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TSDZ2 OSF for all displays, VLCD5-VLCD6-XH18, LCD3, 860C-850C-SW102.
- Thread starter mbrusa
- Start date
Murat
New here
Hi, i have recently installed the osf for my 250w TSDZ2B with 36v 22.6Ah battery with DZ40 display. We were okey with the original osf but we did miss the power for when going up the under pass. And recently they made some changes to the road so we have traffic from left or right half way up the under pass both ways. This resulted in full stops a few times and while i could power trough my wife had more difficulty with it. So i found this thread and reading trough others experiences and some trial and error i have finally set in on eMTB. So from start we get great power and we dont even need to drop gear going up the under pass like we did with original osf. We seem to get less power after reaching 20kmh while the original osf did help up to 25kmh. Now i have set the speed to 27kmh. Btw this is for a cargo bike we take the kids to school with. I have installed a 38t because i wanted more torque then speed. The bike has 26inch tires and i have put this in the setting as well. I also have checked startup boost at 500-10. I only use highest assist level(lvl5) so i have set that to 250. So what could slow the motor after 20kmh? The original osf did push all the way to 25kmh so im thinking it does not hit 90rpm at 20kmh
To test the Bike menu, it's not necessary to reinstall the firmware.
However, it is necessary to do so to test the SOC voltage text formatting.
Here's the modified file.
Here are some clarifications regarding the Bike menu.
As previously described, the "Street Mode" menu has been removed and integrated into the "Bike" menu.
This is to keep all regulatory-sensitive parameters, password-protected, in a single menu.
Please note that when opening the menu, the Street Mode settings are always displayed; the Offroad Mode settings can only be viewed and modified after logging in with a password (if enabled) and setting "Edit Mode" to Offroad.
As in previous versions, those who don't need password access can disable it the first time they log in; however, to do so, they must now enter the default password.
Remember that if you choose to use password access, you must change it; after that, it will no longer be possible to disable it.
As previously described, the "Street Mode" menu has been removed and integrated into the "Bike" menu.
This is to keep all regulatory-sensitive parameters, password-protected, in a single menu.
Please note that when opening the menu, the Street Mode settings are always displayed; the Offroad Mode settings can only be viewed and modified after logging in with a password (if enabled) and setting "Edit Mode" to Offroad.
As in previous versions, those who don't need password access can disable it the first time they log in; however, to do so, they must now enter the default password.
Remember that if you choose to use password access, you must change it; after that, it will no longer be possible to disable it.
Murat
New here
Motor power max 500 and battery current 16. This was from the default_settings_TSDZ2_36V.ini
Yesterday i made the post on my phone and didnt have pics ready from the configurator so here they are.
And also thx for your work and the rest of the guys helping make this possible
From your configuration, I see you're using eMTB mode. It's the least suitable for road use. It doesn't use Startup Boost, and you need to push hard on the pedals to get power.
Use Power mode; it's definitely better.
Don't immediately set the Startup Boost settings to 500/10; it can stress the drivetrain if you push hard on the pedals. Try the default values of 300/20 and gradually increase them. 400/15 and 500/10 only if you're pushing lightly on the pedals.
Set the Power mode level parameters more gradually: 150, 250, 350, and 450.
As for speed, it depends on power.
You set the maximum power to 500W, but you probably won't reach it. Increase it only after checking the torque sensor values (offset and max) and activating calibration if necessary. The procedure is described in the manual.
Use Power mode; it's definitely better.
Don't immediately set the Startup Boost settings to 500/10; it can stress the drivetrain if you push hard on the pedals. Try the default values of 300/20 and gradually increase them. 400/15 and 500/10 only if you're pushing lightly on the pedals.
Set the Power mode level parameters more gradually: 150, 250, 350, and 450.
As for speed, it depends on power.
You set the maximum power to 500W, but you probably won't reach it. Increase it only after checking the torque sensor values (offset and max) and activating calibration if necessary. The procedure is described in the manual.
Murat
New here
Thank you for your reply. I had tried power mode with the settings you see previously. It gave less assist then original osf so after that i tried hybrid en torque but settled on eMTB. I will try the calibration but because im not native english speaker i have trouble understanding. Im going to try again with power mode and see if i can do something with the torque sensor.
