The *Genesis* is only the begining...
- Thread starter GITech
- Start date
I am up for doing it by hand! I have no problem working my fingers to the bone to accomplish a goal! 
Can you give me few hints on how you accomplished it?
If done by hand, can it be done to the ACS CF? if not, why not? It's just the savings I'm after here.
Can you give me few hints on how you accomplished it?
If done by hand, can it be done to the ACS CF? if not, why not? It's just the savings I'm after here.
Read this first: http://www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=13532GITech said:I am up for doing it by hand! I have no problem working my fingers to the bone to accomplish a goal!
Can you give me few hints on how you accomplished it?
Still reading!
I just won one of these for 50 bucks: http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=SRAM+x9+rear+hub+6+bolt+IS+12x135mm+32+hole&hl=en&gbv=2&prmd=ivns&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=4053642088677059037#
This should work, no?
Next I will be looking for my first stage gear set, #25 or #35. I'll need a pinion to fit on the 12mm motor shaft of the 80-100. Any suggestions here?
I now see that "ya'll" have been working on similar drives for quite some time now!
Still reading so I'm not quite cought up yet, but I plan too!
What size shaft does Thud use for his gearboxes? 5/8"?
Thanks,
Jay
I just won one of these for 50 bucks: http://www.google.com/products/catalog?q=SRAM+x9+rear+hub+6+bolt+IS+12x135mm+32+hole&hl=en&gbv=2&prmd=ivns&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=shop&cid=4053642088677059037#
This should work, no?
Next I will be looking for my first stage gear set, #25 or #35. I'll need a pinion to fit on the 12mm motor shaft of the 80-100. Any suggestions here?
I now see that "ya'll" have been working on similar drives for quite some time now!
Still reading so I'm not quite cought up yet, but I plan too! What size shaft does Thud use for his gearboxes? 5/8"?
Thanks,
Jay
Thud
1 MW
some one say my name?
For drive sprockets to fit a 12mm shaft....I buy sprockets bored .375 & open em up to 12mm in the lathe. run a rough drill & finish with a reamer. I can hook you up if needed.
I lean toward #25 drive chain in the primary reductions where speeds are high & tourque is low. I played with gates GT2 in 5mm it works but its fussy for belt wrap to elliminat skip....& the main reason is....i am a cheap sk8! Poly chain & sprockets are really expensive..it is slightly quieter & cleaner,& may last a little longer (I wore a drive sprocket out fairly quickly) then again I wear out #25 fairly quickly also. so pick your posion.
for the shaft in the trannys, I use a .75" keyed shaft stock. if you look at the plans posted in the resources section you'll see i turn the ends to .5" to fit the bearings & stock sprockets. the dog hubs started as keyed shaft couplers, but i have found the last 2 i bought were quite miss bored...like .06" out of concentric so i had to make adjustments.
I can broach WI freewheels here now also if you take that path. I am going to make a steel splined adapter from freehub to kart sprocket, then freewheel the drive sproket & put a broached WI freewheel in the pedal line...(still pricy but only 1/2 the price of 2 WIFw's)
I attempted internal keyway grinding on the harder ACS freewheels...the set up proved unreliable & woefully slow. I been meaning to re-visit it but time is allways an issue.
I really like my 3077 equiped 12fet controllers. they are proving to be quite dependable as long as i dont go crazy. I bought a bunch of 18fet kits so I can push the power up to true 5kw sustained output. They need assembly before I can start testing.
I have controllers built with 4110's so i can run higher voltages.....but I find the 3077's seem to run cooler in their voltage ranges..& i have made some cool fireworks with 4110's as well as 3066's....for wheeie power the 3077's are delivering the goods.
wha di forget?
hope that helps. have fun T.
For drive sprockets to fit a 12mm shaft....I buy sprockets bored .375 & open em up to 12mm in the lathe. run a rough drill & finish with a reamer. I can hook you up if needed.
I lean toward #25 drive chain in the primary reductions where speeds are high & tourque is low. I played with gates GT2 in 5mm it works but its fussy for belt wrap to elliminat skip....& the main reason is....i am a cheap sk8! Poly chain & sprockets are really expensive..it is slightly quieter & cleaner,& may last a little longer (I wore a drive sprocket out fairly quickly) then again I wear out #25 fairly quickly also. so pick your posion.
for the shaft in the trannys, I use a .75" keyed shaft stock. if you look at the plans posted in the resources section you'll see i turn the ends to .5" to fit the bearings & stock sprockets. the dog hubs started as keyed shaft couplers, but i have found the last 2 i bought were quite miss bored...like .06" out of concentric so i had to make adjustments.
