Toseven DM02 or Tongsheng TSDZ8?

[Atak_Snajpera]

Strange. From outside Germany looks like one of most liberal countries when it comes to e-bikes.

Laws and Regulations Regarding E-Bikes in Germany

Explore this guide to discover the essential E-Bike regulations in Germany, ensuring a safe and compliant ride with your electric bicycle.

www.lemmofuture.com

250W rated power motor can usually take 1000W power from controller, which is a LOT and to be honest more than enough for ordinary cyclist. If you want more power and more speed, you always have s-pedelec class. All those regulations seem pretty reasonable to me.

Yeah as LONG as your ebike has german Bosch or Brose motor then everything is fine.

 

[Az.]

Yeah as LONG as your ebike has german Bosch or Brose motor then everything is fine.

No... as long as your e-bike meets legal requirements all is fine. It doesn't have to be Bosch or Brose. There are quite a few other options available (including DIY).

 

[PM128]

Strange. From outside Germany looks like one of most liberal countries when it comes to e-bikes.

Buhahaa, especially when it comes to eBikes Germany enforces the restrictions most darely. While some people like wearing obligatory helmets, pay insurance premiums to greedy corporations and follow tons of other rules that "forbid this and that", I simply don't. But you may be right in that sense, that this "liberal country" promotes e.g. LGBTQ 'liberal' agenda to that extent that those who dare to disagree and don't follow the genderism rules are actually suppressed. What used to be good is not good any more. And likewise what used to be 'bad' is not bad any more. Like if the World would be turning around

 

[PM128]

If you want more power and more speed, you always have s-pedelec class. All those regulations seem pretty reasonable to me.

Well this "s-pedelec" class is still restricted to 45km/h and involves paying the insurance every year, license plate etc. I am not eager to pay those greedy insurance co's (which may be even behind those 'classifcations' anyway, not "safety") just because my ebike can go 26km/h or is equipped with a throttle and thus it is immediately classified as Kfz (Kraftfahrzeug /power vehicle) which will cost you €€€. And if the Polizei would set up a trap on bicycle roads and catch you riding 46km/h you are a criminal, pretty 'liberal' isn't it? Just compare it with some videos on YT where some vloggers from US/Canada chase through roads 65mph showing off their brand new super ebikes (electric motorcycles) and it seems to be pretty much 'legal' there. And of course the Stop signs on every intersection are there just to be ignored. I do not agree with such 'liberalism' regarding ebikes and how dangerously they ride in some videos but I admit I do envy them a little bit, at least in regard to market options and availability of imported ebikes from China.

 

[Az.]

Well this "s-pedelec" class is still restricted to 45km/h and involves paying the insurance every year, license plate etc.

Is 45km/h not fast enough for you?

I think you look at the glass and see it half empty and don't appreciate what we really have. E-bikes are really a motor vehicles, but still they are treated like normal bicycles.

If you want to ride fast, you must accept some responsibility like registration plates, insurance etc.

 

[Belfast_Blank_Bullitt]

DO NOT BUY TOSEVEN MOTORS ON PSWPOWER!
Reasons!
1) You get motor with outdated and buggy firmware!
2) You do not get programing cable to update to latest firmware. Difference between old and new firmware is like a night and day!

Always buy from official toseven's store on aliexpress

https://pl.aliexpress.com/store/1102731761/pages/all-items.html?spm=a2g0o.detail.1000061.2.18ce5cd3RiQah3&shop_sortType=bestmatch_sort

1) Motor will always have latest firmware
2) You always get programing cable!

This gentle man made the same mistake and bought DM01 from pswpower as well. Motor was shipped with terrible old firmware. Also he had to order a programming cable from toseven to perform an update.

Hi Atak,
yes your correct - confirmed with PSW. ordered a set from Aliexpsress....

 

[Atak_Snajpera]

Hi Atak,
thankfully im an electronics engineer with numerous debug and programming cables sitting around the lab, so i got off lightly...

I thought you were going to create your own programming cable? You suddenly gave up?

 

[Matze_Senpai]

so how can the tsdz8 be programmed? does tongsheng provide some computer program ? or is everything done on the display?

 

[Atak_Snajpera]

From what i know tongsheng only allows dealers to perfom an update.

 

[terragady]

There are files on Facebook group from to7 rep and video tutorial

 

[PM128]

Hi Atak,
yes your correct - confirmed with PSW. ordered a set from Aliexpsress....

What about price difference? Is it approx same? If I would buy the set of programming cables separately wouldn't PSWpower still be cheaper? To do the updates myself I think it's not a big deal but I need to count every €cent.

 

[stancecoke]

Has anyone stripped down and disassembled a TOseven DM01 & DM02???

See details about the torquesenor here:

Funktionsprinzip Drehmomentsensor im ToSeven DM02 Mittelmotor

Wieder ein Opfer für meinen Basteltrieb. :-) Als Bildergeschichte erzählt. Das Prinzip der Schrägverzahnung und der resultierenden Axialkräfte ist ähnlich wie beim Shengyi, die Auswertung aber wesentlich eleganter und dem ersten Augenschein nach auch deutlich robuster. Wenn man bei ToSeven das...

www.pedelecforum.de

regards
stancecoke

 

[Atak_Snajpera]

See details about the torquesenor here:

Funktionsprinzip Drehmomentsensor im ToSeven DM02 Mittelmotor

Wieder ein Opfer für meinen Basteltrieb. :-) Als Bildergeschichte erzählt. Das Prinzip der Schrägverzahnung und der resultierenden Axialkräfte ist ähnlich wie beim Shengyi, die Auswertung aber wesentlich eleganter und dem ersten Augenschein nach auch deutlich robuster. Wenn man bei ToSeven das...

www.pedelecforum.de

regards
stancecoke

Google translator can't translate text in those images. Comments should be in plain text.

