Is the twist throttle offer better control than thumb?

[Offroader]

My favorite throttles of all have been thumb throttles with a small piece of pvc pipe glued on to them, converting them to half twist.

Then I have both thumb and half twist in one throttle.

The problem I have with thumb throttles has been that I hit bumps while holding the throttle wide open. This results in me breaking off the thumb lever. So now I have a few half twist throttles, with the thumb lever gone.

I get lots of control with half twist throttles riding challenging trails. But if your favorite brake is on the right, move it to the left. Then you can work your primary brake with the left hand, and the throttle with the right.

I don't understand how you break thumb throttles going over bumps. Your hand should stay stationary on the handlebar.

When hitting a bump your hand shouldn't move from that stationary position on the handlebar and the your thumb shouldn't move at all.

How are you breaking the thumb throttles? Is your whole hand moving on the handlebars?

 

[crea2k]

Im guessing he is being thrown forward on the bumps and his thumb is ramming the thumb throttle forward at a guess.

 

[adriftatsea]

I've also contemplated spraying it with lithium grease ...

Spray it with Lithium grease. best thing I did to remove the sticky throttle issues....

Thanks Raged! You were right, it worked great! No more sticking throttle and (more importantly) renewed confidence in my bike. Many thanks.

Mulling it over more, I suspect the years of twiddling thumbsticks in videogames have something to do with a thumb throttle preference.

 

[MadRhino]

...
Mulling it over more, I suspect the years of twiddling thumbsticks in videogames have something to do with a thumb throttle preference.

Ha ha !
I had forgotten how much training the thumbs of today's kids have had

We are many with high performance bikes here, and all of us but one are using half twist throttle. Now that you make me think about it, the one using a thumb is a video game enthusiast. :wink:

 

[Punx0r]

I've always used a thumb throttle and meant to "upgrade" to a half twist at some point. Reading this thread has made me re-consider. Thinking about it now, I think the suggestion of modifying a thumb throttle into a hybrid thumb/half-twist may be best. The only disadvantage of the thumb throttle is an aching thumb when travelling long distances at steady throttle.

 

[amberwolf]

Well, CrazyBike2 isn't exactly high performance even at up to ~4Kw of power, but I use thumb throttles on it (front on right and rear on left for separate control of the motors), and I'd continue to do so even if I got more power into it. And I'm definitely not a gamer in any fashion (or raised as one)--so if it ever happens, you'll have to raise that to two, with 50/50 on the reason why.


As far as aching on long trips, you can easily make a cruise control by twisting your grip up against the edge fo the throttle. Keep it moutned so it's reallyclose already, even touching it, but not puttin gpressure against it. Then just a little wiggle on the grip and now it's got enogh pressure for cruise. Or install an actual cruise control, or set it up on your controller or Cycle Analyst.


If you have two motors and independent controls like mine, you can also just switch off between them if you need to (my hands randomly go numb anyway, no matter what I'm doing, so I have to do that even without any discomfort). Same is true if you have a single throttle to control both, you can put one on each side and wire essentially in parallel (may require additional components).


Another possibiliyt is that the throttle body may need to be rotated around the grip to get it to be most comfortable for you in your most commonly used position, though this could make it harder to use in some other postions without shifting yoru hand around a little.

 

[Offroader]

Another possibiliyt is that the throttle body may need to be rotated around the grip to get it to be most comfortable for you in your most commonly used position, though this could make it harder to use in some other postions without shifting yoru hand around a little.

This is very important and needs to be adjusted. For best comfort it should be adjusted just right. I believe when I am at full throttle my thumb is facing forward or almost in the same direction as my other fingers. This also allows for the best handlebar grip as your thumb is wrapped more around the grips.

I think thumb fatigue eventually goes away if you work though it anyway. I think if the pain isn't going away after a week or so, it's probably psychological because your thinking about it too much.

 

[MadRhino]

...The only disadvantage of the thumb throttle is an aching thumb when travelling long distances at steady throttle.

For me, the major problem with thumb throttle is that it can make throttle control very twitchy with a high power bike riding mountain trails.

 

[mjoets]

I used a thumb throttle. I view them as a hazard. If you inadvertently push it and the bike lifts up the front wheel then this can cause one to apply more pressure to the throttle lever, sort of a vicious cycle. I happened to me and I was bucked off the bike. One wrist surgery later I'm finally on the mend. First order of business was to order a left hand twist throttle from Lectric Cycle.