I can broach WI freewheels here now also if you take that path. I am going to make a steel splined adapter from freehub to kart sprocket, then freewheel the drive sproket & put a broached WI freewheel in the pedal line...(still pricy but only 1/2 the price of 2 WIFw's)
I attempted internal keyway grinding on the harder ACS freewheels...the set up proved unreliable & woefully slow. I been meaning to re-visit it but time is allways an issue.
I really like my 3077 equiped 12fet controllers. they are proving to be quite dependable as long as i dont go crazy. I bought a bunch of 18fet kits so I can push the power up to true 5kw sustained output. They need assembly before I can start testing.
I have controllers built with 4110's so i can run higher voltages.....but I find the 3077's seem to run cooler in their voltage ranges..& i have made some cool fireworks with 4110's as well as 3066's....for wheeie power the 3077's are delivering the goods.
wha di forget?
hope that helps. have fun T.
GITech said:I now see that "ya'll" have been working on similar drives for quite some time now!
Did you see this thread?
www.endless-sphere.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=8644
Just got done reading it and Thuds first (red BMX) build thread! Nice stuff!
I'm also on page 28 of 42 in the "Fitting freewheels to splined freehub drivers" thread. I feel it's the least I can do to honor "all" your hard work in the past. I've also watched all the vids in their entirety on the broaching process, etc. It's great you guys got it done! Hats off to you all!
Reading up on all this is becoming like oxygen to me!
Thud, thanks! I think I have a lot of figuring out to do on my design. Like my sketchup drawing, all details are still TBD. I think the next step should be a discussion on the specifics of the materials that will go into this build, like what chain sizes and types, sprocket sizes and types, jackshaft design, what bearings, etc...since your the expert and will likely be doing the machining of these parts for me, I'm looking forward to getting to specifics of how it will go together. One part at a time! hehe 
Incomplete post---gotta go for now!
Thanks again,
Jay
I'm also on page 28 of 42 in the "Fitting freewheels to splined freehub drivers" thread. I feel it's the least I can do to honor "all" your hard work in the past. I've also watched all the vids in their entirety on the broaching process, etc. It's great you guys got it done! Hats off to you all!
Reading up on all this is becoming like oxygen to me!
Thud, thanks! I think I have a lot of figuring out to do on my design. Like my sketchup drawing, all details are still TBD. I think the next step should be a discussion on the specifics of the materials that will go into this build, like what chain sizes and types, sprocket sizes and types, jackshaft design, what bearings, etc...since your the expert and will likely be doing the machining of these parts for me, I'm looking forward to getting to specifics of how it will go together. One part at a time! hehe
Incomplete post---gotta go for now!
Thanks again,
Jay
Oh, I'm slow! I had to read your post like five times over the period of 2 days to get that you pretty much gave me all the info I need! ...and I had downloaded your drawings at least a week ago. I didn't even think to look their for answers...Doh! But it was good to get confirmation the drawings are still current. 
I guess I've been reading so many sources and downloading so much reference material I've swamped myself and have gotten lost in the flood of all this information. Sheesh. :?
I need to slow down and wrap my brain around "it" still...
Ok, I typed like 4 revisions of this post before another 10+hours of researching and reading. I really am trying to do as much of this searching and parts info compiling as I can so I can bother you guys the least, but I seem to be hitting one brick wall after another. I guess I'm slowly breaking through these walls, but I feel like I'm having to hack google to try and get it to give me the results I'm looking for. :|
In trying to come up with a way to start getting to specifics, instead of me just typing too much to try to explain all my hopes and dreams and problems I'm having along the way, lets try this...I'll just directly ask questions based on your feedback. My replies are in Bold.
Later,
Jay
I guess I've been reading so many sources and downloading so much reference material I've swamped myself and have gotten lost in the flood of all this information. Sheesh. :?
I need to slow down and wrap my brain around "it" still...
