Ktronik's "The Blinder" LED Tail Light Project

liveforphysics said:
Make sure your solder doesn't say "lead free" on it... If it does, chuck it in the garbage and go get some real solder. It will be the best thing you ever did towards making reliable electronics.

I have some pure indium I use to solder LEDs sometimes. It's lead-free and works very well-- better thermal and electrical conductivity than lead solder. It melts at about 150 degrees lower than lead solder, too. And it seems to be non-toxic.

Too bad there's not enough indium for everybody to use it, or even for me to use it whenever I like.

Chalo
 
I found this fairly inexpensive DC-DC converter that is tiny and seems spec-wise, to be a good match for any system 60V or under. It provides 5V of output and can be had for $5.75 a piece.

Ktronik, tell me if this would be a good match for your Blinder? It's the National Semi "Simple Switcher" DC-DC Regulator. LM2576. There's also a high voltage version which is for input of up to 60V. LM2576hv

http://www.national.com/ds/LM/LM2576.pdf

http://www.newark.com/jsp/search/productdetail.jsp?SKU=41K3671&CMP=AFC-GB100000001

Ambrose
 
ambroseliao said:
I found this fairly inexpensive DC-DC converter that is tiny and seems spec-wise, to be a good match for any system 60V or under. It provides 5V of output and can be had for $5.75 a piece.

Ktronik, tell me if this would be a good match for your Blinder? It's the National Semi "Simple Switcher" DC-DC Regulator. LM2576. There's also a high voltage version which is for input of up to 60V. LM2576hv

http://www.national.com/ds/LM/LM2576.pdf

http://www.newark.com/jsp/search/productdetail.jsp?SKU=41K3671&CMP=AFC-GB100000001

Ambrose

Should work, but will all due respect, if you had a hard time building the blinder, how you gunna build that, if you only buy the chip...its more of the SMT stuff that you love... :D

the path of least resistance is to just buy a single lithium cell, drive it from that & be done with it...

Can't you just hook up a 'cell phone' charger... worth a test...

K
 
OK, I can take a hint! :?

I know it's tiny, but the legs stick out so I thought I could just kind of move them apart and solder to them directly.

The reason I want to go with a DC-DC regulator/converter is to eliminate another battery that I have to keep charged. Right now, I have two lights on my helmet and a tail light which need batteries replaced regularly, I have the Magicshine headlight that needs to be recharged every other day. I wanted to mount your Blinder to my rear pack in place of the tail light and just power it from my bike's battery instead of another battery that needs recharging. I'm just trying to make life simpler! :|

Ambrose
 
If you want to eliminate the battery, go to your local thrift stores or freecycle.org lists or craigslist, and find really cheap or free celphone AC adapter chargers. I

Since your main pack is 72V (or 36V) according to your signature, then it will run most of the ones I've tried so far. I've found that virtually all of the little 115V AC input / 4V to 6V DC output celphone chargers I have laying around here will turn on and run at their regulated levels at 48-50V DC, and most of them will go down to 34V. Some will go down as low as 23-24V before they either just turn off or regulation becomes problematic.

They draw more current at lower input voltages to get the same regulated output voltage/current, but they still work.

For the ones that are above the safe input levels of your LED power boards, just put a high-current diode or two in series to drop it a bit. If you have an old computer power supply laying around, there are probably several bare diodes in there with largish black plastic bodies; usually on the AC input end. Paralleling at least a couple of them would almost certainly work even without knowing their specs.

If you have any old CRT TVs or monitors around that don't work, there's a good chance the heatsinked high-voltage/high-current diode(s) near the big transformer in the (usually left) rear corner will work for this, too. Just remove the whole heatsink and diode from the board and use it as-is.

EDIT (ADDED): FWIW, I've tried working with SMT parts that appear to have enough leg to deal with, and even with my tiny tip for the iron, and even some other things I've come up with like clamping a needle into the iron instead, still don't let my shaky hands solder well enough to them without damaging things, especially without a PCB to just connect traces to. "Dead bug" style with SMT is very hard.... :(
 
Thanks Amberwolf. I'll look for a cell phone charger and see what happens. The thought of soldering tiny leads doesnakt sound like fun.

Ambrose
 
Great idea, Amberwolf. I found an old charger that I don't use any more, hooked it up to one of my 24v packs, and it puts out 5.4vdc just fine!

Now all I need to know is how to drop 5.4v to 3 or 3.5v. Anyone have any ideas? A resistor maybe?
 
This is a great thread to read and be aware of. The whole reason for my wanting to make a Blinder is because of increased visibility. I don't ever want to be hit because a driver couldn't see me!