 

[amberwolf]

Interesting. With my thumb throttles, they rotate in the opposite direction of any bar rotation from a wheelie (though my bike is so long/heavy it doesn't do wheelies). So they can't cause that kind of positive feedback problem.

Should be the same with a twist or other type of throttle, too, though I don't use those.

 

[BVH]

Having ridden an E+ since 2009, I am already considering changing the twist throttle on my new Prodeco Oasis to a thumb throttle after only two, 35 mile rides.

 

[Offroader]

...The only disadvantage of the thumb throttle is an aching thumb when travelling long distances at steady throttle.

For me, the major problem with thumb throttle is that it can make throttle control very twitchy with a high power bike riding mountain trails.

The Max-E smooths out the throttle to make it much more controllable. You actually slide the throttle a few times during a calibration stage and it somehow calibrates it to be very linear.

It wasn't much of an issue before the max-e, but the Max-E made it a lot smoother and more controllable at low speeds.

I used a thumb throttle. I view them as a hazard. If you inadvertently push it and the bike lifts up the front wheel then this can cause one to apply more pressure to the throttle lever, sort of a vicious cycle. I happened to me and I was bucked off the bike. One wrist surgery later I'm finally on the mend. First order of business was to order a left hand twist throttle from Lectric Cycle.

I just don't see how this can happen and how people break thumb throttles. When your hand is grasping the handlebar it is basically locked into position and your thumb is locked into position also. I drive over nasty off-road stuff all day and nothing makes my thumb move or bump the throttle. My hand moves exactly how the handlebar moves.

The only thing I can think of is you are not gripping the handlebar properly while using the thumb throttle, possibly your thumb throttle isn't in the right position and your thumb is held up too high. Maybe your fingers are all wide opened, I don't know.

I would think that a twist throttle is much more likely to get accidently twisted.

 

[biohazardman]

I have thousands of miles on both thumb and twist throttles. If you ever have to grip your bike tightly in a mishap to keep control it’s easy to throttle up with a twist throttle it kind of depends on the angle your wrist is at when you need to hang on. Thumb throttle gets old and tires the thumb after 20+ minutes of riding for me with a missed up hand. Either werqs well as a remote throttle with the Shimano trigger shifter controlling it. Speeds the throttle locks on can be adjusted and there are two seperate speeds to set one slow one fast. So now I don’t have to hang on to the throttle constantly. I do however need to remember to use my trigger finger to release the throttle when needed or touch my right brake handle as it is hooked to my motor cutoff switch. I love this system it only took part of a day to burn in the muscle memory so I don't have to think about it any more. No problems in 10+K miles with this system other than my rubber band throttle return spring broke recently so the bike would not go once I let off of the throttle until I figured it out. Oh, and I rushed into testing the build before I had the motor cutoff on my brake handle and almost ran over a cop.

 

[Offroader]

I've been using a full twist throttle on an gas scooter the last few days. I can't really say how similar the throttle would be compared to a ebike twist throttle but I assume they would be similar enough.

The thumb throttle is by far better for an ebike for optimal handling, braking, and safety.

I don't like when I twist the twist throttle it puts my hand/wrist in a bent down position. This doesn't allow me to access the brakes quickly and doesn't allow me to cover them. It also doesn't give me a good grip on the handlebars while my wrist is bent to give throttle.

The other big thing is with my ebike I am always lifting up on the handlebars to lift the front of the bike while giving the bike full throttle. The twist throttle doesn't allow me to do this easily. You see on a motorcycle or dirtbike, you just rev the throttle to lift the front up and you don't have to actually lift it because it is too heavy, with a low powered lite ebike you have to lift up hard on the handlebars to lift the front up.

The other issues is safety, when I am riding fast I don't have the brakes covered with my finger. I find myself using just the rear brakes in emergency stops. This is very bad for safety and also for confidence when pushing the bike hard. Because the thumb throttle allows me to cover the brakes, I have instant braking all the time.

The other safety issue I find is that I accidently twist the twist throttle and give power when I don't want to. Like when moving the bike at low speeds or parking it, or starting it up sometimes. I almost twice had mishaps because of this in a few days. I never had any issues with the thumb. Of course if you are super safe you may not have issues, but it is much easier to have screw ups with the twist.

Like I expected, the thumb is a much better option for optimal performance, at the expense of some comfort (debatable). With the thumb throttle I have a firm grip on the handlebars at all times, precise throttle control at all times, and also have the brakes covered all at the same time. It can't really get any better than that.