Ok, I typed like 4 revisions of this post before another 10+hours of researching and reading. I really am trying to do as much of this searching and parts info compiling as I can so I can bother you guys the least, but I seem to be hitting one brick wall after another. I guess I'm slowly breaking through these walls, but I feel like I'm having to hack google to try and get it to give me the results I'm looking for. :|
In trying to come up with a way to start getting to specifics, instead of me just typing too much to try to explain all my hopes and dreams and problems I'm having along the way, lets try this...I'll just directly ask questions based on your feedback. My replies are in Bold.
Thud said:some one say my name?
For drive sprockets to fit a 12mm shaft....I buy sprockets bored .375 & open em up to 12mm in the lathe. run a rough drill & finish with a reamer. I can hook you up if needed.
---So you've got this covered?! That would be TITS (hehe
I lean toward #25 drive chain in the primary reductions where speeds are high & torque is low. I played with gates GT2 in 5mm it works but its fussy for belt wrap to eliminate skip....& the main reason is....i am a cheap sk8! Poly chain & sprockets are really expensive..it is slightly quieter & cleaner,& may last a little longer (I wore a drive sprocket out fairly quickly) then again I wear out #25 fairly quickly also. so pick your poison.
---ie; I've discovered to get results out of google for #25 chain sprockets you have to search for the exact Martin part # from their catalog, and they seem to be the only ones that make them, in a variety of sizes anyway. Doing this I think I can find the larger tooth #25 Type-A sprocket I will need for the 1st reduction stage that will go "in" the torque limiter. Haven't decided on a specific tooth count yet as this will depend on the tooth count of the #25 motor pinion, and the "possible" tooth counts and pitch sizes of the second stage(s) of reduction---
for the shaft in the trannys, I use a .75" keyed shaft stock. if you look at the plans posted in the resources section you'll see i turn the ends to .5" to fit the bearings & stock sprockets. the dog hubs started as keyed shaft couplers, but i have found the last 2 i bought were quite miss bored...like .06" out of concentric so i had to make adjustments.
---This is good, if I understand this correctly, then I should be looking for a torque limiter with a .5" bore, a "1st gear pinion" with a .5" bore, and plan to design with you a "2nd gear pinion" that will be as small a tooth count as possible that will still accommodate ball bearings with a .5"ID and the dog receptacles(?).---
I can broach WI freewheels here now also if you take that path. I am going to make a steel splined adapter from freehub to kart sprocket, then freewheel the drive sprocket & put a broached WI freewheel in the pedal line...(still pricey but only 1/2 the price of 2 WIFw's)
---A couple things here: #219 cart sprockets look to be abundant and inexpensive, But #219 "pinions" seem to be rarer than white tigers! I've only seen less than a handful and they seem to be made specifically for mounting on certain IC engine shafts or are part of a clutch bell. If there is a source for them in several sizes, please share. If they are truly a rare thing, then I can't see how #219 could be a choice due to the fact that we need 2 of them (pinions) and at least on of them has to be able to fit the bill of the "2nd gear pinion" outlined just above. Or, maybe #219 stuff for the "1st gear side" if a small tooth count pinion can be found and used with a .5" bore, and then something else like maybe #35 or #40 for the "2nd gear side"(?). Second: great idea for saving a WI FW, but if I went that route I'd have the problem of the peddles driving the motor through the 1st gear side of this simplified drivetrain/gearbox setup. Any ideas around this?---
I attempted internal keyway grinding on the harder ACS freewheels...the set up proved unreliable & woefully slow. I been meaning to re-visit it but time is always an issue.
---That's cool. It would be nice to be able to use a cheaper FW for the cranks. I see that this is a for sure "maybe"!
I really like my 3077 equipped 12fet controllers. they are proving to be quite dependable as long as i don't go crazy. I bought a bunch of 18fet kits so I can push the power up to true 5kw sustained output. They need assembly before I can start testing. I have controllers built with 4110's so i can run higher voltages.....but I find the 3077's seem to run cooler in their voltage ranges..& i have made some cool fireworks with 4110's as well as 3066's....for wheelie power the 3077's are delivering the goods.
---This is the best news/report I've read so far on controllers! You go Thud! About how much for one of these? I have done a lot of SMD in the past so my solder skillz are killer. What might my options be? ---
wha di forget? ---Nothin' really, thank you sooo much!
hope that helps. have fun T.
Later,
Jay
etard
100 kW
I did! :lol:
Where are these broached freewheels? I think you know my address. :wink: I need one for this race in April!