 

[Atak_Snajpera]

What about price difference? Is it approx same? If I would buy the set of programming cables separately wouldn't PSWpower still be cheaper? To do the updates myself I think it's not a big deal but I need to count every €cent.

Dm02 350W costs ~420 euro from official source.

 

[stancecoke]

Google translator can't translate text in those images.

of course google translate can translate text in images

https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&op=images

But google seems not to know some technical expressions like Dehnungsmessstreifen = strain gauge.
regards
stancecoke

 

[Matze_Senpai]

right now im able to get tsdz8 for around 350€ on AliExpress. not sure where u can get dm02 in eu, im definitely not ordering from china.

 

[Az.]

right now im able to get tsdz8 for around 350€ on AliExpress. not sure where u can get dm02 in eu, im definitely not ordering from china.

275 on PSW

TSDZ8 tongsheng Mid Drive Motor Kit 750W 500W 250W electric bicycle Conversion Engine with torque sensor for ebike

TSDZ8 tongsheng Mid Drive Motor Kit 750W 500W 250W electric bicycle Conversion Engine with torque sensor for ebike

www.pswpower.com

 

[Zambam]

275 on PSW

TSDZ8 tongsheng Mid Drive Motor Kit 750W 500W 250W electric bicycle Conversion Engine with torque sensor for ebike

TSDZ8 tongsheng Mid Drive Motor Kit 750W 500W 250W electric bicycle Conversion Engine with torque sensor for ebike

www.pswpower.com

I see $290 (USA). Price just went up?

What about TSDZ2B $250 (USA)? TSDZ2B tongsheng 48V 500W 350W 15A tsdz2 electric bicycle mid motor with torque sensor throttle e-brake lever VLCD5 VLD6 XH18-LCD 850C

Is controller and display flashable to OSF? Which display is flashable?

 

[Az.]

I see $290 (USA). Price just went up?

Change to Euro. Shipped from Germany.

TSDZ2B is obsolete comparing to TSDZ8. I have both.

 

[Matze_Senpai]

i saw pswpower listing, price is good but 2 downsides: comes with that old ass vlcd5 Display, doesn't come with good battery connector (some seller on AliExpress have with xt60)

 

[PM128]

Unfortunately Aliexpress is obviously pressed by the fuk*ng German Regierung to block even listing of To7 motors and search comes blank (geo-restrictions). I however managed to get the Store link via the polish link here (thank you Atak) and used the "Contact seller". They replied that's because AE requested that for German customers but recommended to order directly from factory in China. Which btw. bares the import tax plus Mwst danger or rather almost certainty. PSW has DM02s out of stock right now, they probably sold whole stock very quickly. I truly hate living in this fakt up reg*me. Screw*ng up ordinary people living here but l+cking big brother's a$$ where people still enjoy much more freedom regarding e-bikes. Who wants to buy the overpriced crap from the local stores which start from 4000€ up but are still restricted to 25km/h and have no throttle? They are not even ashamed to put on display some Trabant mit Bosh whatever slow weak motor and ask 10k €€€€€ for it.

 

[Matze_Senpai]

i see this vendor Varstrom, on YouTube they take a look on tsdz8 motor and they sell through their website

TSE TONGSHENG TSDZ8 48V 750W Torque Sensing Mid Drive Motor Conversion

The TSDZ2B mid-drive motor offers several advantages over the Bafang BBS02 that appeal to electric bike enthusiasts seeking a more natural riding experience and customization options. One of the primary advantages is its torque sensing capability, which allows the motor to not only detect...

varstrom.com

their motor seems to cost 359€ and comes with good display ekd01 Bluetooth and xt60 battery connector. has anyone ever ordered from this website/seller? according to them they have multiple EU warehouse but i wanted to be 100% sure before placing an order

 

[Belfast_Blank_Bullitt]

I thought you were going to create your own programming cable? You suddenly gave up?

could do, but at £20 delivered, ive better things to do TBH!. i can give connection and PSU details after i get it..

 

[Atak_Snajpera]

of course google translate can translate text in images

https://translate.google.com/?sl=auto&tl=en&op=images

But google seems not to know some technical expressions like Dehnungsmessstreifen = strain gauge.
regards
stancecoke

How difficult would be a replacement of the torque sensor in DM02?

 

[PM128]

See details about the torquesenor here:

Funktionsprinzip Drehmomentsensor im ToSeven DM02 Mittelmotor

Wieder ein Opfer für meinen Basteltrieb. :-) Als Bildergeschichte erzählt. Das Prinzip der Schrägverzahnung und der resultierenden Axialkräfte ist ähnlich wie beim Shengyi, die Auswertung aber wesentlich eleganter und dem ersten Augenschein nach auch deutlich robuster. Wenn man bei ToSeven das...

www.pedelecforum.de

regards
stancecoke

Btw when you put the DMS and everything back nicely into the gearbox what grease did you use, or what grease would be recommended for inside that clutch/gearbox so that it wouldn't get on the DMS? Is it lithium grease?