Proflex FS MTB ebike build. NEED HELP! Ideas/Opinion welcome

[nutnspecial]

Multistar 6S 20,000mAh - 3x in 18s1p (22.2v x3 = 66.6v) - $127.68 x3 = $383.04
Multistar 6S 10,000mAh - 6x in 18s2p (2x[22.2v x3] = 66.6v) - $89.67 x6 = $538.02
Multistar 6S 5,200mAh - 12x in 18S4p (4x[22.2v x3] = 66.6v) - $27.99 x12 = $335.88

What about flightmax 6s 8000mah 30/40c for ~60$ piece?

3x will comfortably deliver 70a @ 18s and 6x will take you from 8ah to 16ah. Price $180 (3) or $360 (6).
Apples to apples, similar pricing as 5 and 20ah multistar, with -20% capacity trade for +300% discharge capability. Sizing is nice because they're midway between the 5 and 20ah also.

 

[RageNR]

I will definitely try to do that gman. And I completely agree with people not caring for the "techno-mumbo-jumbo". But if you are going to diy an ebike, and do not want to look at the specs, what on earth do you think you are doing? Furthermore, why are you even browsing the ES forums? This is electrical geek heaven overload!! (this is coming from someone that does not like doing the "paper work" aka calculations)
My personal opinion would be that anyone new to the forums should have to watch Justin's presentation video for his earlydays cross-country ebike adventure, before they are allowed to make an account. And it's a 2hr long video.

You want to do this?[english accent required] You want to build an ebike do you? GET YOUR HEAD IN THE GAME
Yep, that's right, I'M AN A$$HOLE... because I care

What about flightmax 6s 8000mah 30/40c for ~60$ piece?

3x will comfortably deliver 70a @ 18s and 6x will take you from 8ah to 16ah. Price $180 (3) or $360 (6).
Apples to apples, similar pricing as 5 and 20ah multistar, with -20% capacity trade for +300% discharge capability. Sizing is nice because they're midway between the 5 and 20ah also.

At this point, I am not turning down any options. The more the merrier. Really, I would like to stay at 20Ah, although I might have to renig on that.
Weight might up being the most critical factor in this build. Wont know until I get the components in hand.
If I could get the discounted price to show up on the 16Ah Multistars, they may come down to $106ish. That would make 3x $106 = $318

Been trying to contact HK for the past 4 days. Have been on hold for over 20mins 3 times without answer. I would ask them what kind of deal they could work out on the Multistar 10Ah since they cost so much more than the 20Ah or even 12x the 5.2Ah packs. The pricing on the 10Ah really does not make sense. Should be $67 tops. I am assuming they are keeping the price high because those are the most popular so far.

 

[gman1971]

A-holes are like opinions, right? or is it the other way around? oh, no insults were meant on this post... please E-S readers, don't fly off the handle for this...

hahhaha... anyways..

Sometimes we (inclusive of I) sin of being too passionate about this crap, and at the end of the day is just an eBike kit... numbers and that kind of technical details are cool for private messages and perhaps to prove a point, but to get people attention the FB stories work great. Once you've sold the idea to someone, giving numbers is usually meaningless, as like one US General once said: "Tell them what to do and they will surprise you with their ingenuity" And sometimes just listening to people helps a lot as well... more like a venting my frustration kind of thing...

Can't wait to see the final result dude. GO GO GO

G.

I will definitely try to do that gman. And I completely agree with people not caring for the "techno-mumbo-jumbo". But if you are going to diy an ebike, and do not want to look at the specs, what on earth do you think you are doing? Furthermore, why are you even browsing the ES forums? This is electrical geek heaven overload!! (this is coming from someone that does not like doing the "paper work" aka calculations)
My personal opinion would be that anyone new to the forums should have to watch Justin's presentation video for his earlydays cross-country ebike adventure, before they are allowed to make an account. And it's a 2hr long video.

 

[RageNR]

You are right gman. Hope no one took offense to my previous post.
I like to push buttons, ok? Poke people in the side. :lol:
Not everyone has to know all the finite details to enjoy ebikes. Some just want to ride, I get that.
However, if you are on this site looking at DIY builds, hoping to build your own some day, you have to understand what you are doing on some technical level.
I urge everyone, learn as much as you can. The more you know, the better informed you are. More knowledgeable too. ________________ I don't think AAA carries ebike parts on their trucks yet.



So anyways, I diddled around with the ProFlex today. Took some measurements and tried to lay out the design on paper. I did not have actual measurements of the Cyclone motor for comparison, till after I came in for the night.
Now that I know the dimensions of the motor, and looking at my drawing + notes, I am not sure this thing is going to fit. If it does, it will be a TIGHT fit. We are talking a mm or two to spare.
What I think is going to mess me up is the extended parts of the motor shell, the studs where the bolts attach. The stock mount brackets may not work in my application. That will force me to fabricate a custom mounting solution that is only going to add cost, time, complexity, and aggravation.
I will get back at the bike tomorrow and try to see if the motor will just barely fit. And remember, I am going off measurements from other members information. The final fit may not be exactly the same.


On to some good news. I decided to make a template of the 20Ah Multistar batteries so I could get a feeling for their size. Ended up cutting down a 4x4 to make a mockup of the packs.
Made 3 of them since that is my target power source. And I have to say, they are quite a bit smaller than I was expecting. I knew the dimensions beforehand, but having something physical to hold in your hand really allows you to perceive things in scale.
If you want to know the approximate size of the Multistar 20,000mAh packs, just pick up a typical brick and hold that. http://image.slidesharecdn.com/brickwallinganintroduction-120305061700-phpapp02/95/brick-walling-an-introduction-4-728.jpg?cb=1330928445
The battery is a wee bit smaller than that. 200mm x 90mm x 60mm ------------- Still, the brick gives you a good idea of the scale.