GITech,
You are going through the same progression I have gone through and I'm sure many others: Get excited over a new idea for a drive system, research, read, get lost in interwebz, back to ES, repeat.... For your first RC build, Keep it simple and get a decent setup going, then tweak and improve on your working drive setup. K.I.S.S. for you first build I say.
I like your idea, if you get a custom wound motor from Thud with internal halls and 75KV you could possibly have a very simple and powerful single stage drive that will surprise you at 5KW. If you managed to gear it for just 25 mph, it will wheelie with authority!
etard said:
That's exactly what I've been doing! Hahaha! Good to know I'm not the only one. Thanks etard! (Love the name!
)LOL, I'm a big baby! Just read through my whole thread again and, do I sound bitchy! Since I guess I shouldn't edit nearly all my posts, I edited my design post again. Negatives have been removed. :|
Yes, it's a process!
This isn't my very FIRST adventure into ebikes. I did use this motor on another cheap wally-mart bike. It was a FS bike with a "Y" frame called a "Breakpoint". The "Y" frame made me scared it was going to break on me at the "Y" and I could smell the irony in the bikes name! It was a simple 1-stage through the cranks on 22.2v. The peddles spun with the motor so I just removed the peddles and put my feet up on the top of the forks while ridding! That was, crazy! I did reach a top speed of 39.9mph, though it took a looooong time to get there! 
So, I retired it pretty quickly. That was ~2 years ago when I purchased this frame. In the mean time I've done things like this: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1205952 Well, I thought this was KISS!
hehehe, I know it's going to take some time. Good thing it's all snowy like outside for a few months! I will probably have one side (1st gear side) done first, so that will be the "start out KISS" part. Since this is going to be built on and around a custom extended rear swingarm (by Farfle), it's going to be a process even if cash wasn't the major limiting factor, 'cause I think I will have to get the mechanics and hence the dims for the "gearbox" before I can have the custom swingarm made, so I can have mounts for it welded on in the correct place the first time. Ya know.
A new and rewound motor is definitely in my plans, eventually. Right on! Delta or Y? What do you think about "Zig-Zag DLRK"? So you think gearing (1st gear) for 25mph would be more advantageous for offroad fun than say 20mph? And what voltage were you thinking? 66.6?
BTW: I'm thinking about going to smaller wheels, eventually! ...20"!?
Check this out! A shock relief freewheel adapter for the WI ENO 22 tooth, wadayatink? :wink:
Later,
Jay
Thud
1 MW
Jay,
This is my perfered source for all things mechanicle(that i will be chopping & re-working to fit my needs)
#25 sprockets/#35 sprockets/keyed shafting/odds & ends from time to time, surf around & see if there is anything you like:
https://www.surpluscenter.com/sort.asp?numrec=118&sort=1&keyword=PH25&catname=powerTrans&UID=2156010112350909
they are short inventory on some of my favorite 15t models....but thats ok, I have a lathe that lets me make all small holes bigger to fit....or i can sleeve stuff down if the application warrents it.
Recumpence turned me onto the BEST #25 drive chain....its the heavy duty stuff from here:
http://www.electricscooterparts.com/chain.html
your observations on 219 is the same as mine....its the #1 reason i deal with #35 size (i can buy master links at menards or any Ace hardware store)
219 will need a proper chain breaker & a true comitment to the set up. I like these 219 drive sprockets as a starting point for adapting to:
http://www.accelerationkarting.com/leopardenginesprocket.aspx
I make something just like that & make a freewheeling drive sprokect with any tooth count in #35
since your in the design discovery phase of your tranny, you arent tied to any particular shaft diameters for any tourque limiters & such, Ebay has em by the boat load:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trkparms=65%253A1%257C66%253A2%257C39%253A1&rt=nc&_nkw=torque%20limiter&_sc=1&_sop=1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1513&_pgn=2
you have every option available......daunting aint it!?
About controllers....I ain't in the controller buisness, but Ill put you on the path. Contact the e-crazyman directly & if you order in qty, you can buy controllers less fet's with boards "populated" as a "kit"....solder in the wires & controll input harneses & the flavor FETs of your choice.
I have yet to drop $90 on WI freewheel I have missed a couple on e-bay....
I like the shock absorbing adapter....you can save a ton of space with elastomers....something to consider.
KIss????? every one knows building non hub e-bikes is easy!