Murat
New here
That could explain the power difference. Would it harm the motor if i set it at 650w in the configurator?
[edit]
so i just have changed the settings back to power mode. Did the calibration and i got the numbers 13 and 25 and my guess was its multiplied by 10 in the configurator so i have put 130 offset 250 max. Power is now 600w. After this i did a test ride and it barely gives any help its actually closer to no assist at this point. Im going to try set level 4 power to 500 and boost 400-15. If i dont get the result i will try hybrid.
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Yes indeed. I was confused by the Password Enable field that was saying 'no' while it was actually password protected. Now everything works.
One side note : with this update, most of the settings seem to be reverted to default (even odometer is reset).
The voltage is now properly displayed, but with SOC% there is a number displayed just right of the battery symbol.
Thank you mbrusa.
Strange, the previous settings should be retained, and the odometer doesn't reset even with "Reset to default."
Keep me updated if you notice any other oddities.
In fact, that's why I added a space, but it doesn't work with SW102.
In any case, with the modified file, the position of the SOC% text is the same as in version 5.1.
Almost no assistance at level 5?
Did you keep your foot on the pedal when you turned it on?
You should check the power you're getting.
To check, try these temporary settings:
Data 1 = 4 (motor power)
Time to display data 1 = 0 (no time)
Number of data displayed at lights on = 1
When the lights come on, the motor power will be displayed.
Check the value it reaches (multiply by 10).
Murat
New here
Yes almost not assist at lvl5 power 450 and i did keep my foot of pedal. The thing is after i set lvl5 power at 500 i feel the assist up to 22kmh and then it drops gradually. Not sure how a 50 increase makes that much difference. Is there a way to make the speed limiter just cut power the moment it hits set value(27kmh)? I will first check the motor power and come back to this.
so i have done light paddling and it assists easily to 20kmh. I see the power at startup reach 600W then gradually drop to 300W and when it reaches 20kmh it fluctuates between 100W-160W. If i paddle harder up to 25kmh i get at maximum 250W of assist then as i paddle lightly it drops to 100W-160W and speed drop as well. I seem to get most of the assist towards 20kmh. I think a steady 250W at 25kmh could make the ride easier. How can i achieve this. As im writing this im trying out settings as well. Thx in advance
another test done and i have figured out what it was. I have put the ADC range and ADC angle at max value 20. Now i get more power till 1kmh before speed limit. At lvl 5 and 4 I seem to get between 150-200 watt of power at light paddling. So i guess im hitting the limits. It does work great i can easily hold 25kmh and from level 3 and lower feels good as well. torque sensor settings seem to be very important here. I have done these test on 6th gear because we dont want to change gears too much to not stress the transmision. On the straight i did put it in 7th(highest gear) and the motor reaches then 200-250W. after that i came back and had accidently touched the motor when pulling the speedsensor out and it felt warm. This was only for a short bit but do you think riding at above 200W for a longer period could make the motor hot? Im only guessing but a 250w motor should handle 250W stress right? Im not a mechanic or electrician so i wouldnt know. Thank you for your help
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With 250W continuous power, the motor shouldn't overheat.
But it also depends on the cadence. With a high cadence, you're fine; by high, I mean 80 rpm.
Consider that with a high gear, for the same power and speed, the motor heats up more because you're pedaling at a lower cadence.
As for speed, with the limit set to 25 km/h, assistance begins to decrease at 23 km/h and stops at 27 km/h.
It can't be that there's no assistance at all with the level set to 450; there must have been some other reason.
One last thing: what display do you use?
I see you've set different models.
But it also depends on the cadence. With a high cadence, you're fine; by high, I mean 80 rpm.
Consider that with a high gear, for the same power and speed, the motor heats up more because you're pedaling at a lower cadence.
As for speed, with the limit set to 25 km/h, assistance begins to decrease at 23 km/h and stops at 27 km/h.
It can't be that there's no assistance at all with the level set to 450; there must have been some other reason.
One last thing: what display do you use?
