn’t gonna get my packs up & running & he claims to have lost quite a bit on the deal & not even got a pack for his troubles. Still, none of us got the cases we paid for & as far as I know everyone had to complete the packs on their own. Except for this group, there’s been no real tech support. Several already have had failed cells & BMS & have no idea if Headway will replace anything. The Canada buyers haven’t even got theirs after almost a year. I’m happy at least I got the packs I paid for.
So to try & turn this blues tune around, from what I’ve read here on E-S it seems like many of the people that got into it are electrical engineer types. Although I’ve built a few hub powered trikes & I’m pretty good with a wrench, I’m just not an E.E. & my packs are sitting in the spare bedroom waiting to be used. I sure would appreciate it if someone walk me through the initial hook up so I can start using them. As you can see from the pics, on my packs there are two cable sets, the negative side is all soldered together but there are two separate positive wires. Do I need to trace the positive side back to the BMS & separate them for charge/discharge? Can a regular ol’ wrench monkey like myself actually get these up & running or am I just kinda SOL?
Thanks for the help;
Dave
http://www.flickr.com/photos/airjnke/
dnmun
1 PW
did you measure the voltage yet? have the packs ever been charged since they were manufactured last year? has the BMS been plugged in all this time?
why do you need an EE?
why do you need an EE?
jimw1960
10 kW
Dave,
No EE degree needed if you can solder and use a voltmeter. Basically, you just need to make some connectors and find a plastic box to put the unit into, or fab your own box out of wood, fiberglass, or plastic. For the two red wires, one goes to power out positive (the fat one), one goes to charger positive the thin one. Power out negative and charger negative can both go to the black wires that are all soldered together. Do you have a voltmeter so you can tell which is your charger positive and negative? Lot's of folks like to use Anderson Power Poles for connectors since they are pretty reliable. If you don't have the mating connector for that charger output, just cut it off and solder on some power poles (or whatever connector you choose). You probably want to make sure that battery gets charged pretty soon as overdischarge can kill a LiFePO4 battery. Feel free to PM if you need more help.
--Jim
No EE degree needed if you can solder and use a voltmeter. Basically, you just need to make some connectors and find a plastic box to put the unit into, or fab your own box out of wood, fiberglass, or plastic. For the two red wires, one goes to power out positive (the fat one), one goes to charger positive the thin one. Power out negative and charger negative can both go to the black wires that are all soldered together. Do you have a voltmeter so you can tell which is your charger positive and negative? Lot's of folks like to use Anderson Power Poles for connectors since they are pretty reliable. If you don't have the mating connector for that charger output, just cut it off and solder on some power poles (or whatever connector you choose). You probably want to make sure that battery gets charged pretty soon as overdischarge can kill a LiFePO4 battery. Feel free to PM if you need more help.
--Jim
This is my first post, and I think my 24V 20A Headway battery, purchased through the group buy, is good. The 24V 2A charger that came with it maybe isn't working right. I have a Watts Up meter giving the info, and my ride is a Tange Prestige tubed mtn. bike with a Cyclone 360W motor kit.
The first ride,, using the fully charged battery (29.3 off the charger), was April 26 and I used 5.1Ah. I put it on the charger and after 24 hrs. the meter showed total input of 0.5Ah doled out at a rate of 0.01-0.04Ah. Charging voltage did not rise above 27V. The second ride, yesterday, with 26.66V to start showed use of 9.76Ah, and the red light showing on the Cyclone throttle on the last hill. Voltage after 1/2 hr. rest was 25.91. It has been on the charger for the past 24 hrs. and now shows 25.91V (the same as at the end of yesterday's ride) and 0.511Ah of input. Something is amiss I think. I've used nearly 15Ah between the two rides, and the charger has restored about 1Ah in 48 hrs. of total charge time. At first the connecting plates were barely warm wth the charger charging, but they cooled within 1/2 hr. When I plug it in and connect to the battery, the charger LED flashes 3 times then shows nothing. When I first put the battery on the charger before the first run, the green LED stayed on when the battery had 29.3V. Maybe I have gotten the connecting sequence, of the charger to the wall and the charger to the battery, wrong? Is it possible that the BMS is equalizing the cells before bringing the battery voltage up, and it needs more time?
Charger model: WL-073-02CA
DC 24V 2A
100-240V~50/60Hz 75W
3.2V - 3.6V
I've cross-posted this to JG's Group Buy and the Power Assist lists.
Dana
The first ride,, using the fully charged battery (29.3 off the charger), was April 26 and I used 5.1Ah. I put it on the charger and after 24 hrs. the meter showed total input of 0.5Ah doled out at a rate of 0.01-0.04Ah. Charging voltage did not rise above 27V. The second ride, yesterday, with 26.66V to start showed use of 9.76Ah, and the red light showing on the Cyclone throttle on the last hill. Voltage after 1/2 hr. rest was 25.91. It has been on the charger for the past 24 hrs. and now shows 25.91V (the same as at the end of yesterday's ride) and 0.511Ah of input. Something is amiss I think. I've used nearly 15Ah between the two rides, and the charger has restored about 1Ah in 48 hrs. of total charge time. At first the connecting plates were barely warm wth the charger charging, but they cooled within 1/2 hr. When I plug it in and connect to the battery, the charger LED flashes 3 times then shows nothing. When I first put the battery on the charger before the first run, the green LED stayed on when the battery had 29.3V. Maybe I have gotten the connecting sequence, of the charger to the wall and the charger to the battery, wrong? Is it possible that the BMS is equalizing the cells before bringing the battery voltage up, and it needs more time?
Charger model: WL-073-02CA
DC 24V 2A
100-240V~50/60Hz 75W
3.2V - 3.6V
I've cross-posted this to JG's Group Buy and the Power Assist lists.
Dana