This is my perfered source for all things mechanicle(that i will be chopping & re-working to fit my needs)
#25 sprockets/#35 sprockets/keyed shafting/odds & ends from time to time, surf around & see if there is anything you like:
https://www.surpluscenter.com/sort.asp?numrec=118&sort=1&keyword=PH25&catname=powerTrans&UID=2156010112350909
they are short inventory on some of my favorite 15t models....but thats ok, I have a lathe that lets me make all small holes bigger to fit....or i can sleeve stuff down if the application warrents it.
Recumpence turned me onto the BEST #25 drive chain....its the heavy duty stuff from here:
http://www.electricscooterparts.com/chain.html
your observations on 219 is the same as mine....its the #1 reason i deal with #35 size (i can buy master links at menards or any Ace hardware store)
219 will need a proper chain breaker & a true comitment to the set up. I like these 219 drive sprockets as a starting point for adapting to:
http://www.accelerationkarting.com/leopardenginesprocket.aspx
I make something just like that & make a freewheeling drive sprokect with any tooth count in #35
since your in the design discovery phase of your tranny, you arent tied to any particular shaft diameters for any tourque limiters & such, Ebay has em by the boat load:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trkparms=65%253A1%257C66%253A2%257C39%253A1&rt=nc&_nkw=torque%20limiter&_sc=1&_sop=1&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14.l1513&_pgn=2
you have every option available......daunting aint it!?
About controllers....I ain't in the controller buisness, but Ill put you on the path. Contact the e-crazyman directly & if you order in qty, you can buy controllers less fet's with boards "populated" as a "kit"....solder in the wires & controll input harneses & the flavor FETs of your choice.
I have yet to drop $90 on WI freewheel
I have missed a couple on e-bay....I like the shock absorbing adapter....you can save a ton of space with elastomers....something to consider.
KIss????? every one knows building non hub e-bikes is easy!
etard
100 kW
I have been searching up #25 chain today and may have found some that is kinda expensive but still cheaper than 219:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B000GTV9ZU/sr=/qid=/ref=olp_tab_new?ie=UTF8&coliid=&me=&qid=&sr=&seller=&colid=&condition=new
It's cam chain and supposed to be the best you can buy, made in Japan. For $28 you get 100 links. I also found a great source for all things #25 and even #35 for you old cheap farts:
http://www.electricscooterparts.com/sprockets.html
I found this one especially interesting as it mounts directly onto the disk brake hub:
So now I'm wondering if with the best chain and not too long distance between sprockets if I could get away with #25 final drive. The best part is at 54 teeth it's only 4 1/2" in diameter so the disc brake caliper can actually ride "above the sprocket so just put some washers between the sprocket and disk and your done!
Watcha think guys?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B000GTV9ZU/sr=/qid=/ref=olp_tab_new?ie=UTF8&coliid=&me=&qid=&sr=&seller=&colid=&condition=new
It's cam chain and supposed to be the best you can buy, made in Japan. For $28 you get 100 links. I also found a great source for all things #25 and even #35 for you old cheap farts:
http://www.electricscooterparts.com/sprockets.html
I found this one especially interesting as it mounts directly onto the disk brake hub:
So now I'm wondering if with the best chain and not too long distance between sprockets if I could get away with #25 final drive. The best part is at 54 teeth it's only 4 1/2" in diameter so the disc brake caliper can actually ride "above the sprocket so just put some washers between the sprocket and disk and your done!
Watcha think guys?
Awesome posts!
Sorry I've been slow to respond. I broke my right hand, a fracture of my 5th metacarpal!
In the mean time, my wheel set, stem and handle bars have arrived, but no real testing them out on the Fox 40 now, until my hand heals up. Damn the luck! :|
I've got every one of those links you guys posted in my favorites now! I haven't let up on the research, just a little slowed down. I'm getting closer to a final design that will allow me to fit all this on a custom lower swingarm.
Thud,
-Thems be some cheap sprockets and stuff on surplus center, nice!
-I think I'm going with 5/8" keyed shaft?
-What is the smallest #25 motor pinion sprocket you would use for boring to 12mm? 15T, 14T, 13T?
-I've been looking at Ebay for the torque limiters. Very nice! Morse or Dalton recommended? If I get one with a smaller bore than what I need, do you bore out these as well, and add a keyway?
-Thanks for the info on ecrazyman controllers, I'll look into it. What's the best way to find this guy?
-You've always paid less for you WI FW? Or you've never had your very own?
-On the shock absorbing adapter, I've looked for elastomer's, but I'm not finding anything that turns my light on.