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14052

Ambrose
 
That's exactly why I have bright turn signals, 180-degree headlight, side and front and rear marker lights, and taillight and brake lights. My lighting is as bright or brighter than many small motorcycles and some older cars. I dont' want a blinding bright light, but I want a lot of lit surface area that makes me more visible from farther away, allowing more reaction time.

My rear marker lights shine onto the backs of my large cargo pods, essentially turning the entire back of my bike into a red taillight.
No flash in dark room:

With flash in same room:
dsc01655.jpg

The top line is the red brake light off a junkyard car's roof-edge. The amber left turn signal is in the middle of a blink. The other lights (side markers and taillight) are red LumiLEDs.
 
The Journey Guy said:
Great idea, Amberwolf. I found an old charger that I don't use any more, hooked it up to one of my 24v packs, and it puts out 5.4vdc just fine!

Now all I need to know is how to drop 5.4v to 3 or 3.5v. Anyone have any ideas? A resistor maybe?


if its for the blinder, 6v is fine...cell charger is the go...

K
 
ktronik said:
The Journey Guy said:
Great idea, Amberwolf. I found an old charger that I don't use any more, hooked it up to one of my 24v packs, and it puts out 5.4vdc just fine!

Now all I need to know is how to drop 5.4v to 3 or 3.5v. Anyone have any ideas? A resistor maybe?


if its for the blinder, 6v is fine...cell charger is the go...

K

I was actually thinking of using it for something else that needs 3 - 3.5 volts DC. What would be the easiest and least expensive way to drop that voltage, ktronik? Thanks!
 
The Journey Guy said:
ktronik said:
The Journey Guy said:
Great idea, Amberwolf. I found an old charger that I don't use any more, hooked it up to one of my 24v packs, and it puts out 5.4vdc just fine!

Now all I need to know is how to drop 5.4v to 3 or 3.5v. Anyone have any ideas? A resistor maybe?


if its for the blinder, 6v is fine...cell charger is the go...

K

I was actually thinking of using it for something else that needs 3 - 3.5 volts DC. What would be the easiest and least expensive way to drop that voltage, ktronik? Thanks!

easiest and least expensive: (what amberwolf said)

3/ power (protection) diodes in series, they drop 0.7v across the diode junction...so 5.4v turns into 3.3v...make sure you match the current, for the app to the power rating of the diode... a standard diode is 1A (1n4001)...

you could also use a resistor, but would need to get the right value...

hope that helps...

K
 
amberwolf said:
I may have found a way to power them from lower voltage traction packs pretty easily, via a cheap (free, actually) source of DC-DC converters, in old celphone chargers and other portable-device AC adapters.

I started going thru my collection of ac adapters, including a couple acquired from Freecycle today, and found a couple of Samsung celphone chargers (TAD137VSE) that output "5.0V @ 0.7A" for "100-240VAC @ 0.7A" which also output the regulated supply at as low as 23VDC input. I'm sure the current draw would be higher at the lower voltage, but I didn't test it at it's full output, only with a 1Kohm load on it (~5mA), which drew pretty much nothing on the source side according to the Sorenson's ammeter.


I found this post extremely useful, thanks! Although I went down to goodwill (thrift store) and found a couple of the dc input to dc output converters. Input is 12-24vdc and the output is 4.5v...something like .7A. I really want to get a few of those SSC P7 LEDs and see what I can do with them. I am envisioning a 5 LED parabolic/linear mount with a slight hemisphere to it machined out of aluminum. :twisted:
 
Remember - if someone is finding a "wall wart" to use as a DC-DC the input range must be "100V - 240V AC 50/60hz"
If it calls out something like "115V AC 60hz" it is a transformer and that will not work.

You can tell it is the real deal if it is *not* heavy. If it is heavy it is a transformer and that wont work.

Also - we are not looking for "DC-DC" converters because anything marketed as that will be overpriced.
The trick here is to hack a high volume low cost AC-DC converter.

This is a good example
9V 2A
This is what you would use to replace two lithium batteries with a P7 LED

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280415818732



-methods
 
I am going to start collecting and testing any of these types of adapters I can find, mark them with their minimum DC input to stay regulated output at max rated current, and make them available for a few bucks plus postage. It will be a little bit before I can do it as I have a bunch of stuff on my plate right now, but for those looking for one, PM me with your requirements (output voltage and current, pack LVC voltage, etc) and I'll see what I can find.


EDIT (ADDED): Also, if you want an "interesting" light, I've been finding that various CFL bulbs meant for 110-120V AC wall voltage use tend to run (at lower brightness) on as little as 40V. At 36V, none of the ones I have will actually startup fully, but they try. At 38V they'll start to kick on but then cut off, and cycle like that, and around 40V they start actually staying on. I forgot to note whether they draw more or less or the same current than spec'd for AC.
 