I see you've set different models.
Murat
New here
I have the DZ40 mini display. So the ADC settings have fixed it for me. I now have great support even at lvl4 which is set at 320. Im going to adjust the settings anyway so i will check the rpm at 25kmh later today. I have a 38T chainring so it probably has higher rpm then regular chainring at 25kmh.
I've been using an older version of the OSF software and just upgraded to C.5 (yeah, I know it is no longer the newest version, but I got new 860cs and that is what they were flashed with). At the same time I changed from a 36v battery to a 48v battery. I spent a lot more time this go-round looking at and setting all of the parameters.
First query.... I seemed to have an issue with the 36v battery that at the end of the ride I didn't seem to get nearly as much assistance at the end of the ride when the voltage was obviously lower (30% left using Voltage SOC calculations -- I didn't know that much about setting up the parameters and the % left varied with current draw -- I never actually checked what the voltage was) but I thought the software handled that. The battery current values wouldn't go about 4 or 5 amps except momentarily at the end of a ride. They would go much higher than that at the start of the ride. Is that normal or did I have some setting wrong somewhere? My wife still has the 36v battery and is getting upgraded to the 860c from the vlc5 so even though it no longer matters to me I'd like to be set hers properly (or explain why that is just the way it is!).
Second point also has to do with voltage, now on my 48V battery 36v motor setup. I have tried every setting I can think of to get the battery resistance set so that there isn't much of a voltage drop under current draw. I've tried the auto compute resistance numerous times with a current draw of 10 or 11 and I on various runs I get numbers as low as 140, or 170, or 200 (ie, all over the place). I've plugged in numbers into the resistance field as low as 130 and as high as 240 and it really doesn't seem to matter much. There is always a drop of at least 1V and up to 2V under load. Frankly, most of the time it is just curiosity since I'm using the wh SOC, but I was trying to figure out my real battery capacity rather than using the V x A -10% calculation, which gave me 630wh. The wh used field said I had used 680wh when I hit 40v, but that was under load. As soon as I stopped pedaling it popped up to 42V. There probably isn't much left between 42V and 40V but it would be nice to be able to figure out the real amount (without damaging the battery!) and I was hoping that changing the resistance would give me a stable readout so that when the software was reading 40V while I was pedaling the battery was actually at 40V. Again showing my ignorance here, when the battery is close to being discharged does the battery voltage actually fluctuate like that and everything is working as it should?
Thanks for any help -- and as always for the great software!
First query.... I seemed to have an issue with the 36v battery that at the end of the ride I didn't seem to get nearly as much assistance at the end of the ride when the voltage was obviously lower (30% left using Voltage SOC calculations -- I didn't know that much about setting up the parameters and the % left varied with current draw -- I never actually checked what the voltage was) but I thought the software handled that. The battery current values wouldn't go about 4 or 5 amps except momentarily at the end of a ride. They would go much higher than that at the start of the ride. Is that normal or did I have some setting wrong somewhere? My wife still has the 36v battery and is getting upgraded to the 860c from the vlc5 so even though it no longer matters to me I'd like to be set hers properly (or explain why that is just the way it is!).
Second point also has to do with voltage, now on my 48V battery 36v motor setup. I have tried every setting I can think of to get the battery resistance set so that there isn't much of a voltage drop under current draw. I've tried the auto compute resistance numerous times with a current draw of 10 or 11 and I on various runs I get numbers as low as 140, or 170, or 200 (ie, all over the place). I've plugged in numbers into the resistance field as low as 130 and as high as 240 and it really doesn't seem to matter much. There is always a drop of at least 1V and up to 2V under load. Frankly, most of the time it is just curiosity since I'm using the wh SOC, but I was trying to figure out my real battery capacity rather than using the V x A -10% calculation, which gave me 630wh. The wh used field said I had used 680wh when I hit 40v, but that was under load. As soon as I stopped pedaling it popped up to 42V. There probably isn't much left between 42V and 40V but it would be nice to be able to figure out the real amount (without damaging the battery!) and I was hoping that changing the resistance would give me a stable readout so that when the software was reading 40V while I was pedaling the battery was actually at 40V. Again showing my ignorance here, when the battery is close to being discharged does the battery voltage actually fluctuate like that and everything is working as it should?