:| How would elastomer's work/fit into a design of something like this? Your thoughts?
-HA HAHAHA! Yeah, everyone knows that!!! 8)
-For my 2nd gear dog clutch setup; This, OD= 2-7/64" ( https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=1-3421-G&catname=powerTrans ), and this, from what I have been able to summarize, has a usable dia inside the teeth of 2-3/16" ( http://www.mfgsupply.com/gomini/gominisprockets/gominisprocketsidler/az2186.html )?
-One more thing. Do you think an ebay (Morse or Dalton) "225" torque limiter is enough for the spur of the 1st stage? I think, maybe these "225" size TL's are the same as the 6524K12 on: http://www.mcmaster.com/#torque-limiters/=fym0sr ,third one down and can handle ~60ft lbs?
Etard,
-Cool, thanks! That sounds like great chain! Expensive!
-On ^that^ #25 sprocket, it's NICE! It should work, I'm thinking you would just need to make sure your not going to push your brake disk too far out. A "Top-Hat" can help with this, but then you would have to find another sprocket (like the ones he can make to go with it maybe). ( http://kingssalesandservice.com/category/top-hat-sprocket-adaptors/ )
I've found a great source for some hard to find #25 sprockets (hard to navigate sometimes with 9,728 results in 3,147 families, but here's the #25 family listings):
#25 type A: http://www.smallparts.com/martin-type-sprocket-25-chain/dp/B004JXWGSS/ref=sr_1_34?sr=1-34&qid=1327514645
#25 type B: http://www.smallparts.com/martin-type-sprocket-25-chain/dp/B004JXWH2I/ref=sr_1_4?sr=1-4&qid=1327459541
Main sprocket listing with 9,728 results in 3,147 families: http://www.smallparts.com/s?savedSearchKeyword=&keywords=&page=1&size=20&searchNodeID=16411641&ref_=sp_s_page_1_b
A source for #25 and #35 sprockets in aluminum: http://www.andymark.com/Sprockets-s/52.htm
BIG question: Is this a typo on this website that these guys sell a WI ENO "Deluxe" FW ...w/ "FOUR PAWLS"??? http://harriscyclery.net/product/white-industries-eno-deluxe-singlespeed-freewheel-721.htm
Here is how far I've gotten with my drawings. This is a "photo match" of Farfle's custom lower using a pic he posted a while back. I needed to get it into my drawing so I could see if it would work, and how I would have to change it to make it work. So here is Farfle's lower "as is" in Google SketchUp:
Note: I've resized the wheel to 20.5", like on Farfle's race bike. I will have the 2.5-16 "Bridgestone TW9 Trail Wing Dual Sport" tires on 20"x36mm BMX rims. (Anyone know if this combo should work before I purchase the 2 wheels and 2 rims?) http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/2/29/393/14725/ITEM/Bridgestone-TW9-Trail-Wing-Dual-Sport-Front-tire.aspx?WT.ac=Cart_Item and http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMX-Rim-Wheel-Alienation-Runaway-20-32-hole-/280588625991?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item415462a847 (I need 32 hole front and back)
Later,
Jay
Sorry I've been slow to respond. I broke my right hand, a fracture of my 5th metacarpal!
In the mean time, my wheel set, stem and handle bars have arrived, but no real testing them out on the Fox 40 now, until my hand heals up. Damn the luck! :|
I've got every one of those links you guys posted in my favorites now! I haven't let up on the research, just a little slowed down. I'm getting closer to a final design that will allow me to fit all this on a custom lower swingarm.
Thud,
-Thems be some cheap sprockets and stuff on surplus center, nice!
-I think I'm going with 5/8" keyed shaft?
-What is the smallest #25 motor pinion sprocket you would use for boring to 12mm? 15T, 14T, 13T?
-I've been looking at Ebay for the torque limiters. Very nice! Morse or Dalton recommended? If I get one with a smaller bore than what I need, do you bore out these as well, and add a keyway?
-Thanks for the info on ecrazyman controllers, I'll look into it. What's the best way to find this guy?
-You've always paid less for you WI FW? Or you've never had your very own?
-On the shock absorbing adapter, I've looked for elastomer's, but I'm not finding anything that turns my light on.