Like I mentioned before, I plan on running these out of a backpack. Good news, all 3 together are fairly compact for the capacity/voltage these provide.
There are several ways you could arrange them. I plan on making a flat-er style pack. I laid them on the table 200mm side down, 60mm tall. Push them all together with the 90mm sides running parallel.
200mm
[___] <--- 90mm
[___] <--- 90mm
[___] <--- 90mm
The total size for the complete package is about 10-3/4in x 8in x 2-3/8in. That seems really good to me.
Put them in a smaller, tighter fitting backpack, and I think they will not be much of a hassle. ~15lbs right up close to your back (centered) should feel relatively lite. Keeping the weight off the bike is a major plus. Just look at it as you are a 15lb heavier rider. IF that seems like a challenge, then lose 15lbs so it all balances out :wink:

 

[gman1971]

Pretty cool! Yeah, you're going to love the Multistar packs...

G.

 

[rider95]

I had a proflex 856 and loved it but if you are wanting to go 50 mph or even 40 not on that ! lol it will never hold up .

 

[RageNR]

I had a proflex 856 and loved it but if you are wanting to go 50 mph or even 40 not on that ! lol it will never hold up .

Thank you for the input. What part of the frame would you say is the most likely to fail first?
I've talked to a few people that use to race these. Seems they have had them up to 35 before, and on downhill. I feel that 35-40 will be the absolute limit of what the bike can handle.

 

[nutnspecial]

I think we have a thread on 'absolute' where we get into some meanings

I'd say 35 -40 as a general reasonable maximum speed, conditions being appropriate.
But 50, 60, or even 100mph could be doable. I just wouldn't want to, and of course acceptable conditions would decrease as speed increases. It's a good rule of thumb to find what speeds the design has been sucessfully run at, and of course also any weak points, and factor age too.

I remember dumping my klein when it was alot newer going down a mountain road at 48-49mph. The one pedal spun off and we skidded for awhile, but that was it. The road was wet though and I had on gloves.
That's not quite the same, so on an older frame we should also factor in history, quality, weakpoints, and proposed geometry/weight/use changes- if there would be a failure you want to know where, especially when running at speeds you need luck to crash at completely unscathed.

From what you describe that speed is worthy a thoughtful/careful try imo. I could run my kiein at +60mph down the road I'm sure, it just wouldn't be the most bright (or legal) idea.

 

[rider95]

If you were just going too put a 36v middrive with a 10 ah battery then yes it would work , But for the kinda of battery and power n speed you are wanting its simply not beefing enough . Two choices for you keep the pro flex and use a lot less powerful set up keeping the speed below 30 , Or sell the pro flex (by the way the pro flex has a very neat Griven Fork ) and look for a used Down Hill bike . For the power you are wanting look for something like a 2005 team Giant DH bike there was one for sale on here with a mauxs 3000w hub motor that's the kind of bike you want to convert . For your safely please don't use the pro flex for such a powerful setup.

 

[RageNR]

Well you guys finally did it, didn't you? Pestered me into spending more money on another bike frame that I could not afford. *sigh*
No, I did not buy a Giant or DH bike. Well, I suppose what I bought USED to be considered a DH.

I had been looking for a Klein for a while. The few that popped up had hefty $$$ tags attached. This is the same reason why I did not buy a Giant or other DH bike. There are not many DH bikes for sale around here anyways, and the ones that have been listed for sale are priced wayyy too high. Just not a good market to buy this type of bike. Did not feel like dealing with ebay on a purchase like this.

So what did I buy? Got a 2000 Manta Comp. The two-tone blue model. Not the best colors, but I will fix that later. Paid $400 (good deal?)
It is in GREAT shape with a few minor scratches here and there. Overall, almost in new condition. Seller was super nice, and just had the LBS do a $100 tune up on it. R.T.G. bike
Decent bike with pretty good components. And admittedly, much nicer than the ProFlex imho.

The guy I got the ProFlex from did not want it back. Not surprised. He was acting sketchy. So now I need to sell this along with having more invested in the build with the Klein.
It's a shame, I really liked the look of the ProFlex despite its issues. Was going to repaint that one too.

I had a good name planned for the Flex. You all were ragging on me about how old and incapable the frame was... Bike was built in 1996. It is now 2016. That is 20 years by my calcumalations.
And just about everyone told me to get a DH bike instead. Henceforth, I dubbed the ProFlex the DH - "Decade Hopper"
eh? eh? anyone? ok ok, sorry its late, alright?


So yeah, I suppose the ProFlex build is dead. I still might make it into an ebike to sell later on. Will have to see how my funds disperse.
But in all seriousness, I do greatly appreciate all the feedback.

 

[RageNR]

I still do not have the Cyclone kit in hand. Based of the best measurements I could make, it is not clear if the motor would fit above the crank in the triangle as I had initially planned.
The main issue is, the frame is a small. A 16in to be accurate. This was actually called a Medium back then.
This frame (and BB) is just way too close to the ground to mount the Cyclone underneath like typical installations. At least not comfortably, imho.
My entire decision to buy the ProFlex was based on the assumption that I would mount the motor in the frame. Not good to make assumptions kids. DONT DO IT...

So yeah, I made a bad call. Although, I am still thinking of building the ProFlex with a Bafang BBSDH or BBS02 system. I simply can not afford to build 2 ebikes at once, so that will have to be put on ice for the moment.
Eh... can't win em all I suppose