Thanks for any help -- and as always for the great software!
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The battery's actual voltage decreases as the current increases, up to 2-3 volts.
The value displayed on the 860C is filtered and compensated; it should be constant.
If it isn't, the battery resistance value is incorrect.
If the voltage decreases as the current increases, the resistance value should be increased; try increasing it gradually.
If the optimal resistance value is exceeded, you'll see the opposite effect; as the current increases, the voltage will also increase.
Note: The displayed voltage value is the no-load voltage; the actual voltage may be 2-3 volts lower.
Therefore, if you set the cut-off voltage to 40 volts (actual voltage), at high current you'll see a decrease in power, already between 42 and 43 volts (displayed voltage).
This is also the answer to the first question.
To calculate the SOC%, don't rely on volts; it's better to set it to auto.
The value displayed on the 860C is filtered and compensated; it should be constant.
If it isn't, the battery resistance value is incorrect.
If the voltage decreases as the current increases, the resistance value should be increased; try increasing it gradually.
If the optimal resistance value is exceeded, you'll see the opposite effect; as the current increases, the voltage will also increase.
Note: The displayed voltage value is the no-load voltage; the actual voltage may be 2-3 volts lower.
Therefore, if you set the cut-off voltage to 40 volts (actual voltage), at high current you'll see a decrease in power, already between 42 and 43 volts (displayed voltage).
This is also the answer to the first question.
To calculate the SOC%, don't rely on volts; it's better to set it to auto.
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Alternador
New here
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2022
- Messages
- 19
Hello
I'm testing OSF version 20.1.C5 update 2 with the SW102 display. It took me a while to understand the security menu, but I finally managed. However, even when I try to disable the passkey, I can't; it always says "Passkey is yes."
I'm also having a display problem with the battery SOC, with strange characters. I'll try your previous update to resolve the display issue.
The biggest problem is that I can't get the accelerator to work; I'm using a 1-to-2 cable. When I tried the new accelerator with a 1-to-2 cable, it didn't work. What's the problem?
Thanks emmmebrusa for your great work; I can help by testing configurations.
I'm testing OSF version 20.1.C5 update 2 with the SW102 display. It took me a while to understand the security menu, but I finally managed. However, even when I try to disable the passkey, I can't; it always says "Passkey is yes."
I'm also having a display problem with the battery SOC, with strange characters. I'll try your previous update to resolve the display issue.
The biggest problem is that I can't get the accelerator to work; I'm using a 1-to-2 cable. When I tried the new accelerator with a 1-to-2 cable, it didn't work. What's the problem?
Thanks emmmebrusa for your great work; I can help by testing configurations.
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Alternador
New here
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2022
- Messages
- 19
Edit: I've been testing with an 860C screen with Passkey disabled. When I power cycle the system, it keeps the throttle active according to the configuration. However, with SW102 and Passkey enabled, the throttle doesn't work. The throttle works if I enter with Passkey, edit Mode offroad and rewrite throttle active unconditionally. Is this behavior normal with Passkey active?Is this behavior normal with Passkey active?
I checked, and it works correctly with the 860C, both with the password enabled and disabled. In the Bike menu, there are no differences between the 860C and SW102.
The password is only used to access and modify parameters; it does not affect saving them.
The unconditional throttle setting should also be retained with SW102.
Could you see if anything changes by enabling the password on the 860C and disabling it on the SW102?
Regarding disabling the password, you can only do so the first time you log in by entering the default password.
If you have already entered a new password, it can no longer be disabled.
To do so, you must follow the procedure in the guide. Set Reset password to yes, turn off the display, and flash the firmware. When you turn it back on, the default password will be active, and all other parameters will be retained.
After logging in with the default password, you can disable it.
The password is only used to access and modify parameters; it does not affect saving them.
The unconditional throttle setting should also be retained with SW102.
Could you see if anything changes by enabling the password on the 860C and disabling it on the SW102?
Regarding disabling the password, you can only do so the first time you log in by entering the default password.