:| How would elastomer's work/fit into a design of something like this? Your thoughts?-HA HAHAHA! Yeah, everyone knows that!!! 8)
-For my 2nd gear dog clutch setup; This, OD= 2-7/64" ( https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=1-3421-G&catname=powerTrans ), and this, from what I have been able to summarize, has a usable dia inside the teeth of 2-3/16" ( http://www.mfgsupply.com/gomini/gominisprockets/gominisprocketsidler/az2186.html )?
-One more thing. Do you think an ebay (Morse or Dalton) "225" torque limiter is enough for the spur of the 1st stage? I think, maybe these "225" size TL's are the same as the 6524K12 on: http://www.mcmaster.com/#torque-limiters/=fym0sr ,third one down and can handle ~60ft lbs?
Etard,
-Cool, thanks! That sounds like great chain! Expensive!
-On ^that^ #25 sprocket, it's NICE! It should work, I'm thinking you would just need to make sure your not going to push your brake disk too far out. A "Top-Hat" can help with this, but then you would have to find another sprocket (like the ones he can make to go with it maybe). ( http://kingssalesandservice.com/category/top-hat-sprocket-adaptors/ )
I've found a great source for some hard to find #25 sprockets (hard to navigate sometimes with 9,728 results in 3,147 families, but here's the #25 family listings):
#25 type A: http://www.smallparts.com/martin-type-sprocket-25-chain/dp/B004JXWGSS/ref=sr_1_34?sr=1-34&qid=1327514645
#25 type B: http://www.smallparts.com/martin-type-sprocket-25-chain/dp/B004JXWH2I/ref=sr_1_4?sr=1-4&qid=1327459541
Main sprocket listing with 9,728 results in 3,147 families: http://www.smallparts.com/s?savedSearchKeyword=&keywords=&page=1&size=20&searchNodeID=16411641&ref_=sp_s_page_1_b
A source for #25 and #35 sprockets in aluminum: http://www.andymark.com/Sprockets-s/52.htm
BIG question: Is this a typo on this website that these guys sell a WI ENO "Deluxe" FW ...w/ "FOUR PAWLS"??? http://harriscyclery.net/product/white-industries-eno-deluxe-singlespeed-freewheel-721.htm
Here is how far I've gotten with my drawings. This is a "photo match" of Farfle's custom lower using a pic he posted a while back. I needed to get it into my drawing so I could see if it would work, and how I would have to change it to make it work. So here is Farfle's lower "as is" in Google SketchUp:
Note: I've resized the wheel to 20.5", like on Farfle's race bike. I will have the 2.5-16 "Bridgestone TW9 Trail Wing Dual Sport" tires on 20"x36mm BMX rims. (Anyone know if this combo should work before I purchase the 2 wheels and 2 rims?) http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/2/29/393/14725/ITEM/Bridgestone-TW9-Trail-Wing-Dual-Sport-Front-tire.aspx?WT.ac=Cart_Item and http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMX-Rim-Wheel-Alienation-Runaway-20-32-hole-/280588625991?pt=Cycling_Parts_Accessories&hash=item415462a847 (I need 32 hole front and back)
Later,
Jay
It's probably a mistake, Jay. Unless they've changed recently, they have 3 pawls (or 2 x 3 pawls for the trials version).GITech said:BIG question: Is this a typo on this website that these guys sell a WI ENO "Deluxe" FW ...w/ "FOUR PAWLS"??? http://harriscyclery.net/product/white-industries-eno-deluxe-singlespeed-freewheel-721.htm
It does say 4 pawls for the DOS version (only), here:
http://www.bikeman.com/WIND-FWDOSENO1618.html
Thud
1 MW
-I think I'm going with 5/8" keyed shaft? I can't think of any objection
-What is the smallest #25 motor pinion sprocket you would use for boring to 12mm? 13T
-I've been looking at Ebay for the torque limiters. Very nice! Morse or Dalton recommended? cant go wrong with either
If I get one with a smaller bore than what I need, do you bore out these as well, and add a keyway? prolly not, these are notrmaly heat treated to a grade 8ish hardness...better to buy what you need, or shimm a larger one to fit your shaft
-Thanks for the info on ecrazyman controllers, I'll look into it. What's the best way to find this guy?