It just surprises me that almost all high end ebike riders use twist. I'm also glad that my first ebike kit had a thumb throttle or I may have never used or considered the thumb throttle.

 

[crea2k]

You're holding the throttle wrong , to have the correct neutral position when riding when under throttle you need to grab the throttle with your wrist bent forwards, so that when you are riding under throttle your wrist is straight. If you grab the throttle with your wrist straight and twist back your wrist is bend backwards for the whole ride and this seriously screws your wrist up after a while, I learnt the hard way when dirtbike riding when I broke my wrist, as the bar spun back and knocked my wrist back and broke both bones, if I had been holding it properly my wrist would have bent the normal way your wrist bends and I wouldn't have had a problem. What im trying to say is dont just grab the throttle, bent your wrist in the downward position, then grab it, so that when you twist back, your wrist should be straight, if you grab it straight and twist back after a long ride you can hardly feel your hand as it starts to cut the circulation off eventually.

 

[Voltron]

I'm on a medium power setup, with no right shifter, and my commute is long with lots of steady speed sections, and tried all the throttles. They all got irritating after 15 minutes or so, holding a steady speed is a different ache then the constantly changing throttle off-road, so ended up with a thumb type, and a carefully selected rubbery not foamy right grip, that is just barely loose enough to slide against the throttle, but tight enough to never slip during riding. Bam! Instant cruise control. And you can just slide it loose for letting friend ride so it's not on sticky mode....it's rotated way down, father than you would want for holding your thumb there, but you don't need to hold your thumb there, and it gets the paddle up there for the index finger to push it off. Check my video posts for some no hands multi mile riding...they really show the benefit of cruise control for commuting...

 

[crea2k]

What happens if you need to stop in a hurry, wouldnt your throttle be on full power when braking ?.

 

[Voltron]

YES...it is! It would be a totally unsafe setup for any novice rider. My finger is trained to snap that thing down by now, and I'm just not on the brakes much on my mostly deserted, few traffic crossing route to work, and if I want to, it's simple to just slide the grip mid ride and unstick it. That would be easily alleviated of course by cutoff brake levers...except I'm using a scooter controller, so it only has full electric braking inputs, not just regular cutoffs like a bicycle controller.

 

[Alan B]

I don't know all the history, but all the motorcycles and mopeds I've ever ridden had twist throttles, and the quads have had thumb throttles. Twist throttles seem to work for commuting, racing, trials, etc, with bikes that have a hundred or more horsepower.

The thumb is a fairly fragile element with muscles that are easily damaged or tired. Riding a quad for hours with a thumb throttle was hard on the thumb and required some changes to the mounting angles to reduce the strain.

Twist throttles can be problematic if the wrist is held at a poor angle, proper technique avoids this problem.

You can learn how to make any of them work. Whatever you learned first may have a long term effect on what you think is best.

The ebikes I have built have had thumb or twist throttles.

A kill switch right next to the throttle insures that the ebike can be turned off, it is dangerous to leave it always energized. Kill switches should be on all machines, like a safety on a firearm. Don't enable the ebike until you are ready to shoot and have it aimed in a safe direction.

The precision of either twist or thumb is mostly a learned technique. Avoiding positive feedback when the front wheel is coming up must be learned, set up your system for lower power until you get extremely familiar with how the controls operate.

As far as I've seen, the really high power "bikes" seem to all have twist throttles, such as Hyabusa, etc. The majority of folks with bike experience have learned a twist throttle.

I'm currently using a twist throttle for motor power and a thumb throttle for regenerative braking force. The twist throttle is excellent (especially with a torque throttle controller, this changes everything). The thumb "ebrake" took a little getting used to but it works okay. I plan to make a brake lever to control regen and retire the thumb throttle however for better ergonomics and more natural operation.

As far as I've experienced, the twist throttle is best and the thumb throttle is okay. But I put a lot of miles on a 50 horsepower motorcycle twist throttle before I learned a thumb throttle, so that probably colors the result.

If you want to be able to hop on an e-motorcycle and already have the proper muscle memory you should configure your ebike the same way. The Zero electric motorcycle I drove was totally natural and similar to my ebike (except the weight and speed were tripled ).

Your mileage may vary.