If you have already entered a new password, it can no longer be disabled.
To do so, you must follow the procedure in the guide. Set Reset password to yes, turn off the display, and flash the firmware. When you turn it back on, the default password will be active, and all other parameters will be retained.
After logging in with the default password, you can disable it.
Alternador
New here
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2022
- Messages
- 19
Hello, I performed tests with sw102 and the first firmware update; the battery symbol and percentage weren't displaying correctly. I re-flashed version 20.1c.5.2 on sw102 with the display improvement you provided, and the throttle issues disappeared. The display is now correct, and the passkey is disabled.
Él I tried using display 860c. I enabled Passkey and changed the password, and it allowed me to change parameters normally. Everything seemed correct, but when configuring other parameters, the display reset to default. The battery's SOC does not represent the level in either SW102 or 860C I'll charge the battery to 100% and try again.
Él I tried using display 860c. I enabled Passkey and changed the password, and it allowed me to change parameters normally. Everything seemed correct, but when configuring other parameters, the display reset to default. The battery's SOC does not represent the level in either SW102 or 860C I'll charge the battery to 100% and try again.
Disculpen mi inglés
Edit: By modifying some values, such as battery resistance, I've managed to get it to measure the battery correctly. With SW102, the second firmware update, and Passkey disabled, everything works correctly. I can re-flash the firmware for 860C and insist on the behavior when Passkey is active and I customize the password.
Él I tried using display 860c. I enabled Passkey and changed the password, and it allowed me to change parameters normally. Everything seemed correct, but when configuring other parameters, the display reset to default. The battery's SOC does not represent the level in either SW102 or 860C I'll charge the battery to 100% and try again.
Él I tried using display 860c. I enabled Passkey and changed the password, and it allowed me to change parameters normally. Everything seemed correct, but when configuring other parameters, the display reset to default. The battery's SOC does not represent the level in either SW102 or 860C I'll charge the battery to 100% and try again.
Disculpen mi inglés
Edit: By modifying some values, such as battery resistance, I've managed to get it to measure the battery correctly. With SW102, the second firmware update, and Passkey disabled, everything works correctly. I can re-flash the firmware for 860C and insist on the behavior when Passkey is active and I customize the password.
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mbrusa, thank you very much for your reply. Obviously I did not word the first part of my question well. As the 36v battery discharges from its initial value of 42v down to its cutoff at 30v, if it were going into a purely resistive load the current would decrease propotionally by Ohms Law. As power is I2R, power would decrease by the square of the current decrease so there would be a huge dropoff in power provided. The controller is active rather than a passive resistance. There is nothing the controller can do about the decrease in voltage, and thus the decreasing power (W = EI) due to that, but my question is what is going on with the current as the voltage decreases. If the amount of current that the motor controller is able to supply to the motor decreases proportionally to the voltage drop as if it were a resistive load, end of story. If not, I'm just wondering what happens. In a simple example, if the motor controller is able to provide 12A at the initial battery voltage of 42V, what kind of current would you expect the controller to be able to provide once the battery voltage drops to the low 30s? I'm certainly not looking for specific values, but can you give me an idea? Thanks much.
With regards to my second question, I might have figured it out. I bumped up the assistance to max (255) and using torque assist I was able to pull right around 10 amps. After 10 seconds or so I went into the menu and saw a value of 175 in the auto resist field. When I plugged that in to the resistance field I noticed that the voltage est value right above the auto resist on that menu page did indeed stay pretty much constant (up and down 0.1V) regardless of battery draw. I'm guessing that that is the voltage value I should have been paying attention to and the battery voltage field in display section (ie, the 4 values on each of 3 pages) is indeed the real battery voltage which *should* vary when current is drawn. Is this correct with regards to what I should be looking for and how I went about it? One other minor question -- is the setup of the proper resistance value just for information purposes like displaying SOC via voltage, or does it actually change the way the controller operates? Thanks again!
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Probably not an odditie and just the way things are on the SW102, but 'A/B used Wh' and 'A/B Wh/km' are not available on display. There is also a 'Threshold' field that is not documented on the manual.
Everything else seems to be running smoothly
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