999zip999
100 TW
Wow sounds like they are available. Be nice to see the performance between the two as far as heat.
MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3
- Thread starter Allex
- Start date
e4bike, whats the new controller you are talking about?
do you have plans on a detailed comparison between this MXUS3000 V2 and Cromotor?
i think of the following:
- identical wheels on both bikes
- both bikes set to same (no load?) top speed. this means lower battery voltage for the cromotor bike due to a bit higher kV.
- both bikes set to same Watts.
do full throttle tests on different roads. for example 500m steep hill. 2km flat street and so on..
note temperature rise and consumed wh/km.
do you have plans on a detailed comparison between this MXUS3000 V2 and Cromotor?
i think of the following:
- identical wheels on both bikes
- both bikes set to same (no load?) top speed. this means lower battery voltage for the cromotor bike due to a bit higher kV.
- both bikes set to same Watts.
do full throttle tests on different roads. for example 500m steep hill. 2km flat street and so on..
note temperature rise and consumed wh/km.
999zip999
100 TW
So what does 7.1875kw mean to me ? At 80v 50amp. ?
teslanv
1 MW
If you are running on a 26" tire, then about 45 mph unloaded.999zip999 said:
999zip999
100 TW
Unloaded I only run loaded.
wesnewell
100 GW
7.1875x80=575rpm unloaded speed999zip999 said:
In 26" wheel, 44.4mph
in 24" wheel, 40mph
in 20" wheel, 34.2mph
zombiess
10 MW
teslanv said:
Can you post up the unloaded currents for 48V for the different turn counts?
Good job doing the Group buy. Putting one together and then pulling it off is not easy, it's a lot of work with heavy stuff too.
Did you take duty fees into account for the GB? If not they will get you for ~$10/motor in duty fees. I hope the quality on these is better than I got with my CNEbikes 40mm motor. I paid quite a bit more for it than this motor and it's abysmal in QC.
Hey guys curious what you think of using the Grin C7240-NC controller with this Motor? it puts out 40 amps... Do you feel the 20s lipo would be a good fit? or should I head in the direction of a bit more amps? (or volts)
Any input on a good controller for the 3000 would be helpful. I have a V-2 on order.
thanks
Any input on a good controller for the 3000 would be helpful. I have a V-2 on order.
thanks
teslanv
1 MW
zombiess said:
The 4-turn pulls about 58W at 48V no load.
I have not seen an invoice for duties from UPS. Do they usually send a bill after delivery?
999zip999
100 TW
Will pay duties if billed later. But I wouldn't ask.
Kent
1 kW
mrdavies said:
Well do you want to stay within the factories 3000 watt rating and have a nice, safe trouble-free long-life motor?
Yawn.
Then get the Grin 40 amp. Its a good controller -I had one. At 75 volts 40 amps you'll just squeeze 40 mph.
However,
for those who still have a pulse...zombiess
10 MW
teslanv said:
You will might be invoiced separately for the duties in a month or so if they have not already been assessed or priced into the shipping. Dealing with importing can be a little tricky and it varies from carrier to carrier depending on if they broker the transaction themselves which they probably did in your case. Importing pallets of stuff can have extra fees and duties which aren't always known up front. I'm usually invoiced separately about 30 days after I import unless I'm using a customs broker, then it's due at time of delivery. I'd suggest calling UPS and finding out, that way if you need to ask for more money you can do it now vs retroactively which is much harder.
It takes a lot of work to do a group purchase like this so I applaud you for helping people out.
When I started and sold the first batch of 40 motors I purchased I made a grand total profit of about $1,000 after costs. I've got things a lot more streamlined now, but small hiccups can really hurt you as a business and even more in a group buy (seen several good intentioned ones fall apart and end badly over the years on several sites).
As you know I'm selling parts as a small business (the proceeds are helping me to develop controllers and some other EV projects), but I still do things to help out the community such as sharing information and selling the Throttle Tamer I created. I think I'm making about $10 on the throttle tamer and on the first batch it was less. I never intended for it to be sold but people liked them and wanted some so I figured I'd help out.