The "converters" I bought were meant for plugging your cell into the cigarette lighter in your car to charge. I haven't opened them up yet...but I got the sinking feeling later today that they are merely resistors who's purpose it is to drop the voltage by simple heat dissipation. Since there is a gas engine and a massive alternator to power the converter...efficiency isn't an issue according to the designers I wouldn't think. I've never opened up a cell phone charger for a car before...so I had no way of knowing (and still technically I don't)...but fortunately they were only a couple bucks so I'm not out a fortune for nothing. It's always fun taking stuff apart though! :wink:
 
ambroseliao said:
This is a great thread to read and be aware of. The whole reason for my wanting to make a Blinder is because of increased visibility. I don't ever want to be hit because a driver couldn't see me!

http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14052

Ambrose

I wholeheartedly agree. I think tail lights are the current weak-link in the ebike lighting chain and often feel like a moving target when I'm night riding...

FWIW, here's another option for those not wanting to smt solder...Looks a lot like ebikes.ca's but includes the dc-dc converter. Stil a bit pricey, IMO

http://www.cycle9.com/c9store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=8_9&products_id=181
 
Or direct from Justin (the designer) in Canada

http://www.ebikes.ca/store/store_accessories.php

I picked on up used.
It only had 6LED's, not 8
To tell the truth it is really not a blinder.....
I have AA versions that are brighter and they tend to last months.

-methods
 
methods said:
Or direct from Justin (the designer) in Canada

http://www.ebikes.ca/store/store_accessories.php

I picked on up used.
It only had 6LED's, not 8
To tell the truth it is really not a blinder.....
I have AA versions that are brighter and they tend to last months.

-methods
You're right, my bad. The description of the lights runs right into the dc-dc converter description, so I guess I thought (ADD? :? )a dc-dc was needed for Justin's design. They are not.

One thing I've had diffictulty finding with any tail light is a way to mount it. Nearly all of them come with a big round deal for your seat post, but since I've got a battery pack back there, that doesn't work. And the clip on ones often bounce off eventuall and/or sag and point down.... Oh well, I guess a trip to the hardware store is in order :D
 
I have the exact same issue. I've got mine attached to a hook sewn onto my battery bag and every time I put it down, it pops off. Today, the clip that goes into the loop snapped. I need to finish my Blinder and install it ASAP!
 
Abrose, what kind of case are you going to use? How many volts does your blinder take in total? How much current does it draw on full?

good luck
 
Hi NeezyDeezy,

I'm struggling with the case design right now. I may just put it into an old blinker tail light case that I have that's busted so that I have something semi-pro looking. I am trying to power it with the battery pack that the light will sit on. So am researching that right now. There has been some talk of DC-DC converters on eBay as well as cell phone chargers used as DC-DC converters.

The Blinder is driven by this driver:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.7612 so is limited to 1000mA at 3.7V. You can feed it any reasonable voltage above that. I'm using 4AAs right now so 6V nominal. I think it should work up to about 9V.

Ktronik, can you confirm that?

Thanks,
Ambrose
 
ambroseliao said:
Hi NeezyDeezy,

I'm struggling with the case design right now. I may just put it into an old blinker tail light case that I have that's busted so that I have something semi-pro looking. I am trying to power it with the battery pack that the light will sit on. So am researching that right now. There has been some talk of DC-DC converters on eBay as well as cell phone chargers used as DC-DC converters.

The Blinder is driven by this driver:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.7612 so is limited to 1000mA at 3.7V. You can feed it any reasonable voltage above that. I'm using 4AAs right now so 6V nominal. I think it should work up to about 9V.

Ktronik, can you confirm that?

Thanks,
Ambrose

Guys, the AMC7135 is a LDO Reg!!! for it to be efficient it must run as close to Vf of LED string as poss...the farther away from Vf you get the worse the efficienty gets.

made for a single li-ion / lipo cell... 3AA will work but due to the voltage sag, may not supply enough current, so for AA you use 4... but its not very efficient...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=192925&highlight=AMC7135+test

if you are wanting to go over 6v, really MAX for this driver, you really should pick a driver better suited to you app.

K
 
Hey ktronik, thanks a lot for giving your expert feedback to us noobs!

ktronik said:
Guys, the AMC7135 is a LDO Reg!!! for it to be efficient it must run as close to Vf of LED string as poss...the farther away from Vf you get the worse the efficienty gets.

made for a single li-ion / lipo cell... 3AA will work but due to the voltage sag, may not supply enough current, so for AA you use 4... but its not very efficient...

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=192925&highlight=AMC7135+test

if you are wanting to go over 6v, really MAX for this driver, you really should pick a driver better suited to you app.

K
 
Back
Top