if your not inclined to buy in quanity & in Kit form, I have to recomend Lyen's controllers. His priceing is more than fair & he has a quality product (I have 2 of his controllers)
look at the link to the e-crazyman e-bay store below
-You've always paid less for you WI FW? Or you've never had your very own?never had
-On the shock absorbing adapter, I've looked for elastomer's, but I'm not finding anything that turns my light on. How would elastomer's work/fit into a design of something like this? Your thoughts?Custom elasomers can be cast in urathan or silicone in a multitude of durometers...your imagination is your only limitation
-For my 2nd gear dog clutch setup; This, OD= 2-7/64" ( https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp? ... powerTrans ),I hadn't thought or re-purpousing a lovejoy for this app. may be totaly viable and this, from what I have been able to summarize, has a usable dia inside the teeth of 2-3/16" ( http://www.mfgsupply.com/gomini/gominis ... z2186.html )? is that link right? I see a bearing idle sprocket
-One more thing. Do you think an ebay (Morse or Dalton) "225" torque limiter is enough for the spur of the 1st stage? I think, maybe these "225" size TL's are the same as the 6524K12 on: http://www.mcmaster.com/#torque-limiters/=fym0sr ,third one down and can handle ~60ft lbs? ]I think so.
e-crazymans ebay store
http://www.ebay.com/itm/72V-1500W-brushless-controller-E-bike-scooter-/260847229409?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cbbb4d9e1
there you go bro.
I lost my post, quotes and all! ...Ctrl-A, Ctrl-C, bahhh!
Oh well..it's getting late.
Here is my sketchup so far... http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=c4aea6df612a701bc0d430132c6d6b7
Note: You can also just open sketchup and go to the 3D Werehouse from the files menu, from there just search for "Genesis Drive" and download the model directly into sketchup from there.
(man I had all kinds of stuff typed up, but I've got to go to bed now, see you tomorrow)
Edit: I just DL'd my own model...some things you should do to see it the way I do: Choose "Engineering Metric" for your template upon opening sketchup, and choose "Parrallel Projection" in the "Camera" menu.
Pics:
Oh well..it's getting late.
farmkid4 said:
Here is my sketchup so far... http://sketchup.google.com/3dwarehouse/details?mid=c4aea6df612a701bc0d430132c6d6b7
Note: You can also just open sketchup and go to the 3D Werehouse from the files menu, from there just search for "Genesis Drive" and download the model directly into sketchup from there.
(man I had all kinds of stuff typed up, but I've got to go to bed now, see you tomorrow)
Edit: I just DL'd my own model...some things you should do to see it the way I do: Choose "Engineering Metric" for your template upon opening sketchup, and choose "Parrallel Projection" in the "Camera" menu.
Pics:
Thud, how bad of an idea is the "#40-16T-BB idler sprocket" for the 2nd gear dog setup?? Can you help with a better?
Here is where I'm at now with sizes of all sprockets in the drawing are accurate for:
20.5" wheel, stock 80-100-130kv at 44.4volts with 5300rpm at the motor...
1st gear; 15:1 reduction=21.62mph
2nd gear: 7.875:1 reduction=41.18mph
I'm probably way off, in fact I am probably not even close...am I? I'm still using that "RC" speed calc...
8) Thud, I'd ideally like something like this for my 2nd gear. How did this work out for you with the BB's? If you can help me I'd be able to go with #35 on the 2nd gear side too, I think, ya'know..?
Late again...
Later,
Jay
Here is where I'm at now with sizes of all sprockets in the drawing are accurate for:
20.5" wheel, stock 80-100-130kv at 44.4volts with 5300rpm at the motor...
1st gear; 15:1 reduction=21.62mph
2nd gear: 7.875:1 reduction=41.18mph
I'm probably way off, in fact I am probably not even close...am I? I'm still using that "RC" speed calc...
8) Thud, I'd ideally like something like this for my 2nd gear. How did this work out for you with the BB's? If you can help me I'd be able to go with #35 on the 2nd gear side too, I think, ya'know..?
Late again...
Later,
Jay
Thud
1 MW
hello J,
The ball bearings are overkill. I ended up with a bronze bushing that is a straight press into a 5/8" bored sprocket.
I also enlogated the engdgment pockets for a little more room.(easyer engadgment)
my math on your gearing is:
corrected for actual KV133 low=24.6 mph
High=46.0 mph
The ball bearings are overkill. I ended up with a bronze bushing that is a straight press into a 5/8" bored sprocket.
I also enlogated the engdgment pockets for a little more room.(easyer engadgment)
my math on your gearing is:
corrected for actual KV133 low=24.6 mph
High=46.0 mph