 

[alfantastic]

A kill switch right next to the throttle insures that the ebike can be turned off, it is dangerous to leave it always energized. Kill switches should be on all machines, like a safety on a firearm. Don't enable the ebike until you are ready to shoot and have it aimed in a safe direction.

Excellent advice Alan, especially the last sentence. I'm sure many riders have had little mishaps involving unintentional operation of the throttle whilst dismounted

 

[Voltron]

Just to be clear...STUCK ON THROTTLES ARE A BAD IDEA....unless you have cutoff levers! And a power switch right at your other thumb (that I do have). And you don't ride it traffic much. Or unless you're a hyper alert mileage monkey that is on your ride so much it's an unstoppable reflex...I poke my finger out there on everybody else's bike now every time I hit the brakes. But you can't really use the PAS or the throttle when you like to ride the straightaways no hands standing up on the pedals sooooo.....

 

[Offroader]

crea2k, good point about the twist, I checked how I was holding the twist throttle and I actually grab it naturally like you say to make sure my wrist is straight.

Alan b, I understand where you are coming from. However, for optimal control you can't beat a thumb throttle in my opinion. The thumb pain is debatable because I had it in the beginning and it went away completely. I have rode for hours each day, and sometimes 4 hours each day without any pain.

The reason why a thumb throttle offers optimal control is because of the following reasons.

1) With a thumb throttle you can cover the brakes 100% of the time through the whole throttle movement. You can also apply brakes while holding any throttle location. This is huge because it allows a high degree of safety and confidence knowing you have instant braking.

With a twist, when you twist to 1/2 to full throttle you can't cover the brakes.

2) You can lift the handlebars (and therefore the front of the bike up) while covering the brakes and during any throttle location including full throttle. This is so huge with an ebike because when you're coming up to a lot of obstacles, be it a curb, log, huge rock, you can full throttle the bike while lifting the front up, and also covering the brakes.

For these two reasons alone a thumb throttle surpasses a twist throttle on an ebike. It just simply allows a more control. These are very important for riding at max capability. I'll do 40MPH+ down a single track and you can bet I wouldn't want to do that without covering the brakes. I also am constantly lifting the handlebars on my bike while giving full throttle to ride over things, something I couldn't do well with a twist.

Most people don't ride to maximum capability so they just want comfort or what they are used to. I'm currently using a twist throttle right now on a gas scooter and can clearly see the limitations.

I'm open to debate If you disagree, but please let me know one advantage of a twist when it comes to controllability over a thumb?

 

[crea2k]

Motorbikes go more than 40mph though and they have twist throttles, with mine on technical bits I can hold the throttle with my thumb and first finger and still cover the brakes, but if you think about it, there must be a way of doing wheelies etc and covering the throttle and brakes as trial bike and motocross riders do it all the time.

 

[Offroader]

Motorbikes go more than 40mph though and they have twist throttles, with mine on technical bits I can hold the throttle with my thumb and first finger and still cover the brakes, but if you think about it, there must be a way of doing wheelies etc and covering the throttle and brakes as trial bike and motocross riders do it all the time.

I am not sure, I've been doing a lot of paying attention to the twist throttle on my scooter. The big advantage of a twist is that it is like instant cruise control, something which is probably more important on a motorcycle than an ebike.

With wheelies I don't see how you would need the front brakes, you just twist the throttle and use the clutch to get up, the rear brake is on the right foot pedal.

Overall, I find the thumb gives me more control and much better for an ebike where you have to lift the front up all the time.

I think I read some trials bikers actually installed thumb throttles, I have to see if I can pull information up about this and the reasons why. For the type of slow riding technical stuff they do they need ultimate throttle control and I bet that is the reason they installed the thumb throttle.

Just wanted to point out that I don't want to insult people here who use the twist throttle, I'm just trying to debate the pros and cons. So far it seems the thumb offers more precise control with the drawback of comfort and easy cruise control. For most people comfort is the better choice, but for people who push their bike to the edge and more then you're better off using the thumb for safety and more precise control. That is just my opinion so far.

 

[Thud]

is your front brake on the left.
On motorcycles the front(most important one if your serious about technical riding) is on the right along with the throttle.

Look at any photo in an off road magazine of a rider exploding out of a berm & you will notice he has at least one finger still resting on the front brake lever. A twist grip will allow you to do that most efficiently. Top pros train to hold on with the thumb, ring & little finger. the index & middle finger are for extrainious controls.

& yes....often brakes & throttle are used simultaneously in the most technical riding scenarios.
For me its a twist every time.