Sorry, went a bit off topic, just remembering how much time I've put into ebikes
I wish I got to ride more Managed to do some riding today. Used the road for motor testing. It has 2 artificial humps where I need to slow down to 30kmh and enough space to accelerate to 60-65kmh, then again slowing down. So the ride looks like: acc to 60-65 - brake to 30 - acc to 60-65 - brake to 30 - acc to 60-65 - brake to 10 - turn 180 degrees - acc to 60-65 - brake to 30 - ..... non stop till 14Ah from the 21s LiNMC battery was drained. Such ride easily overheat the motor if the power is too high. I used new sine wave controller with 40A battery current. The power was 3400W in the beginning and 2600W in the end. Outside temperature was +5 Celsius. The motor had +25C in the beginning and the maximum temperature I got in the end was +110C. I thought that I will overheat it much faster. Some screens from the CA behind the spoiler. CA shows about 5% higher current. 89kmh on the CA is no load test with 84V.
Changed the controller current to 60A and will ride again soon. The heavy rain started and I don't think water cooling is a fair advantage.
Changed the controller current to 60A and will ride again soon. The heavy rain started and I don't think water cooling is a fair advantage.
e4bike.ru said:
much more important than battery current: what was the phase current?
If the motor is rated to 3000W at 72V (i think it is?) it would mean with about 42A phase we can ride all day long and it will never overheat. sure nobody will use such a conservative setting, but i just wanted to mention it because many here do think if a motor is rated to 3kw, it is 3kw from the battery which is not true. its 3kw at rated phase voltage.
zombiess
10 MW
madin88 said:
HI madin88,
I just wanted to interject that the power is taken based on battery voltage + battery current. Phase current is not used for power rating calculations. How hot the motor will get depends on many factors, but the dominating factor is battery_current * battery_volts * motor_efficiency.
As an example:
100V battery * 30A current * 85% efficency = 3000W in but only 2550W out. 450W of energy went into making heat.
This is a bit over simplified as the controller efficiency is assumed to be 100%. The entire controller/motor needs to be looked at as a system.
If the controller is 95% efficient and you ride the motor at 85% efficient load then your 100V, 30A (3000W input) becomes 2850W into the motor (150W lost in the controller) and final output then becomes 2423W. This also lacks the rolling resistance which would lower this at tad more.
Phase current is important to consider because it can determine how quickly a motor heats up under certain conditions and it is also the power you feel on initial take off from a dead stop. WIthout any current limiting in place the motor would be capable of starting off at well over 1000 phase amps from a dead stop and you might see a brief + 200A peak from the battery. This overshoot for a brief period is what made the Xie Chang controllers so punchy feeling compared to others. RC controllers usually have zero current limiting as well and can produce the highest phase currents but also often explode due to these high current pulses.
Efficiency is where gains are made in overall performance and improving motor power handling capability. If we had a motor with 100% efficiency, it would produce 3000W out for 3000W in and never get hot, but such a motor can not ever exist.
Allex
100 MW
Nice explanation!
Valentin, what will the phase amps be on your reprogrammed controller?
Valentin, what will the phase amps be on your reprogrammed controller?
As I said this controller doesn't limit the phase current. At least I can't see it. When infineon (xie chang) controller is programmed to limit the phase current you can see the power increasing on acceleration. I've noticed, at least with 40A battery current, that no phase current is limited. After switching to 60A battery current the same behavior observed. By the way I haven't tested 60A on the road yet because of heavy rain. But I tried several accelerations inside house trying not to hit the wall with 4.5kW.
As far as I can tell, the Xie Chang controllers do not have any sensors for the phase current. Phase current is 'calculated' from battery current and PWM duty cycle. Depending on the motor, the calculation may be off by a fair amount.
One way to test would be to program the phase current limt to something about equal to the battery current and see what happens.
One way to test would be to program the phase current limt to something about equal to the battery current and see what happens.
teslanv
1 MW
My Revised Plan:
4T Wind, with the following Controller:
http://www.sabvoton.com/product/72v-6kw-brushless-motor-controller.html#.VF_Dz2d0yfA
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=62240
Sine Wave, Field Weakening, 350 Phase Amps, 6kW Continuous, 12kW Burst, Variable Regen. Best with 18S-20S LiPo.
4T Wind, with the following Controller:
http://www.sabvoton.com/product/72v-6kw-brushless-motor-controller.html#.VF_Dz2d0yfA
http://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=62240
Sine Wave, Field Weakening, 350 Phase Amps, 6kW Continuous, 12kW Burst, Variable Regen. Best with 18S-20S LiPo.
teslanv
1 MW
Valentin,e4bike.ru said:Wow! Hope you will monitor the motor temperature.
What do you recommend for max motor temp?
Similar threads
